Morelia Python Radio

Carpet python discussions

Episode # 237 Carpet python discussions in this episode Eric and Owen will be talking about how there snake breeding season is progressing. They will also be discussing the latest events in the world of Morelia.

Duration:: 2h 14m
Broadcast on:: 09 Mar 2016
Audio Format:: other

Hey, Chad Brown here. You may remember me as a linebacker in NFL or as a reptile breeder in the owner of Projekt. I've been hurtful since I was a boy and I've dedicated my life to the advanced in the industry and Educating the community about the importance of reptile. I also love to encourage the joy of breathing and keeping reptiles as a hobbyist Which is why my partner Robin and Markelon and I created the reptile report. The reptile report is our online news aggregation site Bringing you the most up-to-date discussions from the reptile world Visit the reptile report dot-com every day to stay on top of latest reptile news and information We encourage you to visit the site and submit your exciting reptile news photos and links We can feature outstanding breeders and hobbyists just like you the reptile report offers powerful brandy and marketing exposure for your business And the best part is it's free your buyer or breeder You got to check out the reptile report marketplace the marketplace is the reptile world's most complete buying and selling Explanation full of features to help put you in touch with a perfect deal find exactly what you're looking for with our advanced search system Search by sex wait more other keywords and use our buyer now options to buy that animal right now Go to marketplace dot the reptile report dot-com and register your account for free Be sure to link your marketplace account to your ship your reptiles account to earn free tokens With each shipping label you book use the marketplace to sell your animals and supplies and maximize your exposure with a platinum Act also gets fed to the reptile report and our powerful marketplace Facebook page Byron and selling you ship the reptiles dot-com Take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rate ship your reptiles dot-com can also supply you with the materials Needed to safely ship your animal successfully use ship your reptiles dot-com to take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rates The materials need to ship the reptiles successfully live customer support in our live on time arrival insurance program We got you covered visit the reptile report dot-com to learn or share about the animals Click on the link to the marketplace find that perfect pet or breeder then visit ship reptiles dot-com the ship at animal anywhere in the United States We are your one-stop shop for everything reptile related You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You [Music] Welcome to Moralia by John Radio with your host Eric Berg and Owen McIntyre. [Music] Good evening everybody, welcome to the episode of Moralia by John Radio. We were having some horrible technical difficulties. Thank God. [Laughs] But for some reason, yeah, blocked off wasn't working. But no fears because we are, we've got to go and then we're ready to go. So tonight's episode we're going to be doing our continued series with carpet plays on discussions. Some of the hot topics and you know things we just see float around or things that apply to our collections and what's going on and some of the buses and minuses as you would say. So what's going on? Owen has life over at Rogue Reptile. [Laughs] Life is life. We're waiting for, I think, my caramel girl. I mean, I think she's going to drop any day now but she keeps like tearing apart her cage, she floods it, she moves all the paper around, she just is so freaking uncomfortable, it's ridiculous. I've caught her basket and belly up like four times. So we've got to be close on that one. And everything else we're just kind of waiting to see what happens. I'm still getting locks, so. Still getting locks? Still getting locks and it's not from the bread line. They're like staring at each other like we don't know what to do. It's like costals and things that are like still breathing. And I'm like well what the hell are the breadles going to breathe? Am I going to get like bread legs in October? So it's right now we're just kind of seeing what happens. You know? Wow. Which I love it because I have five eggs in the incubator and then my five little eggs and I keep looking at them and then I keep looking at like my caramel basket belly up. I'm like we're about to jump from like five to 40 like eggs and it's going to be like oh shit. So yeah we're just kind of waiting. So. Okay. We're things with you. I mean like I saw you post up several coiled around little balls of eggs. So. Alright so you want the good news or the bad news first? Which one? I want the bad news first because we're going to end on a happy note goddamnit. Okay. Alright well the bad news first. Very good. So you know everybody's heard me talk about multiple times on the show about that M Pen coastal that I was super excited about. And yeah you know thought life was going to be good. Well. That was kind of a kind of a bummer of a clutch. No. No. Yeah so she lays on Thursday of last and I come in and I sort of notice that she seems to be maybe in the middle of laying. I've never caught an animal in the middle of laying. I've always sort of walked in and you know it was kind of like I don't know. She was you know it was like you want there's like it. So those who bred carpets kind of know like when you walk in you see the female perfectly beehived around the clutch. There's just a certain look like her head is perfectly you know they're there. Like you know even if even if they're underneath a bunch of paper that the way the paper is shaped you're like she's under there hiding something. So you know. She's got eggs for sure. Yeah. So I contacted I contacted you that night. But you were I think headed out of town. Oh no you were going to be headed out of town. So you know I asked you if you thought that was normal you know and Matt said that his girls kind of went maybe a few days before he would be in a panic. You were telling me get them out right away. Yeah I would tell it yeah. Matt's like give it a week I'm like panic now and then worry about it later. So it's like yeah it's one of those you know I've been in the situation where it's like they laid a bunch of eggs and I've palpated eggs out of females and you know what my my favorite thing to do now is if she's got some retained eggs take her and get the damn shot up a toast and like my vet like won't even I he gave a shot to my jungle female last year like in the waiting area. He just walked out just shot her up and then he's like are you good. I paid for the shot and then we left I mean you know it wasn't like one of those. When we come back we're going to make sure that these are actually eggs in here. It's like oh yeah right we'll give it a toast and then let him in a day or two out of the toast. And we got to start thinking about other things. So my jungle female laid the rest of the clutch in the car on the way home back from the vet. So yeah I want to get a little bit about some of your details with that kind of stuff but I'll finish finish my story and then you can tell us good you can tell us about that because I always reminded about that because well I was reminded about that. I'll tell you how the story progresses. So I figured you know it's kind of maybe met her in the middle maybe she's taken a break. I don't know if they take a break or they don't take a break. I'd imagine that you do I you know I would imagine that depending on the size of the clutch. Yeah they do if it's five eggs they're probably going to do it all in one sitting but if it's like 30 something maybe they'll take a break halfway through it's hiring work on both. I'm sure it is you know. So I kind of like I talked her in and I figured you know I'll check her on in the morning and that'll be that and we'll go from there. So the next morning I come in and she's kind of like tighter around the clutch but I can tell that you know she sort of has some it looks like there's an egg right at the vent. So I figure let me go to work. I'll come back. Let's see if anything has progressed and if nothing has progressed then I'm going to have to take action. So I came back and now this is Friday. Now I know that you were gone because I had a message you know in our group message and there was no response. So in a panic I call Rob Stone and you know like Rob have you ever done this before what do I do? Because I pull the female out and she has quite a number of eggs. Yeah did you palpate those? You palpated eggs out of a female or did you have me do it? No I had you do it which is why I kind of was like I didn't know if I started at the back of her. Like from where the last egg I see towards you know going towards her head. Or if I start with the egg that's right at her vent. You know I figure I don't want to do I'm figuring like if I do one or the other and I push the eggs back up or further up. You know what I mean? So I'm kind of like I don't know. So he walks me through it and you know he's sort of like you know start with that egg there. And when I was trying to do it at first I wasn't really applying that much pressure I guess and not enough pressure. Because you don't want to like you don't want to squeeze it like a stupid toothpaste but you don't want to you have to get it out. Yeah so you know I really started like I mean I'm thinking like in my head stupidly I'm thinking it's like a chicken egg or something. And if I squeeze it too hard it's gonna just explode inside of her or whatever. You know what I mean? Like I don't know I'm just I'm in a total panic is what it is. You kind of forget how the shell I mean you kind of forget how the shell of a reptile egg works. It's not it's not really fragile and brittle. So yeah yeah but you're like thinking because you've never used to explode. You're like you know I'm like oh my god what am I what am I going to do blah blah blah blah. So I start I start pushing I push I give it a really really good squeeze and you know I see the vent start to open up. So now I'm feeling I'm feeling pretty confident that I can get that egg out. So I push the egg I get the egg out and just for details I mean there was a little bit of blood on it you know and I was kind of panicking a little bit but you know I sent Rob a picture he said that was kind of normal you know the tearing or whatever you know. So I remember when it happened to me before and you had helped me that you know we were worried that the the over duck was wrapped around the egg or something that would yeah whatever. Yeah because those were like when when we when we did it the last time with your over duck with the egg came out and I'm like whoa. So I think in front of you as I you know put your snake back together. So it's like Eric don't look at this. So you know yeah things. Yeah so so you know I now see that there's a couple more eggs. The next one I palpated out was actually was a few slugs. So I got them out and then behind that as I'm trying to push the furthest one that was you know the furthest one up the towards going towards our head. You know then of course a whole bunch of shit comes out which was you know that was fun. And then finally I got the last egg out. And surprisingly I thought that maybe the eggs you know would have been okay not really sure whether they would or they wouldn't. Because they looked like they were fertile. They didn't look like they were slugs. Don't really know why they got stuck. I mean they weren't any bigger than the eggs that were that she did lay. You know I don't know it's it's one of those things. Well put them in the incubator but daddy ended up going bad. So I have three eggs in the clutch you know that's better in the incubator. So you know after that kind of well first of all I was just my main thing was just making sure that that girl was okay. You know I just wanted her to be okay and you know I'm sending pictures to you know looking at her and sending pictures to Rob. And you know he says this looks pretty normal and see if she eats you know give her a small meal. You know she looked like she was okay. She's very active. It's very difficult to palpate a bunch of eggs out of a snake when she doesn't want to stay still and you're by yourself. It's not a it's not an easy thing. You know I don't know do you run to the vet and those experiences I mean I don't really know. I don't know if I did the right thing or I didn't. But you know you have a limited amount of time before you know those hormones shut down and basically you can't get the eggs out. And that's when you run into you know surgeries and stuff like that. So luckily I didn't run into any of that kind of kind of problems. She seems to be settled in. She took a meal you know so she seems to be okay. Which you know of course I'm racking my brain saying what a loser. I can't believe that you know like what a shitty clutch. You know not realizing that yeah this stuff does happen but you know it just goes to my point that I say a lot of times. Like you really we think we have these animals figured out. I don't know if it was the weather you know it seems like the weather is really throwing shit for a loop this year. With a lot of people especially that are local to us. So you know that was kind of my weekend. So I was really bummed about that clutch because you know I've been waiting forever to breathe that girl. And you know finally you know a couple years apart not wanting to go. She's finally going to go you know blah blah blah. So then the other day I come home and sure enough there's my citrus tiger girl and she was the one that was bred with the albino girl. I mean the albino boy. You somehow got a citrus tiger girl to breed with an albino girl. And you're worried about the one bad dude you managed to get two females to breed I mean so far you're amazing. I'm doing pretty good but I got 17 eggs out of that clutch. 17. And this was the girl that laid one egg. You know what I mean? She was the one egg girl. 16 more. I got to improve it. Yeah and the clutch was perfect. So you know that was a good thing to have after such a defeat. I mean what causes that? What's your thought? I mean what do you think? What is the reasons of why is it just a fluke? Is it something you know I don't know do you have any thoughts? Like why should this happen all the time? And I don't see it happen to a lot of people unless they don't talk about it. But I feel that you have to share the good with the bad because I don't think that you know people have this idea that in the herb world that like you know these people that are professional breeders and have been doing it for a long time they're like magical and stuff like that. You know what I mean? Like they never have anything to happen and everything is always good. Yeah. No no no no. Everyone has the same problems just like how everyone has had an interaction with mites. No one likes to admit it. No one ever says it. And if you're the person who's standing at a reptile show on top of a table screaming that you've never had mites before you have mites right now. I mean that's how that works is you know everybody knows nobody talks about it. Just like how everybody the majority of people have had respiratory infections. The majority of people have had you know babies drown in the egg or hash from the egg get into the substrate and drown there. We've all had that one baby that never really gets going eats and dies. I mean this is just kind of how it goes. We've all had a stapes. We've all had that one time where I or you or somebody opens the door to the snake room and there's a snake sitting in the middle of the floor like oh hi I'm not where I'm supposed to be. So it's like sickness is all right and things like that happen. And in your case with like the egg stuff their attention. However I had my thermal female that overshot her pre her her late date by like 15 days. It's like it's getting a little freaking ridiculous. So how many days and I'm sorry I thought it was it was because you think she shed and I marked it all down and then like a month after when she was supposed to lay she was when I took it to the vet and she actually got the shot and laid the eggs. Yeah. So wow. It was like 33. Yeah that was the one that I was curious about as far as isn't that the one that you took to the vet that you know they gave it the shot. I think he laid the clutch and the clutch all hatched. I've taken two females to get the toast and shots. One was Venus and it was her first clutch and she wouldn't freaking lay him. She just wouldn't lay them and I wrote down the timing of the pre lay and I don't know like sometimes I imagine this stuff gets you know wonky where like oh it sheds and then it'll lay like I've had females lay and I've never seen a pre lay shed. Or in Venus's case I had a snake lay way after when it should have laid so I was worried about her and I did everything to like I put her in a cage. I put mulch in the cage. I put mulch and moss in the cage. I did everything I was supposed to. We took her to the vet. The vet did ultrasound and he goes yes they're all in there. I'm like okay so we gave her the shot of the toast and then this is he said he uses it a lot for birds because apparently egg binding in birds is like so common it's ridiculous. So really really just got I took her home apparently like you know with macaws and things like that and you know you imagine having a high symptom of a call which is like this really expensive bird and she dies or has to get spayed because his egg bound I mean that would kind of suck if I was trying to do that breeding wise. But anyway doctor Adam Danish who you know everybody in the Philadelphia area who cares about the reptiles too. Gave her the shot and he's like alright 24 hours if you don't see eggs bring her back who may have to do you know we have to spare and go get the eggs. And this is you know Venus' first year of caramels and this is a caramel tiger clutch. I didn't get to play around with super caramels and I'm like holy crap this female that I like based all my breeding projects on is going to be spayed and be a very fancy pet and I'm going to kill myself. You're ready for it and then the next morning I'm getting ready to go to the next morning get ready for work and there they are all of them. She has half of them coiled the rest are everywhere in the mulch and I pulled her off, took all the eggs, threw them all in the incubator, threw her back in the cage and went to work. All the eggs hatched and it was a normal incubation period. It wasn't like super short or anything like that because it took so long for them to be laid but normal incubation every baby hatched all good. The second one was last year, I know right? You never get a normal year like if you read a textbook year of breeding that's like the fantasy like you hope for it. It never happens. Nothing normal happens with snake breeding but so the second year was actually last year I had my female gypsy jungle. She was bred to zebra male and she looked huge and she's sitting there and she passes the biggest slug I have ever seen. It looked like a blackhead egg like it was huge and I'm like shit so she did that and then I started palpating her and I felt another giant huge slug. And she couldn't really get it out so I took her to the vet. They did the sonogram again where they all show her how you want to call it and gave her another shot at Potosin. On the way home from the vet she's in a box with like the towels and stuff. I'm stopped at a red light and I just kind of look at her. She passed the giant ass slug like it just came out but on its way out it gets a rupture because there was the innards of the thing were all over the place. And then after the big slug came there were like six or seven smaller slugs. They just kind of poured out so that was her whole trip with that stuff. And I remember thinking about how the vet was talking about maybe draining the big slug because that's what it was so blocking everything else. But yeah those are the only two times we've done Potosin and that's worked out. I mean I had my tannabar scrub since we're talking about the bad side. The tannabar scrub laid six slugs this weekend. The first of which I found on I think it was Friday or Saturday I was talking to you guys and I found it. I was just cleaning. I pulled them out. Yeah I pulled them out and I pulled the paper out and I heard the slugs hit the floor and I'm like oh shit. So then you start rooting around and then I see her and she had a couple left in her and by the end of the day she passed the rest of them but it was just like oh damn it. So got a couple of gloves out of her. So now that you have slugs I mean at least now you know that she opulated and you I mean does that. Well I guess that doesn't step in the right direction but it's the direction that sometimes doesn't pan out. You remember my first clutch of mackerelts vithons. That was sickening blood. And then she died that summer because of complications like I don't think she ever fully recovered. I mean she really ate sparingly and then she just ended up kicking it in the summertime style of blue. So sometimes plugs are not everything they're cracked up to be but it is a step in the right direction. Yes she ovulated but now where the eggs not fertilized because the male didn't want anything to do with her. Or is it her problem? It's a step in the right direction but it is we're not done yet. We're still waiting. Right. I mean it's better than getting enough. That is true. Yeah but you're almost like. If I got nothing that would be like all right well next year but now it's a guy damn it. So close it's like you know. It's like you would think with the postal clutch it's like wouldn't you almost have much rather preferred just not have anything. Yeah you know I guess from the female's perspective I mean she's like wasted all that energy and you know to get slugs just seems like. And you're breathing away from the sand. Yeah but you know I guess on the other side of it when you're breathing a species like Titan bar pythons which are very hard to breathe in captivity. You know and that would make me feel like that maybe I'm on the right direction. So now what do you do in that circumstance you bail on the project or do you stay with it? You set them on fire. What I did is I owe. You said everything on fire. Everything on fire. Everything on fire. The coalings yeah. You're looking at coalings on like with fire and that's all I said to you. So it's like oh. Which by the way the tannabars yes. Yeah I was going to say which by the way for an extra dollar you could probably get a pure bread bones. It's like where does that rice come from? You know it's like that is five hundred dollars a year ago and now you know now all of a sudden it's jacked up to two thousand bucks. Do I want a carpet bowling fight cause it's big. Maybe it's a bowling fight on. It's really really big. Yeah. What I want to dumb do I want to water down version of a car of a bowling fight on. I just wanted to get the tambolins fight on it's like yeah. But that I think is like oh but look it's eleven feet long. Everybody wants it. No no no one does. But back to the tannabars I mean it's almost like I don't like to quit on projects until I absolutely have to. Like if I get a bunch of slugs I'm sure we're trying again next year. Cause you're right it is like okay step in the right direction we're doing something. We're going to try again next year. And then say next year we get more slugs are we're going to keep trying or we get like two or three good eggs. Alright keep trying keep trying. You know if the only time I would ever bail on a project if like you know. The female becomes egg bound and we got to put her down. It's like well shit. And then I got this boy that's just sitting there. And even then even then I probably won't bail on a project. I'll probably do something stupid like alright. We're going to buy four girls this way we don't lose any. So it's like this way we can die we got three others. And then later when I'm sitting you're going why do I have like eight gold face white lips. It's like you know then I have to figure out what the hell I've done. So it's like right now do you know I have five gold face white lips. I didn't do so I counted. So I don't either. It's. Yeah there you go. I have I have a small captive brick trio and then I have two chinaormous adults. Because I got the adults because someone said they were six feet long. Guess what? They ain't six feet long. I was like to. So back to having monstrous gold face white lips that I wanted more. So it's just like so again I won't give up on a project. So actually we have to. And even then it's difficult to show something you really really want. Like I want Mackalas place on I really do and I will get them. Goddamn it. It may take me several years and I also want black face white lips. And other animals. Do we even have gotten to. Can you imagine what I'm going to be like when the rough scales are old enough. God. So that's going to be rough. Think about that. Yeah. It's going to be a terrible season. Hard season. Don't you hurt each other. I'm watching. Just like you know. Why do the rough scales breathe. Well they got really really weirded out by Owen watching them constantly. So. Yeah. So yeah. I mean I have another clutch for myself that's any day now. The albino, the off the watch. Yeah. Right. And that was pretty neat. Or do you have. There is one more I have. So what I did this year was. I. I've read a. I've read the albino to a citrus tiger. And then I've read the albino to the Ted Thompson tiger. Which is basically a high contrast. Queensland tiger. So that if people wanted to buy pears because I'm assuming that they will of that project. I can offer out cross. You know. Cares. You know. I was also curious to see how. I'm just going to comment. Rowing. I'm just throwing that out there. All y'all were listening. Behind me in line. I get first pick out of everything. Because I am the co host. So. Everybody here can just shut up and get back in line. So. You know. Ted Thompson. I don't care if one of them is right. So. Yeah. Go on. Yeah. So. You know. Again. I mean. Well. That Ted Thompson tiger gave me a big huge clutch too. So. I'm hoping that she repeats. She was pretty full. And. You know. I'm curious to see the striping as well. So. She is actually a little. She's better. Striped. Then. Then. You know. The. The. Citrus tiger. But the Citrus tiger definitely better color. But. Again. I still think the end result is going to be really, really nice. High contrast. Tigers. So. Oh. Well. Yeah. I did it. Oh. I did it a lot for myself. You know. Again. For. Outcrossing purposes. You know. Especially when it comes to. You know. Recessive jeans and such. And. I mean. It's not like. So. Same. But. At least. You know. It's somewhat. Somewhat. Outcross. So. You know. Some people just want the Citrus. Some people want outcross. You know. That'll. That'll give me more of an idea of what. You know. That girl throws. Because. Man. For as old as she is. She's a 2009. She's. You know. Got. Off. Color man. She's just a beautiful snake. She's probably one of my favorites. I love that snake. You know. You know. She's produced. Landier. She was bred. What's that? I mean. I mean. It's weird that we're like. You know. We're getting ready to roll on eggs. And. Like I said earlier. Still getting locks. So. Yeah. I kind of. I kind of. You know. I had some females that were on the fence. I just kind of stopped trying. More or less. You know. Maybe that's good. Maybe that's bad. But. I don't know. You got your clutches. Yeah. I'm really trying to get the alpino into a bunch of stuff because I really think when it comes to. You know. The actual morph. You know. Look. The thing that gets everybody's attention time and time again at the alpino. So if you can get an alpino. It creates a pattern. Stuff like that. Or maybe. Selectively bred. Contrast. And stuff. You know. I mean. I think that. I mean. Now. I mean. Like curtain going to tackle you and take. Like if you produce. An ocelot. A really good looking ocelot. Jack head albino. Like it's like curtain just going to like appear at your house and like take it. I mean like is that how that's going to work. I mean. Well from what I understand from Mike he's not really a fan of alpino stuff. You know. So. Can you. I know. Alpino. It's going to be sick. I think that people don't understand the potential. It's going to be nuts. When that hatches out and is like an adult. It's going to be like what the hell is that. You know. So. Why the yellow bird my eyes is like. Yes. Here's. Here's something. Think of bills. Yes. Crazy. Ocelot zebra jack. You know what I mean. Yeah. Think of all those colors that are intact. Yeah. Saddle and all that. Now think of it as an alpine. That'd be great. With white on it. Oh my God. You know. You know what. To do is take his handful and like attack it with a can of spray paint. This way we can know kind of what it's going to look like. So. Yeah. So. So. So. Yeah. I got that clutch. Let's see what happens with that. I'm curious to see if they pop out ocelot. You know. I know. Darwin has never been. Into that. That neck. So. Well do you remember. What was the clutch that Mike actually brought the car professors. Last year. That high expression. Ocelot. Like. Even the non. Ocelot. Yeah. Even the non. Look. Freaky. Crazy. Kind of. Awesome. I was insane. That clutch was insane. So. Yeah. I don't know. Should be cool. Very cool to. Very interested to see. Out goes. And also because my ocelot jag is from Paul. So. I'm. Mike. So. Although. Believe it's the same thing from the same line. But you know we'll see. See what happens. So. Should be cool. So. Yeah. So. Good. Next year. Yeah. Well I mean like I said I kind of backed off. You know. You know. I'm a slow grower. I'm a slow. Slow. Raising. Animals up. We'll get into that later. Type of thing. And. You know. I just. I'm not in any rush. What the hell is that. Are you honking at somebody or something. No I'm not. We weren't able to get prepared. My phone's not hung. I need to turn my phone off of vibrate. People were. Did you. Can you talk. Damn it. I can't. Anyway. Keep it in my ear. No. Well you know this. We don't turn off shit in the pings. All right. How can what I do. Show and talk about it. Exactly. Anyway. Yeah. Next year I'm hoping you know. I'm hoping we have a better. We have no El Nino and. You know. No. Stop it. You know. Please. Please stop the weather. Just make it normal. Please. So. Yeah. It's just. It's one of those things. I mean like. I'm staring down. The caramel clutch which is caramel to caramel jag. That's any day now. The high con tiger or the red tiger. They're breeding like crazy. The caramel jag to the caramel tiger. We're breeding with the kind of stop. The olive pythons. I don't know what they're doing. They're kind of just like. We'll cuddle now. No breeding. The red jag to my high con female. They're breeding like crazy. God. What else is the granite and the high con jag. Aren't breeding. But I'm going to tag him out and put the tiger in there. Because the tiger apparently will breed with a piece of rope. And the. God. I think we're staring down like. And that's not even talking about animals that aren't here. So the the brettles are still kind of breeding. And then we have the. What the hell. You have the ivory jag that I'm pretty sure is a boy. I think we determined that this year. And a friend of mine has my jungles. My jungles. That was so disappointing. No, it wasn't fun. It was so disappointing. We haven't talked about that since it happened. Because I'm that serious about it. Because now what you're telling me is I have a male mut jag in my collection. Why are you here? So I'm going to do a fat thing. Yeah. Shit. And like, you know, you have that one which shows a bust. But my granite. I.J. is down with Jason bailin and Jason just dropped off this giant red tiger. This is breeding the hell out of my coastal female. So it's like it. In come July, am I going to be like staring down the barrel of like more pregnant females and totally losing my mind? Probably. Yeah. And then we were talking about the damn blood place on it. Masters, grab it. But I don't even want to touch those. I'm just going to leave them all as mad. I don't know what the hell I'm doing. No, you have to go and sex them, my friend. No, I don't want to do it. No. You're closer. I'll send you. Hell, I have to get all my bad habits. Hey, I'm Amazon. The guy named Amazon Trebo, I had like a pre-lay shit the other day. So it's like I could have a bunch of those people things. It's like, you know, I may or may not have totally screwed myself. I'm glad I have a hundred-something baby cages. So I may be using all of them. Wow. Yeah, let's see. I don't know, man. That's a lot. I know. But, you know, that's how it goes. Yeah, so I don't know. We'll see how the rest of the season plays out. I'm pretty excited about the stuff that I got going on. Nothing crazy. You know, like I said, I slow grow, man. You know, you have to comment like that. Oh, I'm like, yeah. Oh, I'm like far more ahead of you. I'm like, I don't like up there. And Nick, everybody's like, God, Mike Smaller. I'm like, well, steady diet of rattle. Do that, do you? And then Nick's like, well, mine are a bunch more orange. Also, they're way to hell. Smaller. I'm like, oh, yeah. Um, well, whoops. So, you know, yeah, there is right now. There was a show and they had a show, Herp Nation radio. And they had him and Vin Russo on. And, you know, like a lot of my thinking as far as, you know, cycle feeding and that kind of thing comes from listening to Vin Russo talk about how he deals with his boas and, you know, his chondros and such. So, you know, I've kind of adapted that into my fold. Oddly enough, the girl that gave me 17 eggs was pretty much on that program. And the girl that gave me all the bugs and the egg bounds. So, I don't know, coincidence. Let's see. The Ocelot Jag was also on that program. So, we'll see. Again, my females are maybe, maybe four, five feet, maybe, you know, tops. So, anyway, I saw that. Holy shit. You know, I was talking to somebody and I was telling them, I was like, every time I go to Owens, I feel like it's such a neglectful snake keeper because I feel like, you know, I'm like not taking care of my snakes the way they should be because they're not the size they're supposed to be. And, you know, I see, because I don't really interact with any other carpet place on breeders where I actually see their collections and see it grow. You know what I mean? So, like, I see it when it's a baby and then I come back like a couple months later and this thing is like as big as some of these, like, three-year-olds. And I'm like, what? Wait a minute. Well, you know. What was the, like, you and I both had a high con from the same collection. You're like, where's my girl's, like, sister? I'm like, that one. You're like, Jesus Christ. I'm like, well, yeah, it's on medium red. You're like, mine's on small mice. I'm like, oh, I am. Well, this is awkward. So, it's like, yeah. That happens. Yeah. So. Yeah, and it's, it's, it's, you know, like we always say, there's so many ways to do this. It's interesting that, you know, you do it one way and you have success. And I do it one way. And I have success as well. So, you know, I just, I wonder, you know, there was an interesting thread that came up on one of the Facebook pages and they were talking about carpet pipes on the head. When it comes to the head, that's, that's something that I use as a judgment to see if the female is mature. You know, because, like, usually, you know, when you see carpet pipes, I'm going to have that massive head. I don't know. You could have it. I've seen, I've seen animals, like my banana girl, for instance. She, she has a small fat one. What? She has a smaller head? She has a female fat one. Yeah. She, she kind of has a smaller head. And it's like, you know, she hasn't bred yet, but she's, she could definitely have a clutch, but it makes me think like that hammering them with rats or hammering them with, you know, whatever hasn't worked for me. So, that's not how I do it. And she still hasn't bred, but, you know, I, I just see that big, huge head and, you know, it has to do with maturity and the animals living into twenty-five years, you know. Yeah. So, I don't know. Well, years, just look at it as like ten years in itself. I mean, you're good. I mean, and it really does. I mean, like, you can have, and that's why, you know, I'll feed. And, you know, obviously, I feed differently than you. I'm not the kind of guy who, like, will feed two, three times a week because that's just to show us, but it's, and it's one of those things where, you know, certain females I'm going to have to put the food to, like, the red tiger female this year. She had eighteen eggs last year and she had five this year. So, am I probably going to pay a little bit more attention to her over the summer? You're damn right I am, because I want to get her back up the size and I'll probably give her the year off. But, you know, I've had, I've seen animals that are not mature but are huge. So, you know, like, they're fat or very large in the body, but the head is kind of smaller. It's in shape right because the head's still growing to match the body. So, it's almost like I've seen that and it's like, you're not ready yet. So, I would definitely say, you know, the head is what twos you into the animal being ready. They had that big, mature muscle behind the head. They had the nice, defined snout and then you're like, "Yeah, you look like an adult carpet python." And the eyes actually match the head shape for once in their tiny little lives. You know, it's like when baby carpets are born, they're nothing but eyeballs. It's like they have to grow into them and then it finally fits. And some animals just don't breathe. Like, I have that one coastal female that I'll put in every single proven male I have and she won't do anything with them. Nothing. This is a third year in a row. I got nothing from her. Yeah. And then, you know, I have my other coastal females that go like clockwork. See, where I think I'm going to end up having a crazy year is because if you remember last year, my biggest females didn't breathe. So, you know, I didn't have those 30 egg clutches. And you think that has to do with your move or you think that has to do with something else? I think it has to do with the move one because when we moved in December, that was kind of like prime time, that seems to be when Venus, my caramel female, breathed. Because the caramel jagged male was in with her around December and they were breathing like crazy. And now, of course, we're going to end up having the eggs, you know, beginning of March. So, that's kind of where she does it. So, by moving into December, we're going to throw her all off. Where Trinity went wrong is I didn't have a male for her. So, you know, she just never bred with, I had one male I was trying to breed her with, but he was kind of on the smaller side. So, she went on to do with him. That's kind of where we went that way. And then with some of the other females, I, like the high con female, I still was under the impression that was a boy. So, the reason it didn't breed is because I put it in with a girl and it's also a girl. So, those will never get you eggs. So, I corrected this problem though. Okay, cool. So, we can talk about, there's two things that are quite controversial, I guess, that we could talk about. One would be, we could talk a little bit about, do you want to go with topic two? Choose. Wait, wait, wait a minute, there were, but there were a bunch of numbers in between two and six. I'm confused. All right, well, whatever. Go with topic six. Six. Okay. So, today on the Moralia Pick of the Week, they were wearing a post. I was hoping this was it. Yeah. And on that post, I talk about the red jungle morph. And we started that. Well, yeah, Wilbert has three jungle carpets. Three of them, yeah. That he's calling a new morph. And he basically put the project up for 17,500 bucks. He was claiming that this jungle is basically the one that he put up, which I don't know, there was a lot of people in there that were eight men said that they didn't like it and didn't do nothing for them. I think it's pretty cool with the snake, man. I did say it. Yeah, I mean, that's cool. And I don't know. And a lot of people tend to forget, like, I didn't realize that a lot of people either don't know the origin of the founder animal or completely forgot or don't care. It's like, because a bunch of people were screaming diamond hybrid or this side of the other thing. And it's just kind of really weird. I saw the founder animal as the baby at the hamburger show where Wilbert bought it. So, yeah, so Wilbert-- It was kind of weird. Yeah, Wilbert bought it from Jason. And Jason was saying that the pairing was from a leery, a Naomi male jungle bred to an undocumented jungle-type animal. A couple of the offspring came out red and Wilbert won a hamburger. Jason didn't really know what happened to the rest of them. And he didn't plan on really doing that pairing again. So he never can't catch on any of the offspring and where they went. Crazy thing is that Wil, I guess, took that male. I guess it was a male, right? And raised it up and he bred it. I think it was a girl. It was a girl? Okay. So he bred that one. It was a girl. And he produced the same thing again. Then he bred the red-- It was funny because when it grew up, it kind of almost resembled a normal jungle when it grew up. Yeah, it looked like an ivory. I think I put the picture over there on the thread because I went to his website. It looked like it did when it was a baby. Yeah, it looked very ivory-ish. Or it looked like what I would say a red postal sort of turns into as an adult. Maybe not exactly the same, but it reminds me of that look. It was very close. Yeah. Yeah, it's very-- I don't know. Over there, I have to-- let me see if I can share it to the group. Let me see. I actually think I have it here. So, you know, I don't know. That animal kind of resembles what I would think that a caramel jungle would look like, you know? Yeah. I don't know if that's the case. Super caramel, yeah. Yeah, Nick had got on there and more or less said that he didn't think so because of the timeline of when-- Right. And to caramels that come into the States, which, yeah, that makes sense. So-- It's an interesting animal, and it's an interesting thing. And it's kind of like the-- by having the undocumented male, you don't know what he was. He could have been a coastal jungle. He could have been a icon. He could have been a jungle diamond. It's really kind of hard where, like, the bloodline is for that boy. You don't know what he was. So, mixing him into that one jungle to produce the red is cool. It just-- it almost seems like the cart is getting put way before the horse here. I mean, we've all seen when Nick has potentially a new morph, how long it takes him to kind of go through it all and through the breedings and see what it is. I mean, like, we had Darren on last week talking about the silver pepper. And I mean, like, what? How many years did it take him to go through the whole thing? To find out it was a simple recessive or a recessive trait? Seven years, I think. Yeah. It's like to do the breeding to figure out what it is. You know, it almost seems like it should be done more. And, you know, if it is a codominant trait, I mean, like, you know, out of one clutch of jags, there should be a whole lot more, like-- like, as a jag, for example, you know, one clutch of a jag to a coastal, you're going to get a bunch more baby jags. I mean, I don't think you ever have the ratio where it's, like, one jag out of the entire clutch. So, it would be cool to see. I would love-- I would love for it to be a new morph. I really would. Because it looks stunning. But I would almost think that there needed to be-- it needed to be handled differently at the beginning with the red baby jungle. You know, where it comes to documenting the parents, trying to figure out where the dad came from, and then line breeding the red babies with each other as well as other jungles to see what happens. Right. So, it's kind of like the-- it's kind of like what we're doing nowadays with caramels and reds, like with Jason doing with his reds right now, by line breeding and establishing the really bright color reds. I mean, I think Howard and I were talking at the last Hamburg, and we're like, we're going to give him two more generations, and then we're going to spend a crap ton of money on reds. So, it's like, we keep going like, maybe we'll buy this year, and then like, no, no, we're going to wait until next year. It's going to get better. So, you know, it's just one of those things. Yeah, Jason, I don't know. He's really worked that project out, but again, even the genetics with that is still sort of up in the air. I mean, you know, he's getting them to where they hold that red into adulthood now, which is awesome. You know, but I don't want to do that. If you remember a little bit back when carpified thorns, when Jage just first emerged, every Yahoo that had a carpified thorns that kind of looked different than other normal carpified thorns, called it a freaking morph and tried to prove it, and then after about three years, and people spending a shit ton of money on animals that had nothing genetically special about them, the founder animal disappeared and we no longer talked about it anymore. I mean, there were a ton. I remember, I remember platinum IJs. I remember spider IJs. I remember all the spiders they just couldn't ever do to breed. Yeah. Now they're platinum IJs, and then they never came to those. Yeah, now they're called labyrinths or whatever. They were the labyrinths. I mean, there were, there are, and there's always also some idiot who looks at the forearms, sees all the carpified thorns and goes, you know what, mine's special and different, because it has a white spot on its side. I remember on the forearms one time, somebody took the picture of his carpified thorns, and it was a coastal, and he goes, I'm going to call it the dragon fire morph, and he throws it up there. And it was like, I'm like, you poor, simple idiot, it's just a coastal. That's all it is, looking at it, it's a coastal. And then, of course, the guy was saying that he'd never seen these kinds of scales in this area on any kind of carpet pipe, whenever, and that it's going to be something grand one day, and we never heard from him again. So it's, you know, there's a lot more that goes into establishing a morph, and making sure it is something that is reproducible, and that's just kind of the way it is. And also, I know that it's a gorgeous animal, they're gorgeous animals. It is a gorgeous morph, if it is a morph, but 17,000 dollars. Holy crap. I think, yeah, I mean, a project is only worth what people are going to pay. You know, here's the thing when it comes to that kind of thing. If you can't prove that that animal is quote unquote pure, then you're going to lose a good chunk of people that are not going to purchase that animal. When it comes to the morph things and like new things that are proved out or not proved out, and they can't say that they're pure, you know, to me, that's one of those things like, yeah, I'm never going to tell this as a pure jungle or a coastal or something like that. But shit, man, I can breed it with whatever and, you know, produce some crazy whack out carpet. The other thing is trying to advertise this as a pure jungle morph may not be the right way to go. It's just to call it a red line or your line of carpet python. Just throw it out there as that and then try to market it as that and sell it that way, because you can't prove out that it's pure jungle. But imagine if you spend 17,000 dollars on those animals and you chuck them together and you breed super to super, but you do not get the animals you're expecting. Yeah, that would kind of suck. So that's where, like, okay, so I'm in a similar boat with poison ivy. You know, I have this melanistic IJ. I mean, for all intents and purposes, she looks like, you know, when you see her in person, you definitely get to feel that she is, you know, that that's somehow genetics. Looking at her offspring as I grow them up, you know, start to see all these things that... Yeah, I mean, like, their whole entire head pattern is a solid black head back. And I don't know, they're changing what you said. Is it something similar to what, like, the IMG gene and bell constructors, where as they age, they increase in melanin, you know, is it something like that? Is it something that, you know, because carpets go through, especially IJs, go through a change from one of the red babies and that's immature, you know, something along those lines? Is it something that's recessive and these are just visual markers and they'll put a breed in back? I don't know. That's why I haven't sold any babies, you know. That's why also I have to not breed crazy amounts of carpets because I have to hold those animals back because, you know, of the project. The problem that I have a little bit in defense will is that clearly there's something going on. I mean, this is something really cool going on, yeah. Yeah, this was the flag that, you know, when the red coals first came out, you know, the people that were anti-red coals sort of did the same thing, you know? If you go back and you look on MP, you know, you can see threads where people were like, you know, it's just like Annie Moralia, they go through on to genetic color change and that's all they do, and the babies hatch out red, and then they turn into normal adults, you know, and then there were people say, no, no, and then they would, you know, they would go back and forth. It is genetic, it's not genetic. Well, you know, I mean, when I look at my red jag and my red tiger and my red postal off from bail, and it's hard to say that that's not genetic. There's something not that there's something going on there. It's funny, though, when you look at, like, the first, like, I have an '08 red jag, and it's like looking at him, I'm like, there's nothing red about you, but it's like looking at the red tigers, because I have red tigers from '08 around that time as well. Again, and, but then looking at the red tigers that bail in is producing now, like, with eight years' worth of wine breeding into these things, it's funny. Yeah, but that's, so that's what I always say that's using, though. Exactly, but who's to say that? Because we have different types of red. I know, but who's not to say that with will and these animals, that with a little bit more breeding, like involving the supers or whatever he wants to call them, as well as the other non-superd animals, like, is that eventually going to be a line that people are going to be totally impressed with? It possibly could be. It could be polygenic. It could be that kind of thing. Yeah, you know what I mean? I don't know. Those super animals or whatever he wants to say that they are. I'm calling them super. I know probably every time I say it, somebody's like, it's not super. Thank you for yelling at the radio, but I can't hear you. Also, we need to find a way for you to know what I'm talking about. So the super animals, they're gorgeous. They're bright. They have some killer colors in them, and I would love to see them when they get older. I mean, because it doesn't seem, it does look like pretty, you know, well-established animals, and it doesn't look like the colors kind of faded away at all. So that would be awesome to see mixed with other things. But, and I don't know if Will's just trying to get the project out the door, because he's had his fun with it. And he wants it gone, or if he has a bunch of them, he's trying to get these three out the door for a good price. Well, he clearly says, I mean, that's one of the things he clearly says in the ad, what his purpose is. You know, I know there's a lot of people that are saying that, you know, maybe he's trying to do this or that or whatever. I know Will, you know, I like Will, I think he's a cool guy. I think he has, you know, he has a ton of snakes. So, you know, I just think that like maybe what, you know, I think like when it comes to genetics, they're sort of like this, what people say, what people mean, and, you know, what is the real thing that's going on. For instance, I'm thinking out loud, so I may, I may jack us up. But when we talk about polymorphism, right, and polymorphic genes, right, the best example in carpences is striped, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay, so I think everybody, it's pretty much the consensus that, you know, the quote, unquote, tiger or striped carpet python is a polymorphic gene, right? Okay. Correct. So, let's say that you line breed for yellow. All of a sudden, that's not genetic. That's just line bred. But isn't line bred polymorphism the same thing? Like, you know what I'm saying? So, like, why is that not a gene? Well, why, I mean, yeah, it's not like albino where you can get these, you know, consistent, predictable results, you know, because obviously with polymorphism, there's many genes. Am I saying that right? Polymorphism? Yeah, okay. I don't know. I hope so. Please, all your emails at info@morillabyonradio.com, and we will retract all comments that we're making right now. Correct. So, my thought is, is that like, okay, so let's just say for sake of argument that is along with red, along with these things are all polymorphic traits. Okay. Okay, so why then wouldn't that be a new gene? What, yellow? Yellow, or this jungle, or, you know what I'm saying? I don't know if I'm saying this right, but it seems like -- I think you're kind of mixing up, like, genes for pattern and genes from color and things like that. So, it's like, I don't know if we would call what -- Well, what's the difference between the genes? Well, I know that, but I mean, like, I guess we wouldn't call the color that we're expecting that is associated with -- I don't know. I'm not even going to try to swing at this one, because you've confused me so much. If you want to say it, there's still -- it's all genetic. It's all genetic. It's still -- Maybe as predictable as like -- I don't know. Anyway, you're going to -- you know, it helps me on this topic. Stop. Stop. Just stop. And I guess I'm just trying to say, like, on the flip side of it, that I kind of -- I know you joke about this a lot, but if all of a sudden you popped out a new morph from, you know -- From your car before I tried to immediately send it to Nick. I would -- I wouldn't even tell him it was coming. There'd just be a box with a note that says Nick, please keep this alive. Owen. And I'm like, you know, what the hell? I mean, like, you know, that would -- But think about -- Oh, my gosh. Think about the craziness that ensues with, you know, people like -- oh, that guy's office flipping rocker. That's not genetic. That's a new morph. You know what I mean? So, like, if you -- Think about it with Paul. Do you not share it? Well, think about it with Paul. Like, wasn't it -- he had a show one time and some dude had hatched out some funky-looking carpet by thought. He goes, "All right, I'll buy them." And then the carmals popped out of that. I mean, like, he kept finding, you know, zebras came out of this, that came out of there. I mean, a lot of times it is finding that weird one that someone has for sale or that you hatched out and seen where it takes you. But nine times out of ten, it's just going to take you almost nowhere. Yeah, probably, you know, it's probably going to end. I mean, with carmals in particular, what makes it a little more difficult is the variability that comes along with it. It is. So, like, I have wild -- I have wild-caught I.J.'s, right? Right. But wild-caught, capped-attached, whatever you want to say, to me, they're wild-caught. That's how I look at it. So, if I breed them, what if all of a sudden a pied pops out of it? You know what I mean? I mean, I know that's insane thinking and whatnot, but -- I wouldn't -- the possibility is that everybody would be like, "No, that's not up." I'm pretty sure you could just catch fire. I mean, like, you'd be like, "Oh, my God, it's a pied." And it's an I.J. And then, like, your wife would be in the other room and you just hear this, like, as you exploded. So, like, yeah, that would be pretty crazy. I would be terrified. I'd be like, "Oh, God, I look at it. It's good on God." I'm never going to be able to breed this. So, no. Oh, no. An I.J., it's like that would -- yeah. See, for all we know, my I.J.'s are the key to a brand new I.J. morph. It's just, unfortunately, for everybody. They're my I.J.'s. So, they'll never breed. We'll never get it. Yeah. Yeah. That sucks. [ Laughter ] You asked. This is, you know, Travis Lyman is coming to Carpetfest. Yeah. I don't know if you follow him on Facebook or not. But, like, he's, like, every weekend he bakes something new. So, he's definitely going to be the baking. So. Yeah. You had to take. Is that what you said? I asked. Food? [ Laughter ] Carpetfest. I'm listening. You know, somebody else that might be joining us. I talked to him on the weekend. And hopefully, as long as things work out and he can work out from situations, Mr. Mutton will be -- Oh, God. No. Coming through. No. No. No. My snake room is high enough for Nick Mutton to walk through. Please, God. [ Laughter ] Oh, no. [ Laughter ] I'm not worthy. I'm not excited about Carpetfest anymore. [ Laughter ] Oh, I should have waited and just let you surprise. Oh, I would have punched you in the face. Oh. Hi, Nick. Knock out, Aaron. It's like, you know. [ Laughter ] He's dead. He's dead. Leave him there. [ Laughter ] You know, just for that, I'm not going to send zero to my mother so that we can. You and him are going to be the best of friends. So. Yeah. Exactly. The assistance around that subject will just hit on it real quick. Carpetfest to northeast Carpetfest are fifth one. This is our fifth one. Holy crap. We should have a shirt or something. Yeah, we should. I'm the only new guy that makes logo. That's my ass. [ Laughter ] By the way, happy birthday to Zach. Happy birthday, Zach. Yeah. May 21st, PA is where Carpetfest is. Northeast the one, the first, the only, the original, I shouldn't say the only. Because Southern Carpetfest is right around the corner. It's April 30th in Texas. Our good friend Bill is going to be at his place. So that should be an awesome time as well. So go ahead to the page. Join the group. Go ahead. If Nick comes, do we have to try to kill him? Because at the northwest Carpetfest, they seriously try to murder him every year. [ Laughter ] No. I'm under the, he gets to lay back at our Carpetfest. Okay. So we're not going to try to kill him. No. He gets to relax, chill out, you know. Have some fun. Whatever his fun entails, you know. I don't know. So, yeah, it should be an awesome time. So, you know, here's a question for you, Owen. This is kind of off the cuff question, and we'll get to some more drama, but we'll put it in between. Yes. If you could, at dinner, with any five reptile people, who they blame, why? You could be people that have died. Five reptile people. Okay. We'll then be anybody one. Well, yeah. That's for sure. Well, yeah. We'll take Steve Irwin and his dad. So that's two already. Okay. You know, so we got those two people. To the problem is, I would fill it with, like, you know, it would be, like, trooper walls. Eugene beset, Steve Irwin, Steve Irwin's dad. So that's four already. And then, you know, somebody else in there. I'll bring you. You can come. So it's Eric. So Eric, Steve Irwin, Steve Irwin's dad. So that's four already. And then, you know, uh, somebody else in there. Hmm. I'll bring you. You can come. And I think that would be fun. Also, I'd be begging the entire time to have happy animals that I know those people have had interactions with and/or own. So, yeah. I think I'd have to have, let's see, I would take, I would also agree, I didn't think about Bob Irwin, but I definitely would have Steve Irwin there. So since I'm going to your dinner, I'm going to leave Bob and I'll check out Bob and your dinner. But, uh, definitely Steve. Uh, Paul. Paul Harris would be a better. Um, Richard Shine. I would definitely just sit down and have dinner with him. That would be cool. Um, Daniel Natush. Yeah. He would be there. Um, let's see. What am I up to? Four. Number five. Yeah. Who's that? Who would be that number five? Who's that old guy? That used to do all the venomous. Like, the point where, like, he got bit so many times his hands would, like, not close or whatever, but he was, like, the most knowledgeable guy on, like, cobras and stuff like that. His name escapes. Uh-oh. I know who you're talking about, but I can't. Bill Thompson. Bill Hoff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Bill Hoff. I think it sounds right. That would be kind of cool because, you know, that guy's going to have some, like, kick-ass stories of craziness. Yeah. Of, like, one time a king cobra, like, crawled up my back and I didn't know what was there. Like, wait, what? So, like, that would be, it would be kind of cool stuff like that. I mean, I would enjoy stories like that. Even just bringing Ari and being like, so Ari, how was your next trip? What was your last trip of a mountain? It sucked. Thank you, Ari. It's like, you know, that would be kind of cool. Kind of cool stuff like that would be awesome. I live for those kinds of stories and stuff like that, so. Yeah. Yeah. I think my last guy that I would bring would be Brian Fry. Okay. That guy is funny as hell. He's also, you know, he's the guy that's worked with, you know, promoter dragons and stuff like that. Yes. All kinds of stuff found out that they were actually venomous. And, you know, his book, he has a memoir book that is pretty good. If you haven't checked it out, it's definitely worth a read. He talks about anal bleeding and all kinds of things. And when he was on the Herb Nation show, he said it wasn't from recreational purposes, you know. That's nice. I mean, that's good that he threw that up. Yeah. I don't know. He's just a kind of good sense of humor. But at least, so, yeah, we're going to have a pretty good dinner. Well, the fifth, well, we get to go together, Owen, because, you know, it's just like a regular. So, you know what I mean? Let's just make it a dinner where we never had to talk and we'll just bring Nick too. Because then we'll have everybody and I can just sit there and not even speak. So, just listening to that, to be awesome. Yeah. So, you know who it is? That would be great. Another guy that would be awesome to hang out with. It was amazing. Casey Lee. Yes. Or, um, why the hell can I think of him? I'm a horrible person because we've had him on the job. And I'd also like to add Dave Barker. I think he would be cool. Dave Barker would be cool. Um, what the hell? Um, what was the method that we were all talking about with the kill and the heat? Oh, Terry Silla. Thank you. Dave, what the hell was wrong with me, Terry? Terry feels would be cool because he's got like the Cuban Crocs and he puts out those videos of him like would you like Brad Cobra? And the Cobra's like, no, I'd rather kick your face. So, it's like, you know, having, watching him go through his cobras is awesome to me. So, um, that would be really cool to see all that go down. Um, it would just be fun. So. Yeah. That would be a good time. So, that's going to be added into our question when we ask the, uh, you know, the guests. What's the, uh-- Yeah. Here's the thing though. It's a grant to add eventually besides Steve Irwin because I think everyone's just going to keep adding him. Yeah. I could just imagine that he would just be, um, so, um, what would be the word? Uh, his passion would be contagious. You know what I mean? Like, I would just think that's like he would just be sitting there listening and be like, "Oh my God." Well, yeah. The problem is that, like, his on-screen persona was like a four-year-old that got into the pixie sticks. I mean, it was like, you know, "How about this thing?" "Oh my freaking God." You're like, "I don't care what it is, but I'm excited." It's like, "What is it? Tell me what it is." It's a fence lizard. I never loved fence lizards more. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. I'm like, "I must have fence lizards." So, you know, it's the same woman. I don't know. So, that was segue into our other topic, which was the Venom Hunters. So, let me start by saying this. Have you watched the show? Nope. Nope. No. Okay. Fair enough. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. I'll say my rent, and then you can say yours. So, quite honestly... I will, yes. I have no... I don't hate Brian Barcheque. I don't like Brian Barcheque. No. I could care less about Brian Barcheque. It doesn't make a difference to me. The people that go around and they, like, hate to dude and, like, I don't know. I just come to a point in my life where I have no time to hate people. And waste it on Facebook. If you want to do this, and you want to be stupid, I think that you just ignore people like that. But that's just my thing. You know what I mean? So, this topic, we sort of, like, haven't hit on for a while, just because it's, like, one of those things that, I don't know, I just don't want to be another... We hate Brian Barcheque. He's a moron type of thing. Because I think when you're in that... We've had Brian on the show, and every time I see Brian at other shows, he's always very nice to us. He shakes my hand. He says, "Hello. We've had conversations. I have no real will towards the guy. I just, I can't. He's never done anything to me. And, you know, I know people... Exactly. And I know people will sit there and scream at the top of the hill that he's bad for the industry's bad. They're very bad. Well, guys, I've never done business with him. I don't know. I can't... I don't have an informed opinion about the guy. I'm sorry. So, it's like, I can only go by what I personally have experienced, or people who are near me, have experienced. Unfortunately, I don't know that many people who've done business with him, and the people who have done business with him that I know don't have anything bad to say about him. So, I can't jump in on this, and I can't really behave on the guy. I'm sorry. Right. So, my opinion of the show has nothing to do with the person. So, just so we're clear on that, again. I don't have... I'm not against. I'm not for. I'm not nothing. Like, to me, some of the... I think when you go and you put yourself out in the world, you know, you're going to have people that hate you. You're going to have people that like you. It's like with us. There's people that hate us. There's people that love you. There are people that hate us. You know what I mean? Especially. That's fine. I mean, like, oh, my God. Half the people are like, you know, Eric, we don't mind the show. We just hate Owen. I mean, like, that's... God. The email you let me read. Again, that's fine. I have no problem with that, and that's out. You know, we do our thing. If I don't like it, then that's fine. We're not forcing you to listen to us. It kind of reminds me of... I'll give you an example before I go on to this one. So the other day, I'm going to go ahead and go on through, and I see a post. And a post that is Eddy Van Halen playing "Hot for Teacher" with nothing else other than just the guitar. So I was like, oh, this is going to be awesome. You know what I mean? I click on it. I listen to it. Just like, you just hear the guitar. There's no drums, no bass, no vocals, no nothing. Just the guitar. And I'm like, wow, man, you can really hear what he's doing. I can hear the tone on the amp and everything. And, man, it's really cool. Voila, voila, voila. You know, I'm kicking out guitar less, because, again, as people may or may not know, he was a huge influence in me as far as music is. Yeah. Now, he may be a total dickhead. You know, that may be true. But you have people like posting that. He sucks. And the thing of it is that, you know, he can be a dickhead. He can be an asshole. He can be whatever you want. But he is not a sucky guitar player. He may not be what you really like. You know what I mean? But Jesus Christ, man, he does not suck on guitar. It just is not true. So then you've got people talking about how they like Randy Rhodes and blah, blah, blah. So what I started to notice is that people pick teams. And your team is the better team. And the only way they make your team most better is by making the other team suck. So it's like, well, Randy Rhodes is the best guitar player ever in Eddie Van Hill. It sucks. Well, no, not really. Randy Rhodes is very, very, very good. And he does not suck. Neither does Eddie Van Hill and suck. He may not play the music that you like or you prefer. But the fact of it is when it comes to guitar, the dude is good. You know what I mean? And he does Randy Rhodes. And just because you're like Warren doesn't mean the other one sucks. Yeah? So I find that happens in the herb world as well. Like, you can't... If you like this guy, this guy, this guy sucks. You know what I mean? It can't just be like, just don't pay attention to it. And the other thing that this is sort of off topic is just the fact that there's a little bit of hypocrisy when it comes to that dude. Because just what? There's people in the morality world. They're just as shitty and are put on just this platform and people don't talk shit about what they have done, who they have burnt, or you know, they look at them like, oh, they're the greatest thing ever. But yeah, this guy, because he has a YouTube thing, he gets crucified. Again, I'm not defending or I'm not promoting. It's just, I'm just putting the facts as... We're stating facts. Just kidding. Well, just like a top opinion. No. No. Never mind. It's recant last statement. Recant last bit. Strike that from the record anyway. Here's my problem with the whole Venom Hunter thing. The main thing that I hear from all these people that talk about wanting to push conservation and, you know, put these animals in the spotlight and do all these, you know, great things and blah, blah, blah, blah. That's all great and good. But none of them do it. They fucking sell that. They sold out. He sold out, man. I don't care what you say. He could have did a program where he could have went and he could have did... Which is a thought of what he was doing was, and he still may do it. I don't know. You know, we traveled to Africa, traveled to Australia, put together a documentary. You know as well as I know. When they said that they had a planet Earth 2 coming out, everybody in the hurricane, like, "Ahh, yes. This is the greatest thing ever." Especially when we found out that. Edinburgh was going to do it. Yes. Yes. Still, that's a show to me. You know, when these guys agree to do these shows, it's nothing more than to push your own ego. You know what I mean? Like, you've decided that, you know, I want to be on TV and I want people to see me do whatever it is that I do. And that's fine. I'm not against that either. But let's call it what it is. Let's not try to wrap bullshit up in a fancy package. You know what I mean? You can't say that this is this when clearly it's not that. You know, you look at... His name escapes me again. Keep forgetting his name. Hold on. I'll tell you in a minute. All right. Ray Morgan is doing that, uh, the venom interview. You know what I mean? Right. Right. That's a documentary about venomous, venomous keepers, uh, you know. And to me, that's what we need. We don't need some goofball running around, picking up. You know, when I did watch it, I watched one episode and I watched it with my wife. And she's looking at, and the reason that I did watch it with her is because she's looking at it through the view that Brian and Chewy really have a new job where they go and collect venom, you know. And this is their job and they have to do it. Yeah. You're not learning anything about the animal? Cool. No. I thought we were better than that. See, and there was this one TV show that I wish to God had been picked up where the host was actually Henry Rollins. It was called Animal Underground. And he went to places like Indonesia and he like walked in with like a hidden camera to like one of those bear gallbladder farms and walked around and he's just talking to you about like how they keep these bears and like these containers to the telephone booths and crap like that. He went to a rattlesnake roundup and stuff like that. He's taking you to all these places. And then like in the episode, he also visits with like a venomous keeper who's trying to become immune to black mamba venom and he goes through the whole thing of the guy milking the mamba and injecting himself. And that I thought was a good thing because here's a guy who clearly cares about the animals but he's going to show you something like horrible that would kind of play to your conservation standpoint and then he's going to show you something really cool scientific-wise and then he's going to show you like he's just going to go down to Tom Crutchfield's place and play with the Cobra. It's like that's kind of all over the map but it is kind of cool and it was a very nice show. I enjoyed it. From what I've heard from venom hunters and from other shows like venom hunters, it seems very forced and it seems very no chance in hell this is real and like the copperhead they're finding is a glorious specimen of a copperhead that looks like it never spent a day out in the wild. Like you know show me the copperhead that has like ticks on it and is missing its eyeball and that's the one that we're milking because we found it you know and it's almost misleading by saying that we have to do this for the laboratories. I forget who was the guy who had the other show Donald the cholks? Yeah. Cholks yeah. He was like the like oh I have to go out I have to jump out of a plane now because the laboratory I worked for told me that they need DNA from a striped hyena for research. I'm like why do they need the DNA of a striped hyena? You have not explained why we're guarding the hyena and why we're taking its DNA. You just said we need it for some reason so and he almost that almost seems like a bunch of bullshit too. And I can't like shows where you're almost bullshitting the audience to a point like I will watch river monsters religiously because I enjoy it and it seems like he's actively trying to hunt down this fish and he finds them and most of the time they're huge and you know and he tags them and releases them and that's really cool to me and he teaches you all these things and you have a healthy fear now of every kind of fresh water body ever created for what the hell could be lurking in there but it's almost like a show that bullshits you too much you don't ever want to watch so and that's what I've heard a lot about venom hunters and a few other shows is that it's too forced it's too unreal to be believable so yeah but you know what it is it's just disappointing is what it is and as far as this yeah that you have you could go and do the work and you could make a documentary like Ray Morgan did and granted it took forever for him yeah and I still haven't even seen it I've always been clipped from it but the point is is that you know I guarantee you that when this comes out it's going to be you know something that's phenomenal look at you know I've got that DVD Herpers one two and three you know some people like this young people didn't like it you know some people like it didn't like it but it portrayed the animals and not people my problem is that those shows these shows that are like this are focused on the person and not the animal and I think that it's a bit of a sellout you know and that's fine yeah look it's a imploded not watching it yeah I mean well it's unfortunately that you know it's unfortunate for Brian that this is the way he got on it because I mean partially that's not him I mean it's almost like I bet you if he if animal planet gave him the option of making a bear to yours doctor memory about the animals he would do so but network TV nowadays do does not want documentary kind of television they want flashy dashy they want danger I mean like that's why they basically have these guys running out and finding venomous snakes and of course they play it like these guys at any moment are going to get bitten the throat and die on television that's why you want to watch right so you know and you know and of course that's that and that's what half the people are playing at it's what happened networks and TV is playing at especially animal planet and discovery they're all about the whole you know but don't you think that they've returned and that they don't you don't you think the reason they do that is because people watch it of course but of course so it's real simple oh you don't watch it you know and I mean I tell it did I tell you I was watching I'm sitting there on a Saturday and this is like two years ago or something like that I'm sitting there on Saturday and the TV was on animal planet and it switched over the next program which was a one animal it's an animal attack video or TV show we've all seen them and they get stories and it's like you know moose tramples woman only that sucks so that kind of goes through all these things and then the last one is a boa attacks teenager and I'm like all right I will I will I will watch this and they go through this boa and the boa is gotta be about two years old and sitting on the rim of a cup like it's like that's how small this thing is sitting on the rim of like a bowl that's how tiny this thing is and they're all like you know they're getting ready they're getting ready to feed it and of course the things asked up and watching right and the voiceover guy is like and then the boa struck and I'm like I'm watching this little baby boa like flying half its body at the teenager and I'm like oh no what will happen and it bites the guy and of course like they slow mo and then now all of a sudden we have this computer generated image of the boa's teeth sinking into the flesh of the poor suspecting victim like he got bit by a baby boa he might bleed later I mean like what are we doing here and of course they're talking about how the snake will unhinges jaw as they're talking all of a sudden we now have a clip of an anaconda eating a deer I'm like wait what the shit's happening here so by the time they're done by the time they're done they're showing the kids hands and I'm like yeah I have 12 of those kind of bites today it's like and of course it's just the way you paint it it's just way too dramatic and whatever like if I showed the same exact clip with like funny music like no one would give to a rat's ass about it plus again it was a juvenile boa I think you couldn't find anything else you found back so it's and that's how it goes I mean that's just painting it in a certain light I mean like the camera angles that these guys must try to get to make it look like the vipers are closer or coming at them or death is inches away you know that's that's just TV he's trying to get ratings trying to get people so you know what's what's sad is like with today's technology as far as like you know with drones and GoPros and all these different things that we could do that you could get that you know guys that are you know what that's nothing you said go pro and I was reminded you remember be eating the live special on animal planet yeah and people are like we're gonna see what's like being alive and I typed in my Facebook I said give me a GoPro and a guinea pig I'll tell you what it's like you're alive but it's like you don't have to do it now yeah is another is another example I'm gonna about like you know you could you know you could go and you could make a show about reptiles that really show I mean they're amazing animals they really are you know yeah you could go and show what they're doing in their habitat and you know be amazed you know with with as big as the ball python industry is right as big as it is where the hell I've never seen one of these natural where is the nature show that shows where ball python a list show me a gut where is it you seriously crazy what does it look like you know what I mean like imagine how popular that would be if you had an episode where there's no you let's just say like I mean that's the one of the things that I love about David Attenborough not because he just speaks and you know he's just like you know he's so smooth just so amazing you never see the dude you never see the guy you see him at the beginning of the show you see him at the end of the show you know I'm saying like it's just like he's just talking about the species whatever is interesting about it you know there you go this is what they do and you know those guys that planet earth the BBC they continue to push the boundaries of how to film wildlife and you know they really for me and it's just silly that like you know that's at least in our world that's what people are looking for but if you did that and you did a documentary on like the snakes of Africa and you know did a thing like you know where you focused on the ball python and what it was like where it lived and what is natural habitat would be and you know what it's like breeding in the wild and what it's eating and all these things like you see African rock pythons you know you see them why do you see that because they're freaking 18 feet yeah exactly because they'll have the generic footage of that one that they caught one eating gazelle and they'll show that four times and they'll call it a day but that's just the way it goes and and even then documentaries are not dead I mean like I just watched the racing extension that documentary was beautiful that was very well done it was horrible but it was great and it was amazing and the guy was saying like what goes to make it documentary and I love that kind of stuff and I mean even what you're saying with the GoPro's if you years ago that had those elephants that they trained to walk around with the cameras and like leave them places and the tigers found them I mean that kind of stuff's awesome all of that that's amazing isn't it that's great yeah I mean like you know interesting we're all we're all animal buffs and we're all animal people and we understand the thrilling and the exciting show and the interesting show but I'm telling you as you can get there without half the stuff that these networks are making people do or some people are willing to do I mean you know but unfortunately I don't think you can make a series out of certain things like you know having the people who are like oh we catch gators and pull them out pull loose and skaters at a certain areas you know there's got to be a certain amount of time where there aren't that many alligators I mean python hunters the TV show that eventually went downhill because you can only go out and look for Burmese Python so often so right I mean just that's kind of limited by what you tried it about you know when they started branching off and whatnot you know I mean can you imagine doing looking for other stuff hey BBC you need to do a show on Australia you know what I mean and you know like where they focused on like Australian reptiles can you imagine if there was a BBC documentary on Australian reptiles that would be like that would be like the video version of the barkers book of the complete garbage by times of the world volume one world you know what I mean everybody would be like oh my god that's the greatest thing ever you know so yeah oh yeah I don't know that's my phone so let's get a camera and film it for yeah we'll get a camera we'll film it and then we'll sell it to BBC but we'll have to talk in British accents the entire time look at the carpet python as it comes to the graph look at the cat that's no you don't know that's German yeah that's Terminator like so yeah we'll work on yeah anyway I don't know that's what talks on that show I will not watch it I watch it once I watch part of it you know you vote with your dollar I believe that but I'm not gonna go all over Facebook and you know ran rave about how this is you know it is what it is you want to do something why don't you're asking change it do it yeah it's almost like it's like but what I understand is why go through the trouble of saying that Brian and Chewy have a new job and work for a boss that needs the venom why not just say that you guys have been hired by a lab to get the venom and if it's not if that's not true say you're going out to get the venom to sell to a lab I mean it is it is it just boiled down that they do not have a reason to go find these animals and get the venom so they're making it up I and that's what I don't I don't like and that's what I understand I think they do say that they're they're they're like what you said but to me that's I don't know now you're going to think that every Joe Schmo is going to be able to go out and find an inland type and or a black one or a wetland item and should have run it to you know oh well where's the venom lab no it doesn't work like that you know what I mean it's like all you need it one all you need is one schmuck that automatic of believes that if he fills his trailer filled with venomous reptiles that he will milk him and sell the venom to somebody yeah and I know some people who tried that I know some people who've talked about that some people tried to sell me his business that he says he can turn out this amount of venom that sells for this amount of money and I'm like would he sell it to and then I never got an email back so it's like you know it did these are not you cannot take these animals lightly you never should even if it's a venomoid even if you've kept it for years that these things are designed they have evolved to become killing machines when it comes to that the venom is so potent it they should never be seen lightly and I don't care if it's a milash viper or king cobra venomous scare the shit out of me and I dealt with venomous I worked with a good with a good with a good boond viper I've worked with cobra I worked with heel monsters Chris had a bunch of cobras for a while he had some mamas too and it's like dude I have come close enough to a black Pakistani cobra to a rudu vipers to a monocle cobra to the point where I'm like it no I will never I'll never own a venomous snake and I will never go near a venomous snake and that's just my opinion and I know some people who become far too comfortable I there was one guy at a reptile show once he goes I got bit by my cobra today this morning as we were packing up we'll see how the day goes it's like are you effing serious there was a one guy kept showing video of his finger the picture of his finger dissolving he's like the bone will probably be fitted what's the matter with you yeah bones are supposed to sing in your body when did you first realize something was wrong so it I I can never really take anything that you know would make it and that was some of the things I had if I ever had a complaint about Erwin and it would be his free handing the venomous yeah well it's just plain about him you know a lot of you didn't like that and I would like to even do it well yeah I just thought that you know yeah well I'm just saying like you know we we we've created and built the tools to handle these animals safely hooks and get that and I do notice the venom hunters have the chaps the hooks the boots and all that fun stuff that's that's great but you know you should also definitely have trained professionals do this and the fact that you're trying to put you're putting a dangerous animal you're putting yourself in a situation with the dangerous animal in order to make a television show it did it's sometimes that can be crossed in the line a little bit in my opinion it's almost like you almost want them to find it not touch it film it talk to you about it and then frickin leave so but that's that that would just be me I wouldn't go near venomous yeah I mean that move up around venomous so you know it's not something that I would get into either you know I can appreciate them I like them for what they are there like that's fine them fascinating they're buying you know I think they're beautiful probably some of the most beautiful species of snake there is you know but it's not something that personally that I would keep and that's that's where I know people have to be smart you know if they want to do this or keep this ripped out hobby long-term it's like you really have to be smart about you know knowing your you know capabilities of what you can and can't do you know or your limitations of what you can and can't take care of I mean if you listen to like one of the big things that a lot of the venomous keepers safe because they always talk about having a sealed room where nothing can get out you know a huge deal and if you can't do that you're you know and you have a neighbor you know or even just the people in your house you know your kids whatever you know I mean you have to really have to take that into consideration because if it gets out and you know and proper caging is important you know you see some of these jocals that you know at Hamburg and they're telling walking out their monocle cobra which is like their first make and they keep it in a you know a 10 gallon aquarium with a screen lid and a brick on the top. Do you add a hamburger at a hamburger show there was a sweater box plastic sweater box and it was flipped on its lid and it had two pieces of duct tape wrapped all the way around it and inside was a black mamba wow sitting on a table and it took me a minute to realize what the hell I was looking at because it's like my brain couldn't process that that animal was in that thing so and it's like I'm like you can't get it and unfortunately at Hamburg I've seen like 14 year olds walk out the door with Nile crocodiles I mean you know and and there are and I mean even then Chris uh Chris's first venomous were white-lived tree vipers that he got at Hamburg when he was 14 wow that should not happen cannot shame on those predators that would give out something like that to happen I won't let anybody over I won't let anybody under the age of 18 by a goddamn carpet python and you're letting a 14 year old walk out with vipers it's like there's there's certain things that should honestly be taken in and unfortunately venomous are gorgeous animals they are and and they are very cool and I understand that some people I guess just feel like a complete badass to have a freaking rhino viper but I just the risk versus reward for me I can't do it I can't I mean if you can show like see this is where I think that the herb community should police itself a little better I think that yeah you know like even if we're just talking to the United States that there should be some kind of protocol in place that you know you have to have X amount of you know time with working with you know a venomous keeper yeah before you can be issued a license before that like you know you have to have this in order to get a permit from the you know from from the state or whatever that you've shown that you can keep these response these animals responsibly you know because I don't want to I feel a little bit hypocritical for me to go along and say that you should keep this and you should not be able to keep this but yet I should be able to keep that you know what I mean but at the same time if somebody else can come along and say you know I shouldn't keep carpet fights on yeah but if your car now I guess losing bites somebody they're gonna bleed for a little bit yeah I mean yeah how many cobra's gonna have somebody at all you're in Florida I mean like well three I think yeah I mean like that's ridiculous enough I mean the fact that you got that going on but it's like with with with venomous it is something completely different because that thing is not yeah a carpet fight on gets loose it might bite you it might you know cause a bunch of fear and panic it won't kill anybody nobody's small enough of that thing to kill unless you let your infant alone in a room someplace with a carpet fight on even then I'm not even sure but a venomous is you know anybody trying to interact with an animal could potentially be killed by it especially if it's something that you know is completely exotic to the United States you know if I have a freaking type hand and it bites me or the neighbor am I gonna get to the hospital in time to get the any venom like or is that or am I a one and done I mean where the hell's the any venom even gonna come from right which is I guess I hear I've heard before that like if you're gonna if you're going to go down the road to work with that unless you really should try to work with native species before you venture off into you know exotics so to speak yeah well and and again coming from my other my my my real world job and insurance I can tell you right now that if you're bitten by your venomous snake and you go to the hospital your health insurance will not cover anything at all and any zoo or lab that pays you the ten thousand dollars a vial for anti-venom is gonna want their money back so it's it's not worth it on so many levels of course I say this and I want eel monsters so yeah but outside from eel monsters by yeah I wonder in the uh in free health care that's covered all that I'll try to figure that out for you yeah I'm just wondering you know I'm gonna have to be burning painters where he where he fits on the uh whether or not you should have to be interested in your venomous at over us where do you stand yeah you know that'll be an interesting debate I'm bored i'm again what people all have the venom you know he else have the venom yeah they need to share it so all needs the anti-venom that didn't matter that's all good um okay i think uh have we have we done it have we done what what do we do show is it are we finished are we done anymore I don't know what are you going to live in a clock i mean i don't know what do we do we're useless yeah yeah oh but uh that's uh hopefully uh yeah at the cool show and hit on some uh some stuff i don't know who's lined up for uh for next week yet i kind of have a couple ideas but um i haven't had any information as of yet so it's tuned for that um cool as far as uh you know shout out go um thinly parked is this weekend yes so uh if you're if you're going drive safe guys and have a blast um drinks on are on eric just mail all beer tabs to him hey yeah um yeah bursborough pia god damn it gee i would say i would say i'm doomed but you never know my address i always have the text to get ahead where are they came yeah that's a yeah that's a true story i think it's 114 something something burrow pia it's already done uh your poor neighbor your poor neighbor hey i forgot to ask you um yeah uh you had some nile monitors or whatever those monitors were doing some action in your uh living room nile if you think yeah they're niles they're they're actually they're andrew's banded niles so they're like a brand new like morph of nile that he's trying to create no pressure Owen so it's like you know they're in there and uh the male these things i never know what the hell i'm looking at with them so the male's head is twitching all around his next going crazy and he's coming up to the girl and i hear a bunch of tussle and i'm like all right they're fighting over foodings and but then i look over and he's trying to get on top of him i'm like oh no so i call andrew and i'm like uh so the male niles trying to get on top of the female mile and he's bobbing his head around he's trying to get his tail underneath her and he says why are you speaking to me and not taking video i'm like oh well i guess i'll do that i hang up and the second i hang up they're like an opposite end of the cage like sleeping i'm like what the hell so i had to wait and uh i caught him again a few days later and i actually was like hiding on my staircase because i couldn't see me filming them so um and then i and then i posted a video to andrew's wall because he was like please just put it there so i can see it um and they're not that old they're like a almost two i think and they're not even that big but apparently they're old enough and big enough to potentially breathe so uh i don't know what's going on i don't think she wants to but apparently in the monitor world um there is no such thing as uh consent so um they're just gonna keep trying i guess but um andrew's pretty excited and hopefully if i breed if i get an eye leg i'm like i don't know what the hell to do so you're gonna put them in your incubator i will this i give them an eye i can breathe an eye on monitors but not i don't even jay a carpet python what does the world come to i don't know now it's just horrible yeah crazy crazy but yeah but um that's they will be here they're gonna be here at carpet fest so um people can definitely check them out i doubt they'll be out and about but who knows i mean they kind of are not they're not as gun shy as the uh mangrove monitors they kind of just don't give a shit so guess when you're a nile monitor you can earn the right to not care so yeah it was kind of like uh so when i go to Owen's house and i sit on his couch it's very similar to the scene in Jurassic Park where they go to the piranha source rec exhibit and wait and patiently wait and then you're just looking at some trees and some bark and you're just like and then all of a sudden yeah kind of kind of cool but they're cool for sure okay one of those things i could admire from afar you know exactly i know what you're doing with them you know i have to change their water out tonight but like i don't touch them i just chew them off until i can get their water bowl out and that's not a given new one so right cool cool cool well hopefully uh you guys are able to uh reproduce those things so yeah shout outs so again give a shout out to uh i'm sure Jason Balan and Howard Reading will be at the Inley Park in March so stop on by and see those guys this weekend i know i think i'm pretty sure uh psychotic exotics will be there i'm not sure but i believe guys they usually are yeah yeah they usually go out there and hang out so uh you know definitely some carpets to be had if you're into checking out some carpets uh i don't know if Julie will be there or not but uh you know the usual group um will will probably be there and check and check them out so um let's see what else uh if you're going to tingly if you're going to tingly and you see rascal pythons uh call me and let me know i will purchase them and then you have to mail them to me so is that how that works okay that's how that works yeah is there going to be rascal's available this year i mean i know Nick is a strong possibility i mean you're the rascal guy have you have you been watching getting on a list or what's the deal okay i want everyone to list um potentially mick is the first front runner in my opinion who is going to hopefully have a clutch this year and that's because um and i'm not just saying it because it's Romulus um because Nick has my mail or used to be one of my mails out there and they he's been breeding and then uh was it chained um had maybe a lock this past weekend um Julie hasn't taken any pictures but she told me she was going to have her pairing we know Dave D was going to put his pairs together so there's potential for a couple of clutches of rough scales appearing and of course i say this not knowing what the hell certain other people like cam and uh anybody else who's purchased adult animals from him uh will be producing this year so i imagine there'll be a pretty fair amount of rough scales potentially they're almost did you mention did you mention shane shane adamson yeah yeah i thought it was okay i did yeah yeah he was doing yeah he's you know those are the rough scales that were supposed to be mine but i didn't but um it's uh it's uh shut up there's a potential of uh there's a potential of a few clutches and i am hopeful um and i of course won at least uh 1.1 more so uh i have been watching and i am on everybody's list so come on cool all right well there you go every i will be beating everybody for everybody they're online yeah right rough scales and yep just reading something that came up on my facebook feed it says florida woman who tortured and killed a gopher tortoise i put it on fire yeah what's wrong with that yeah that happened a while ago there was this uh two two women or two 32 days in jail yep thank god there was a girl and her friend who they took this gopher tortoise which is like if you've ever seen a gopher tortoise it's small it's like a box turtle it's freaking harmless and it's like they're really in nature and it's like and they they they threw it like it was a rock they kicked it a few times they threw a bunch of letter food on it and they said it on fire and the video taped the entire thing and it's like how horrible of a person do you have to be do that to do that to a living creature you know regardless of if it was a tortoise or endangered or you know to even do that to anything that's alive is you you you have to be some kind of sick twisted bastard to do it so right you know they were talking about how they weren't going to be able to try them because they were under age and blah blah and you know of course the family is on tv going like we're getting death threats and it's not nice and i'm like well you know your daughter is a freak so um they so i'm kind of glad that they got they handed down some kind of punishment um just because it's kind of like a just a way to deter anybody doing anything stupid like that again but you know of course we say this with one hand that this is not nice and this is illegal to do this to a gover tortoise when it's probably cool to do much worse to a rattlesnake and something like that or you know various other things so there's there's a lot that needs to kind of be redone with that kind of stuff but i'm glad 30 days in jail for being a complete psychopath have fun go to therapy so yep well okay i'll stop looking at facebook so uh please do you know and the show um see at tingly park this weekend uh stay tuned for whatever the next episode is going to be uh figured out people let uh let you know um as far as far as far as morality python radio if you like podcast and you want to learn more about maralia then check out maralia python radio dot com if you have any questions or comments about the show future guests anything along those lines send us an email at info at maralia python radio dot com uh you can check out our facebook page which is maria python radio give us a like follows there that's where we try to post uh any info that's uh up and coming and share some um you know maralia related uh topics with you um we're also on twitter at maralia python if you want to you know subscribe to the show you can get it on iTunes or whatever podcast app that you happen to use um and please help us spread the word by sharing the shows but we appreciate it and the breeders that come and volunteer their time and their knowledge uh they appreciate it as well as far as myself eb maralia you can check out my website at eb maralia dot com if you have any questions for me you can send them to eric at eb maralia dot com i'm on facebook instagram twitter all under eb maralia um i will be starting to i mean the weather here is starting to warm up it looks like winter's over for the most part i mean today it's what 60 70 degrees something like that so it's like perfect shipping weather i know i'll be putting up a bunch of citrus tiger stuff not head albino just regular i don't care anymore i don't think it doesn't matter anymore uh they're starting to color up they're beautiful um really have a lot of potential so if uh look for that i have some caramel stuff some head albino stuff but uh yeah should uh pretty pretty cool stuff starting to color up to have some age on it um and uh you know you can check it out on my website or on my facebook page um and that's all i got cool what i got is you can get a rogue dash reptiles dot com the uh breeding diary is almost up to date i have to add what i kind of happen over the weekend but we're pretty close um if you are interested in any of the clutches that we have listed there just drop us a line will i be the list uh being on the list is not automatically mean that you were going to be purchasing purchasing something it just means that we're going to contact you when the babies are ready to roll uh as far as shows i think i have one coming up but that all depends on whether or not i'm going to a carpet fest so i'll let you know um other than that you better uh you quiet you who voice in my head um so uh what i said like you can go through rogue dash reptiles dot com you can also go and give us a like on facebook at rogue reptiles at facebook dot com that's all i got today like i said earlier if you are going to thinly park safe travels everybody we hope to see you all when you get back and we expect a ton of pictures post them up on the pick of the week and we will see everybody here next week for some more Morelia Python radio good night hey Chad Brown here you may remember me as a linebacker in NFL where's a reptile breeder and the owner of Projak i've been herpes since i was a boy and i've dedicated my life to advance in the industry and educate the community about the importance of reptiles i also love to encourage the joy of breeding and keeping reptiles as a hobbyist which is why my partner Robin and Marklin and i created the reptile report the reptile report is our online news aggregation site bringing the most up-to-date discussions from the reptile world visit the reptile report dot com every day to stay on top of latest reptile news and information we encourage you to visit the site and submit your exciting reptile news photos and links we can feature outstanding breeders and hobbyists just like you the reptile report offers powerful branding and marketing exposure for your business and the best part is it's free you're a buyer or breeder you got to check out the reptile report marketplace the marketplace is the reptile world's most complete buying and selling definition full of features that help put you in touch with the perfect deal find exactly what you're looking for with our advanced search system search by sex weights more or other keywords use our buy-it-now options to buy that animal right now go to marketplace dot the reptile report dot com and register your account for free be sure to link your marketplace account to your ship your reptiles accounts or earn free tokens with each shipping label you book use the marketplace to sell your animals and supply and maximize your exposure with a platinum mat also gets fed to the reptile report and our powerful marketplace facebook page buy on the selling you ship your reptiles dot com take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rate ship your reptiles dot com can also supply you with the materials needed to safely ship your animal successfully use ship your reptiles dot com to take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rates the materials need to ship your reptiles successfully live customer support in our live on-time arrival insurance program we got you covered visit the reptile report dot com to learn or share about the animals click on the link to the marketplace find that perfect pet or breeder then visit ship reptiles dot com the ship at animal anywhere in the United States we are your one-stop shop for everything reptile related to the world. 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