Morelia Python Radio

The product show with Owen, Zach and Matt.

In this episode Eric is away and Owen is in control. He wll be joined by Zach Baez from Darkside Exotics and Matt Minetola from Philly Herp and they will be discussing some of the different equipment that they use for taking care of their reptiles.

Duration:: 2h 18m
Broadcast on:: 19 Aug 2015
Audio Format:: other

Hey Chad Brown here, you may remember me as a linebacker in NFL or as a reptile breeder in the owner of pro jocks I've been herping since I was a boy Hey Chad Brown here, you may remember me as a linebacker in NFL or as a reptile breeder in the owner of pro jocks I've been herping since I was a boy, and I've dedicated my life to advance in the industry and Educating the community about the importance of reptiles. I also love to encourage the joy of breathing and keeping reptiles as a hobbyist Which is why my partner Robin and Marklin and I create the reptile report. The reptile report is our online news Aggregation site bringing you the most up-to-date discussions from the reptile world Visit the reptile report.com every day to stay on top of the latest reptile news and information We encourage you to visit the site and submit your exciting reptile news photos and links so we can feature Outstanding breeders and hobbyists just like you the reptile report offers powerful brandy and marketing exposure for your business And the best part is it's free you're a buyer or breeder You got to check out the reptile report marketplace the marketplace of the reptile world's most complete buying and selling destination Full of features to help put you in touch with a perfect deal find exactly what you're looking for with our advanced search system Search by sex weights more for other keywords and use our buy-it-now option to buy that animal right now Go to market place dot the reptile report calm and register your account for free Be sure to link your marketplace account to your ship your reptiles account to earn free tokens with each shipping label You book use the marketplace to sell your animals and supplies Maximize your exposure with a platinum mad also gets fed to the reptile report and our powerful marketplace Facebook page Byron or selling you ship your reptiles calm take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rates ship your reptiles calm Can also supply you with the materials needed to safely ship your animal successfully use ship your reptiles Dot com take advantage of our discounted priority overnight shipping rates the materials needed to ship the reptile successfully live Customer support in our live on time arrival insurance program. We got you covered Visit the reptile report dot com learn or share about the animals click on the link to the marketplace find that perfect pet or breeder Then visit ship reptiles calm to ship that animal anywhere in the United States We are your one stop shop for everything reptile related You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You You Hello? Hello? Oh, and? No, this is Matt. Who is this? Matt. Oh, what's up, Matt? What's up, bud? Are we on air? No. I think we are. Where's all of that? I don't know. I don't know where Owen and Zach went and hung up on me. Oh, man. This is, this is pretty funny. I'm not leaving anyone in charge anymore. So, what's up, Matt? Not much. How's Florida? Is it good? Ah, it's beautiful down here, no doubt. Chasing some pheridals, gators. Yes, in the video, it looks fun already. It's just crazy stuff outside and there's some wildlife and you just walk over it, you know? You can't find anything in Philly like that. Yeah. I know. It's crazy. Yeah. Owen. Owen. Oh, my goodness. Owen, what are we going to do with you? Oh, man. I guess it's a technical difficulties. Yeah. I wasn't sure if anyone could hear me and I was like, I think I'm so muted, but I don't know. Okay. All right. So, I saw your cool stack of cookies and stacky scents today to picture. It's pretty cool. Yeah, rooms for some new chondros or what? Yeah, new cages. I got the apartment harps cages again from Douglas Hartman, the custom cages and they should have been built last week, but I've been so busy. I was like working on them every night. So, yeah, I finally got them all built. I put the one Condra who was in too small of a cage for a little while in there and I actually have another male come in tomorrow. So, yeah, but they turned out good. I really like Doug Hartman's cages because he can, he legit will do any size you really want. And his timeframe was great. His prices are great. I mean, his time frame is really good and bring other places and wholesome there and apologize that he's taken too long. So it works out really well. Yeah, there's a certain company that I didn't go with because of the timeframe. I thought it was just not how long it took, even though they do make quality stuff and it's just. Yeah. Yeah. You got it. I think I know the company. I use them. I like them, but you just got to expect the weight. I'm sure we'll be talking about products. I'm sure we're going to talk about that tonight. If there's a show. Yeah. Well, apparently Owen can't. Wait a minute. Owen told me he can't get in because I'm already in the room. How can I already be in the room? I have no way. I don't know. Oh my goodness. I just call it on the phone. Mr. McIntyre. You sure. I'm messing up. I'm guessing me and Zach both got hung up on by blog talk and I don't know if Zach can get back in. Yeah. So did I. I just I just called back in. So. Zach Owen, call back in. So the call in and unmute himself. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, not a whole lot going on down here. Oh, you are fired, sir. I am fired. I fired myself. I don't know what the hell is happening here. See, so you see it's not so easy to do my job. Yes, it is. Yeah. But anyway, I have no idea why it will not go through my way, my computer. So I get to just what it doesn't like me. So, you do not have full host status. You are just. I don't. That is. Clearly. Anyway, go away you back in the woods. Yeah. I'm just glad that I was there to bail you out and then I'm going to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The rest of my fucking life. Thank you. I'm going to do some stuff with you. I'm going to take you to a train. I'm out. No. Well, I'm going to ignore that. John and Tully are going to ignore the chat tonight because they are all douche bags anyway. So, I said it. I get sharks. All right. I was just calling it. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I can feed them out. I'm done. I'm done. Clear. I'm quick. I'm actually going to go host them out. You will not. Well, I just wanted to say call it. I actually wanted to see how the. That new app thing works that you know, the call in from the email. Yeah. It works. Yeah. Apparently it doesn't work that well. Yeah. I didn't even do it. I couldn't figure it out from my phone. I don't know. I didn't spend that much time on it. Right. Okay. Well. Zach, the sack is missed. Boston there. Yeah. He wasn't even on the group test. I didn't see him responding. He must have just forget this. And he's going to bed. It's funny because Matt and Zach and I were all talking before the show went live and everything just stopped working. Yeah. I did tell the people that the reason you weren't at the show today. I don't know if even the day you even heard it. I'm just rambling to myself probably. But you weren't at the show tonight because you are actually hunting the elusive Sasquatch. They don't know. They don't know. But you are actually a huge crypto zoologist. So you have once a year, you go into the woods and hunt them. So. Yeah. I got to tell. So Owen's telling me this today. And I'm saying, yeah, I got some new wood knocking skills down and I got yelps. That's really going to get me. Yeah. Really solid swatching evidence. And he told me to put some apples in a tree. But I told him that I could not reach the top of the tree. So he just had this image of me climbing a ladder. I put an apple in the tree and a Sasquatch. Of course he was. That's how it worked. I told him it was not called a ladder. I don't even remember what I called it. It was a step ladder and you said it was a vertical like, I don't remember. A vertical assistance ladder or something like that. A vertical assistance step. That was it. Yeah, it was. That was it. Yeah. Yeah. Anyways. All right. Well, I'm going to let you try to watch this train wreck get off on the right freaking point. I'm glad I could be part of this this week. Yeah. I know. I'll watch it. I'll ride on the ground like a fish out of water. It's great. You'll be fine. You do it once a year. You'll be fine. I know. We'll never do it again. Let's do it. I can't take my vacation next week. Dave's on next week. You've got lucky. See how I planned that? All right. Thank you, Eric. All right. I'll let you guys get back to it. Just get back on here. Why don't the firm get back over here? I don't know how you'll do. Well, it's actually he's on his way home. So he may be like getting out of his car. Oh, I got it. So I'm going to give Zach a little bit of a benefit of the doubt. And if Zach is listening, just scream when you're back on. Okay. All right. So make sure you get plenty of solid war ball talk in there. I want to hear all that. Fun. Fun. Very good. All right. So have a good night. All right. Thanks. I will see you. Bye. Bye. That was fun. We haven't had a weird start in a while. So I'm glad I got that out of the way. Sure. So there was no intro music. This is just a silent out of nowhere. Second, I think. Your life. I'm alive. There you go. Now we finally have everything fucking the way it's supposed to. Anyway, so let's start this before it gets even worse. How are you guys? Good. Yeah, pretty good. So what's going on with your guys up? You guys moving? I know we're getting close to end of August. So are you guys sitting down writing down your breeding stuff, getting everything ready that way? Go ahead, Zach. You can go. Oh, geez. You know, I really don't have to really go sneak up all you know it. Yeah. Like when you finally get out, maybe it's time to figure out who's breeding the shirt. Yeah, what the heck, man? It's like all right. What's going on next year? Actually, quite a few things should be ready next year. I should have quite a few projects finally, you know, ready to go. So you should have coastal for sure. And I definitely, I'm trying to at least have one IJ query for next year go. So that's my goal. Between that, I also have my chondros. So I got my Piax key dish. She's probably going to be ready to go next year. So that's going to be great. So I'm getting her ready to go. And I should have two bluetun steams there. So that would be good. Finally get those guys going. It took a while. Just, I recently picked up a female, a golf female bluetun. So we'll see how that goes. She may or may not go be in this first time, you know, here. So well, you know, who knows? It may happen. Other than that, you know, some other little projects that should actually produce this year, which should be nice. You know, I think they're going good. I'm planning for the next month to just be feeding every week. And then I go on my little trip. And then when I get back again every week until breeding season, just get everybody ready. So that's kind of my goal. Yeah. Yeah. Very cool. Matt, how about you? Yeah. I do the whole right and everything there. I have it. I wrote everything that can read them. I just haven't put what to what and seen who's sitting at bench. But I should have a good amount of bonus for job projects. This year should be really good for reds. I'm hoping because I've been having just a hell of a time with them lately. Getting bad clutches, look, very little eggs. So I think I was rushing things and just in my head too much with them, like trying to keep them lean. I'm just kind of, just say I'm keeping them stacked, but I'm just kind of doing things how I usually do it. And we'll see how that goes. And I got that condo pairing going right now. I got the terrible lose going because the girl was acting fine. And maybe she was telling me or maybe they just are breeding because that's a sneaky way to put them together. I don't know. But they've definitely locked. I put the mail in for two days. They locked up both those days, took them out for a few days, put them back in. They locked right back up. But the funny thing was the female wasn't eating. And then I took the mail out. She's ready to eat again. And that's pretty normal. Now the male doesn't want to eat, but that's normal for, you know, male. They're getting the breed of mode. Yeah, you got that one thing right now. So yeah, yeah, so that's fun. And I got a, hopefully two more condo pairings, a pair of marookis and possibly like this unknown locality peril have going on. Do that probably in October when I do most of my pairings, unless I see something crazy. And I think I'm going to put my pair we took together and maybe a few ball turns, my bow is again. That's the dirt, I think. Cool. Yeah, so it might be a really big year where it could just be lots of different species or clutches who here and there. I don't know. Very cool. Sorry. Now we're going to do a little bit of Merlea news for a little bit and then we'll start getting into this product review stuff because basically we just want to go through what each of us uses for different types of snake and what works for us. And what products we would recommend. What we like about them, what we hate about them. But first things first, I was on Facebook today poking around. And one thing that I did check up on is that apparently people were submitting pictures of the Panther carpet python again. Zach knows this one. Matt, I'm not sure how diverse you are in this one, this particular carpet python. Just heard you guys talking about it and seeing pictures. Yeah, I don't know much about it. Well, it's one of those things that they keep popping up every once in a while where people will kind of like forget about them and then they'll research. And a lot of people on Facebook today were screaming about how it was brand new. So kind of wanted to touch on that a little bit for everybody is that it's not brand new. They've been around for a little bit of the Panthers and they're one of those that it's a recessive, allegedly. And they were for sale, the babies, but nobody was ever really kind of chalked up there. Nobody ever really spent all the money on them. So nobody knows if they ever made it out of. I think it was the Ukraine or Prussia where they were originally bred. So hopefully, I mean, I know myself included, people are kind of hoping that they would make their way to the United States. But it's an all black carpet Python. So, Zach, what do you think? Do you think that they're going to get here at some point eventually? I don't know. I just find it kind of interesting that, you know, there's a lot of information about these animals and all of a sudden nothing about these animals. Yeah, the best. It's been over a year. It's been five-up, right? Yeah, it has been almost two, I think, at this point before. Yeah, I think so. I think it's been about two years. So, like, you've got all those photos and all the information, those, you know, two years ago, whatever. And I was excited about it. And then we haven't heard anything since. Now, that can mean one or two things. Yeah, it can mean either somebody's got it. And they're keeping it tight to the chest until they have enough to then start marketing them out there in the public. Two years now, your boys are breeding. Oh, yeah. Right. At some point, if people who bought into this project, they're got boys in the regions incorrectly, so. Right. So, so many did end up picking up those animals. So, she was asking for certain amount of money for them. I mean, I mean, it's all relative, I guess, but you was asking a lot of money for them. They told me to pick them up. And then I would imagine in the next year or the year for that, we'll start seeing them at least being popped out there. But if the other option is that, well, the project totally and utterly fails, which could definitely have happened. You know, you would think that somebody, somebody by now, something, you know, it's just. You would expect it would be dead air, you know, it's kind of, it's kind of unnerving. So, we'll see. We'll see. If they're out there, absolutely, we'll get them sooner than you think. If they're not out there, then, you know, we'd always call some fingers and hope Eric does something with those items. Yeah, yeah, that I just think. Now, not being somebody who's still kind of like getting your feet wet with carpet python a little bit would even an all black carpet python appeal to you. Yeah, almost anything all black seems pretty cool, but I was going to say, because I don't know how far along, like you guys were saying, maybe there's a problem with the project. And I don't like I said, I've seen the picture. You guys showed me. I don't know what has or any of the other project looks like, but a lot of times. Seems like all black mutations, like Motley Bellows, even a cinnamon or black pastel ball plate on seem to have problems. So maybe there's, I don't know if they're producing multiple Panthers and there's problems been aligned to see. Seems to happen a lot. You see this project going along. People post it. It just dies for two years. It comes back up because someone gets one of the decent and then everybody finds out it's got like rubbery spines and kinks and all that nonsense. But I have no idea because I really see the picture and I'm just going off what I see from some of the black mutations that go out there. But yeah, all black carpet python will be cool. I mean, I like the super zebra. So why wouldn't I like them all black? And of course that's glute hum skinks. The best one I've ever seen is that, you know, malnistic one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's wild in it. Yeah. I do like, since you've been showing me blue tongues, I got to say they are nice. But that one is like, I would, that one, I would definitely want to own some of that. You know, that thing is just neat looking. Yeah. They're like all black with orange belly. Like they're bellies. Like you can see some orange, you know, caddoning on their bellies. But yeah, they're most of black. Yeah. I don't even know that. I've never even seen them. That makes it even better. I'm just a jet black. Yeah. Yeah. And originally they thought it was recessive. And, you know, with recessive with a marker, quote unquote, with a visual marker, which we all know that just means it's incomplete dominant, you know. Because the quote unquote catch, like it looks like we're real dark. Like they're really dark when you compare them to normal. So they're not as, they're not black, but they're definitely much darker. So yeah, but they're, they're really cool. They're, they're in, they're in Europe already. So they'll be here very soon. Wow. You know, actually, actually, there's reports that those skinks are here in the States, and I believe it. But I can only confirm that they're in Europe for sure. But they're definitely, they're around. It'll be a while. People, you know, a lot of people who've never kept loose on before are keeping them now. And so it's going to be a few years before, you know, the people who are just starting to keep on because of the morphs and stuff starting to get into it. It's going to take a while for them to get their feet wet and actually start producing them. So I think we'll see them now very soon. And how are you not tempted when you go, like, because you're going back over to hang out with Casper. How are you not tempted to just buy a bunch of them shipped over here? Money. That's true. You're telling me you can't just take up $20,000 or something like that. No, no, no. Damn it. Well, we can try it. Anyway, it's not, yeah, I still have definitely the ones I like. I like a much better than the albino. So I wouldn't have those. I would at least have one. Of course, I have a pair, let's be honest. But they're coming, they're coming. And when you mix them with albino, oh my God, it's crazy looking. It's wild. It's like orange and white, like mostly orange on the back because the melanism, it creases the pigment, like, creases all the pigment. So it also increases the orange pigment. Oh, it's insane. And then when you take the black away, you have this all, almost all orange skin. It's insane. So, yeah. They'll be here soon. Let me stop talking about skin. They'll be here all day. I don't think we should have figured it out pretty hard. The product show is now all skin show. Oh, yeah. Let's see. You're pretty quick. Why not? But anyway, it's that we all know what Zach will probably do. You'll just get to all Morelli and go right headlong into skinks when they all get here. So, push. No more. All right. Anyway, so Eric heard that now he's crying. Anyway, so let's start jumping into the product stuff. So, like I said, the reason I wanted to have you guys on because number one, you're close. Number two, you won't judge me when I mess up horribly, which you've already done. And number three, what am I kidding? You guys won't judge harshly than everybody else. But, and number three, we all, the three and three of us all keep things very, very differently, but kind of the same. We all use different materials, different things like that. So, I kind of want to get everybody's opinion on it. Now, the first thing I want to hit on is Cajun. And I use reptile evolution cages, and I have natural, I've got, I think it's natural spirits, racks, they're old kind of hand down racks, and I have some animal plastic racks as well. You guys kind of, what do you guys use for Cajun? So, Matt, you have a lot of rack systems. What are your racks right now? Racks, I mostly use a black animal plastic one. They're, they're my favorite pretty much, but sometimes I have to get one on the spot. So, I have some, they look just like them, they match them. Sea serpent racks, and they're real good too. The guy usually comes to Hamburg, and he ships them whole. You don't got to hold them, they're heated, they're whole. So, I got quite a few of them now, and then I have ARS racks. That's the metal racks, and I keep my adult short tails in. And as far as Cajun, I got a variety of Cajun, I guess. Still, I got a few animal plastics. I have a few PM Herps, which are Doug Barcage. Yeah. And I also have a few, I was just saying my, most of my founders, now I have the Hartman Herps. Yeah, Doug was Hartman, he builds custom Cajun, and it seems to work well because I have all kinds of odd sizes that fit on top of my rack. And that's the majority of the cages I'm using for concerts and everything. And then I have a animal plastics and have the test system incubator. I just do an incubator talk. So, yeah. Okay. So, now you changed from, you had a bunch of Freedom Brader racks a while ago, right? Yeah, I had the, I don't think changed models in many times. I had the older model that was like the, it's like a weird galvanized thing. And they, they lasted a long time. They were great racks. But they would get rusty and they had the open air system still. So, the top was all open. It was like grading. And my Borneos could get under it on top of their boxes and they would grade their backs up or their heads. And plus, my room was, my room had good humidity in my own house. It was all, that was almost my old house. With the opening of system, it just doesn't allow much, you know, it's, it's tough to keep humidity in there. So, I would use them tote boxes for high boxes with mulch. And I just hate to use a mulch. So now I use the same tote boxes, but just the paper. I just didn't feel like using the Cypress mulch and all that stuff for humidity. So basically, go ahead. I'm sorry. Freedom breeder changed their racks. But I prefer IRS. I think it's like a slicker look. The prices are about the same. They're just minor differences. And ARF carries the pub. They use the vision pub that I like. And I don't believe freedom breeder makes that pub. So that's another reason I guess I'm with our mail. Okay. And about how much is a unit of ARS costs? No, the, the 95 12 series, which is a 12 youth, they're 12 tubs. The tubs are, they've been big cubs. They're a 39 by 30 by nine, I believe, and they're 12 of them. He did. After shipping and everything, it's everyone's like between like $2,800 and $3,000 a rack. So he's pretty crazy. Wow. I mean, did they come fully assembled or no? Yeah, yeah, because they're, they're, they're well, but together. So that's, that's why the shipping alone is between $2,50 and $3,000. Because it comes on a, comes on a big, great truck. And they literally just drop a shrink wrap on a, on a pallet. Like, you know, if you're not home, you just come home to a massive cage shrink wrap upside down in your, in your driveway or, or whatever. So, cause a lot of them trade companies, they're just flopping. They're supposed to call you and literally you'll go home and you're like, that's a gigantic rack system outside my house. But the good thing is people probably wouldn't even figure out how to feel it. So heavy and they wouldn't know how to take the levels apart, probably. So. I don't know, we're going to be able to wheel away with it. So. Yeah. Well, well, they, they do it upside down to the wheels in the air and then they come off level by level. But I'm sure people will go, what the hell is this thing? So. I don't know if they'd want to steal it. Let's have a scrap and maybe they would, but I got. Well, maybe. But, um, so, I mean, I, I, I, I kind of had some work with the freedom breeder racks when I was in the zoo. Yeah. Do your tubs come off the tracks or no? So you see, I, I don't have any tracks on there. The old freedom breeder I had. I had some of the smaller ones with had no tracks and then the larger ones, the 48 ones, which I don't know if they were called the larger jumbo tub. They had tracks where you could, they would sit on the track, but you could press these tabs in and take the whole tub out. So it was, it was good and bad, I guess. It was good because you knew the tub wasn't coming out. Unless you did all that, you know, push the tabs and put it up and yeah, and take the groove out. But that eventually even rusted, I believe, on them old miles. So it got crazy. But actually a friend, a local friend has it. He still, he loves them and he, he's using them fine for his blood place on. So. Hmm. Well, it, it, it all depends on how you keep them, I guess, or how it works out like that, but. Yeah. And how, how are your ARS racks heated? Uh, they have flex watt with metal. They, they, they go across one. They put flex watt onto like metal sheets that go across. They want, they run across. So, um, just basic. And I think it's the 12 or 15 inch. I'm not sure. It's a big one, but it's kind of a waste for blood because I don't, I rarely put the heat on them. So, but I guess it's good to have. Right. Okay. So, and then you said you get your, or you get your all your condo cages are built by. You said it was a dog apartment, right? Yeah, I have, uh, I have two in the, in the dog bar, PM her one. I did a, I did two in the animal plastic. I did like a 48 inch and put the divider in and made it permanent, which I really like to look at that. But, um, the dog partner ones are perfect because it's hard to get. It's crazy how hard it is to get some of these cage companies that they're plastic and they try to get them to do a size for you. And I'm not even paying the craziest size in the world. Like, Hey, instead of a 24 inch height, the one he water, can you make it 20? And they're just like, Oh, that's going to cost a lot of extra money or you're going to have to wait till this time of the year. I guess they set their machines. They don't want to set them off. Where dog Hartman takes your order and he does it all like with his own stuff. So I've heard people complain about him a little bit, but I think he's, I think it's great. I don't know what the complaints are and I've been promoting them. So I think he does a good job of everything plus. For the price, how quick he is, you can't beat it. Plus he does black and white plastic. So I think it's real good stuff. Things can match and that's all we really ought to tell everybody really wants anyway. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Zach, what do you use? Cause I know you, you, you, um, didn't you build that one rack system with Eric with like the bread on the side? Oh, yeah. I'm like smartish board of all kind of things. I mean, I'm busy over here, man. I'm not crazy. Whatever I hobbled together over like the last four years and like nothing matches. It's, it's, we're getting there, but it's kind of just, it's a mess. But, you know, everything works. Your room looks good, Zach. I think your room looks nice. Like the, the, the both together stuff looks fancy looking to me. I don't know. That, that might just be me. I think you got to, I think your room matches better than most any of our rooms. I'm like, Oh, look at this thing. Okay. I tell those like really cool, you know, skinks hanging around and that just blows us all away. Yeah. All right. Yeah. So, I mean, I only have, well, if you talk about Congress, you have a few cages in the room. Nothing's too crazy. I have two melon cages. Yeah, old school melon stuff. And, you know, actually, you know, it's funny. I actually picked them up from my current. These two cages. I picked them up. Yeah. Maybe it would have been like high, almost high four years ago, three years ago. So, it's only bad. Like it's been a while. And I picked these two, I actually picked up four cages from them. I ended up just using two. Just because of the way it fit in the room. But, you know, these old melon cages with sliding glass, fonts and everything else. You know, so far they've worked pretty well. I've used them for, you know, when I put animals together for breeding. So, you know, they have a little more room than in the racks. So, they get, you know, it's plenty of room. Overhead heat panels on each of those. And, you know, they work well. They're two feet deep. And then, you know, they're four, classic forms of cage. I think they're about 18 inches tall. So, actually, like, almost too big. Especially the way I keep my carpets. So, they're size, you know, they're kind of big. But, they work well. They work well. So, it's because I tend to cohabitate. My parents for, you know, almost six months out of the year. So, you know, any change you can make sure the male can get away from this while he wants, or vice versa, is always a good thing. So, yeah, they're nice. Fortunately, just through the, you know, I don't know how long Mike was using them, but I would just do it a few years. And then, from my youth, you know, they start a warp, you know, because the silicone starts coming up and then you get the moisture and the year-eight goes between. It starts warping the cage. So, it's not the nicest thing. I do what I can every year to doctor it up and try to keep it going for another year. And so far, it seems to work. Like, every year, I'm like, "All right, let's refurbish these cages." And then, you know, I get to squeak by for another year, but I'm going to try to fix that soon. So, I use those. The melamine rack you're talking about is a style of cage. I know that calcium uses it as well. And you take threaded rod. I think it's one inch, you know, one half inch diameter, threaded rod, you could get it at home, people, whatever. And so, you use the threaded rod to, I don't know how to explain it, but kind of mount each of the shelves on the threaded rod. You have to drill holes through the shelves and kind of bolt it all together. And it takes, like, hours for the bolts because you have to put each hole on and you need two bolts for each self and it takes forever. But the end result is really nice. You know, it's a really nice solid piece. Like, I think it weighs about 200 pounds. You know, that's the only problem because it's melamine. Actually, you know, I'm going to throw up a picture of it on the face. Yes, please go ahead. My reply is on radio, please, on the Facebook page. But, just so people can get a look at what we're dealing with now, correct me if I'm wrong, by having the threaded posts, you can actually, like, raise and lower the shelves to accommodate different sized tubs, correct? Yes, which is really cool because, yeah, you're right. You can kind of, you can raise and lower the tubs exactly what you're saying. So you can fit exactly. So there's never, I'll never have stuck tubs ever. Like, they'll never warp to the point where they'll be stuck because if I need to adjust, I just use this wrench and adjust it exactly how you want. And that's what's great, too, is, you know, it's really a modular system so you could take shelves off, you could add shelves. You could add a coupler and then add another piece of threaded rod to it so you can make it taller, you can make it shorter. In the picture, you'll see that there's a coupler in the last two rows. And you can take that off and take the top two rows off, so just in case I want to stack more cages on top, I can. So, like, I really made it so that way it really helps you so much with it and that's why I really like it. So if you have a small collection, I would, would you recommend, this is kind of being a way to have all your guys kind of organized or kind of in one place or one thing. And would the drawback, the only drawback I could see from it, would that be the melamine? Yes, it's melamine. So, right, so that's not only issue. I do know that now home people sell PVC, they actually sell expanded PVC, the same PVC. Yeah. Yes, now people make cages out of it. Now, you can go to them and say, "I've heard mixed reviews on this." Some people say they'll do it, some people say they won't, depending on if the person using the salt thinks the plastic will be toxic when they cut it there, but you can get them to cut it into strips. And so pretty much you could take this PVC board and get them cut into strips and then use that instead of using the melamine. First of all, it's going to be lighter weight, and then on top of that, it's also going to be moisture resistant. Well, I will agree and disagree with you because Andrew just built a ton of cages out of those PVC sheets, and he did have it cut at home people to specs, so they will do it. Well, actually, they will do it, that's great. They will do it, but the problem is that this stuff, this PVC sheet, is flimsy as all get out. Oh, yeah, because is it a half inch? Is that what it is? Yeah, it's a half inch, but you look after it, because he cuts them into four footers and then they just, they give them out. Yeah. You need separate ports, which isn't that horrible, so, you know, it's almost like taking your melamine rack and tweaking it a little bit, giving it some back support, and then giving it the PVC. You could have a pretty nice homemade rack, and I mean, how much did it cost to build yours, Zach? It probably cost me like 200 bucks total. That's not bad. Yeah, fuck yeah. You know, like 200 bucks total, maybe, I think. And that's because I bought fancy, fancy feet for it, you know, and I kind of, you know, bit it up a little bit. You know, you know, I couldn't just leave it alone. So, you know, and I put, you know, little things, caps, so that the, you know, the tubs want to slide out, you know, a little locks or whatever. So, well, you add all that up. Those are 200 bucks, man. It was really inexpensive. It still works. I'm going to be using it. I don't have any plans on switching it out any time soon. So, really, it's been great. The only issue I could find with it is, it's back heat. So, and I want to put the photo right now in the comments now, where you guys can see the way I set up the back heat. I ran a PhD, put the 11 inch. I just run two on each side. Because I have a heated room, I don't need it to be that warm anyway. So, it's pretty much back in the tub. It's like 86, which is, you know, perfectly fine for everything I keep. So, let me see if I can find that photo and post it up. There it goes. Yeah. So, it's not bad. It works great. It's just, I can't imagine moving it. When I move, I will not be taking it with me. That's the plan anyway. Because it's so heavy that it's just not worth it. Especially, I only 200 bucks. You know, it's like, it's really worth taking. But what's great is, it's 49 inches long and about 16 inches deep. But what's perfect about those measurements is, it's exactly what you need for 15 quart and 28 quart tubs. It's perfect. Especially, I get the, if you see in the picture, those are, what the hell? It's called Irish Tubs. Those Irish Tubs, you get on that at a container store. And you can fit four across, or you can put two of the larger tubs. So, it's really great. I can put yearlings in the 15 quart and then when the males, I mean, my males fit in the 32s fine. You know, I keep on middle signs, poor snakes, you know. So, it worked out fine for me. But yeah, it's just a really great system. I'm glad I did it. I really bothered Eric all weekend for that pressure. No, actually, you know, I think we only did it like one day. But I think we went there with father's plates like four times to get more tools. Yeah. That's useful for that. I mean, let's just be there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I wish, I wish that we would have videotaped how we did it. Because it's really easy. You just got it a little bit awesome. Yeah. It's just got a drill hold. I mean, it's actually a really easy thing. It's just kind of tedious is all. And then you can see the back panel I put pegboard in the back. So, I just got with the home depot, measured out what I needed. And I pretty much just used little screws and drilled back to the back. So, it has support in the back as well. It doesn't really need it. It's actually really strong. But, you know, that allows me to put the heat tape. So, I just ran the heat tape off the back. Yeah. It really worked out. So, that's great. So, yeah, there's a lot of mail of mine in my place. I also have an animal plastic rack. That is their CB70 rack, but it's their economy line. So, if they're cheaper, it's almost, I think it's a third cheaper than the usual thing. But the only problem with them is they have open sides. So, that could be a good thing and that could be a bad thing. If you're having a room that's not heated, it's not going to work for you. That heat tape is going to be running really hot in order to try to keep the temperature inside the tub at a decent temperature. If you're running in a 60 degree room, 75 degree room, something like that. The B&M room is about 80 degrees during the day. 82 things like that. It works out fine. What else I like about that is that it allows a lot of light to come into the tub. And, you know, which is great because it allows snakes to have a light cycle. Even more so, it allows my skinks, which are diurnal animals to have plenty of light. And I keep all my skinks in racks currently. So, it works fine. That's a whole nother topic, but yeah. So, I use that. I did order an AP rack, another one, a duplicate of that one that's going to be side by side. And that should be coming in, I mean, I ordered it two months ago, so we'll see. We're counting down the days when they'll come home. It'll be here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Literally, it'll probably be here two days before I head back to Denmark at that. It'll just show up. And I'm like, "Damn." And I'm going to have to try to set up everything before I leave. I know it. But other than that, and then, of course, I use my crazy, uh, the drop down rubber made hubs for the contract. What we're going to talk about next is your drop down tubs. Now, what are those tubs? Like, what are they technically called? Technically, they're called rubber made all-axes tubs. And I'm not going to take credit for firing them. The credit goes to Mo. She first found them, I believe. I don't know if she took a picture of it while she was at Walmart or something. She was like, "Look at these. They wanted to be crazy for, for, uh, for snake ages or for conjure or something." I'm like, "Oh, my God. Those are conjure cages, you know, for 15 hours." Like, those are literally what that is. Um, and so I raced, I ate ropes in my nearest Walmart that night. I looked at them. I did measurements on them. And I just bought, I bought, you know, they're there. I bought the ones in black because they come in a few colors, but I bought the ones in black. And, you know, I just like, "I'm going to rig this up. I want to make this work." And, you know, a few iterations, and what I have now is kind of my finished, you know, product of what I do with those. And I'm telling you, it's a godsend. It really, really is. Especially if you're working with a heated room. It's really a no-brainer for a lot of that, um, smaller sizes. Uh, the biggest size is 22 inches wide, so about 22 inches wide, 16 feet, 15 falls, something like that. I'm very big. I'm looking at one that's 71 quarts, and it's something like 72 quarts. It's a big tub. It's there for $71. I mean... Is that the one with the drop-down front bones? Yeah. Yeah. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Whoa, whoa, buddy. Nothing, no one. The size is the big thing. So, apparently these things are pretty freaking big now. Wait a minute. Now we have to check now. Uh, yeah. Yeah. For a while, the largest size was the 22 inch wide, or 22, 23, something like that. And those are the ones that are like $20, right? Yeah. I think they're like 16 bucks or something like that. Yeah. And they work great. Yeah. I think the measurements are like 22, 17 by 15. I think God is looking at them for a while. Yeah. They work great, huh? Oh, they work okay. Oh, wow. No, I mean, they don't have any bigger ones. No, that's it. I guess it's not a bigger one. This person just really tried to screw you here because it's 11 by 17 by 19. Is this how I'm looking at here? So, I don't know. And they want $71 for that? Oh, yeah. Okay. Tells you four of them. Never mind. Sorry. Oh, my God. Yeah. And I suggest if you're going to go out and buy these all access tubs, I have a video on YouTube and I just explained the whole thing, how I set up the whole tub from the ventilation I put in it to how I put the locking mechanism, how I put the purchase in there, even how I put my water bowls in there, everything. It's a video explaining how I do the whole thing. It's currently on YouTube. If you look up Rubbermaid, All Access, Condro, Condos, something like that. Dark Sonic Gotics. You'll definitely find it. It's up there. Definitely check it out if you're interested. They're cheap. Right now, I'm looking at their online store. They sell them in packages of two in the black. You can also get them in blue and a few other colors I've seen. But in the black, which is the ones I like the best, you're looking at $33 or $34 for a pair. I mean, very cheap. Very inexpensive. Currently, I'm keeping adult condors in them and they're doing fine. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, they work great. I don't know. We'll see what's going to happen in terms of breeding because I am doing breeding this year and how I feel about having two animals and the same thing. I don't know. My ideas is going to be to make a through way, a piece of PVC connecting. And so, drill a hole on each side and then put a PVC cap so I can cap it off when I want the mail not to go back in there or open it up or whatever. That's my idea. I'm going to do this year to try to make it so that I can use it for breeding as well. And I'll let people out. I'm going to do probably a video on that if it works out. I'll let people know how I did that too and see if that works out. But also remember, I keep my condros small. Very small. Yeah. So, you know, you're looking at a female of 500 to 700 grams. That's sort of size. You're keeping a 1500 grams female, a 1000 grams female. You're going to maybe need a little more space. But I have no problem. They should find there. You know, they don't see like they need a lot of room. You know, they cruise around and find. Everything seems to be okay. So, you know, it works. None of them have escaped it. That was my biggest concern. And that was a lot of people's concern because when you just pop open it, you know, it's easy to open. But my locking mechanism, which I use a tab to tab down and prevent it from going up, works fine. I haven't seen them. And condros in general, they'll push as much as, let's say, a carpet. A carpet will get out. Eventually will get the hell out. Because I find that carpets, they will, you know, especially males, they will bust out. They will bust out of there, I think. Unless you reinforce the front somehow, because between the bottom edge slip and the door, they're, it's a little flimsy there. And I think if a carpet really tried to get out of there, I bet you could probably slip through there. But for condros, I don't think you're going to have a problem. I really don't. So, it works out great. If you feel like you need a reinforcement, you know, when you, when you're human person, you'll see what I'm talking about. That it'll be an EV6 that maybe glue like a piece of piping in there, a little piece of wood in there, just to keep it from bowing. Because that's, that's the issue, potentially. Because if they push out, you may be able to bow the door and then slip off under the door. If that makes any sense. But I'm going to close another picture of my condros set up so people can maybe get an idea of that. Please do. If anybody is wondering what the hell we're talking about, we're posting them up on the Merlot Python Radio Facebook page. You can get some go over there. You've got pictures of all the stuff we've been talking about so far as well as the product that you should or could be getting to build your own stuff. And the question right now I have for the both of you is, which is better, pre-made stuff or you build yourself? Matt, what are you doing? My opinion, I like the stuff you just buy and you get, I just always done it that way. I'm not so crafty by myself. I got to read instructions and I just was lucky enough that we have the money to just buy the product. But I've seen tons of homemade stuff that's awesome, that even looks better. Like I said, that rack that Zach got is awesome how you can adjust it, I think it looks good. The first time I've seen that was years ago, I think it was in a guy's reptile room. He had a, he had like a half bathroom or just a toilet in it. He built that all the way to the ceiling for babies around the toilet and everything. Oh my God. And he used to just keep six square tubs I think in there. I might have even, I don't know where the guy was from or anything, but I just remember I always used to that picture. It's a little tiny head bath and it goes around this toilet and all the way up the walls. And I was like, man, that's crazy looking. That's just using all the space available. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. But I mean, if you need to save money, those tons is good. Like I said, that's video for them, Ponderokage is awesome. And even though I didn't build them, I used his perch thing, the same light. I basically took the whole setup almost and used it and his video helped me with that. So, yeah, I like the pre-made stuff, the stuff from companies. But I think they're both great, you know, building them yourself if you know what you're doing. You know, if you're just going to throw something together, probably not the greatest idea. Go off someone. Yeah, probably. You have a good idea, you know, and use them. Don't have to ask the products. You know, don't say, oh, I can get away with using this cheap plywood would knock all in it. You know, and then just don't put any, you know, a big long, like you said, with the plan for being flimsy. Some people will try to get away with like an 8 foot cage where the plywood just sits over the top like it's not going to bow and they're going to try to stack stuff on it. You just don't run the problem. Right. Yeah, I would say, I would say it depends. I made stuff out of necessity. You know what I mean? Yeah. You know, it's like, you know, I'm like, you know, you start doing the math sometimes and, you know, at the time, I had a lot of time on my hands. So it was like, okay, I could commit a weekend to doing this, or I could fish out 500 bucks or 600 bucks or whatever it's going to be. It's like, I'd rather commit the weekend, you know, or whatever. And I'm just that I'm very DIY in and of itself. You know, I kind of, you know, I'm also very savvy when it comes to putting things together. I mean, you know, so, you know, I did all, you know, plans on the computer, blueprints and CAD. You know, I've done all that stuff. So, you know, it was, you know, doing that thought process was too bad. I put it together. It's not bad. You know, I built furniture for a living for a few years there. So, you know, I have an idea of what I'm doing. So that's why it wasn't that daunting when I wanted to go ahead and do something like that. Right. But if I had a choice, definitely the pre-made stuff always generally looks better, always generally works probably better. There's ways to go around it. It really depends. If you're going to do a more permanent setup and you're going to do it right, you know, if you're going to put the money in, just do it, you know, put the money in, do it right. It sucks because sometimes it feels like you're, and now, now, the room is, when this rack comes in, the room is technically done. But I want to replace everything practically at this point. You know what I mean? I mean, I guess that's always the case, especially when you look at reptile stuff in general. Everybody wants to replace a thermostat. Everybody wants to replace, I mean, everything in your room, you want to upgrade it. You know, so like my metal mine cages are my next step. After I put, you know, my new rack in and all that, there's those cages. I'm going to get those out, get some PVC cages. And instead of doing an 18-inch tall, I'm going to do a foot tall, and that way I could put a third one in there. You know what I mean? I could have three instead of having two, you know. Do things like that. And you're going to, everybody does that through the room. They find out what may work better and what may not. And if you're kind of like up in the air, maybe doing a cheaper option would be a better idea because then if you always want to get something better, at least you didn't put out so much money and they realized it's not going to work for you. So, yeah. So, I mean, it's really, if you have the money, do it. If you want to be bush league about it and kind of just do it, do IY, you feel comfortable doing it and have at it. You know, that's really the way I went. And I don't have any regrets, for sure. Nothing has malfunctioned. I'm not going to all wood right now. Nothing has gone too bad, you know. Nothing has escaped from the cages I built. Not going to win again, but so far so good. So, again, you know, it really, it really comes down to what you can afford. But definitely the pre-made stuff looks so much better. And everybody dreams of that room with everything it matches and everything is perfect. And something will care, but I'm like, you know, everything has to match. I'm very, I'm very, yeah. I've become very picky about my repover. So, and it's one of those things like if I had been paying attention when I had started, because my first snaker was the Craigslist special number three, where it was like one online. You found anything you could possibly do. And that's what you, like, you took it home and you spent a weekend building it, fixing it, making it better, and then putting your snakes in it. So, I would definitely recommend, because I'm going to post up a link to where I've got my cages right now, and that's reptile evolution. But it's almost one of those things that you kind of got to worry about. You know, they sent me back quite a bit, but I kind of got in my head with the whole, like, yeah, I'm spending this much money on cages, this much money on fixing the cages and making them worth a darn to write what my animals in, if I just stop doing that and get the bullet, I could get a bunch of cages that are good. And I do love my PVC cages, but it just goes down to what you're comfortable with and what you're working with, because, you know, in college, I had nothing but sweater boxes in my dorm room, so it's just one of those things that you can do. So, I post up a link from my cages. Now, I do want to move on to from cages and racks to something else that is equally as important, and that is computer systems and heating. Because I see those because if you just throw heat on a cage, you're going to kill your animal. Or catch your house on fire, right? You're telling me I got to get the heat rocks out of my racks right now? No, I'm telling you, put them in the water bowl and let's see what happens. Anyway, the issue is that now I had for the longest time belly heat, flex watt heat, pads, and stuff like that, and I still have some belly heat back, back heat, and tape heat, but mostly I now use is reptile basics heat panels, and I have them kind of arranged where, and the reason I love them so much is that if you stack up your cages, the panel that is in the cage underneath the one is heating the floor as the cage above has its own heat panel, so you're kind of getting dual heat going on here, which is why with those kind of systems I feel it's important to have a computer system that can kind of alter the load in this way you're not having, you're having proportional heat for all the cages, which is why I have herpstat 4s and herpstat 2s that run my cages, and then I'll maybe use a RANCO or a reptile basics computer system to run my racks because you don't really need to have too many proportional with that one. What do you use for eating and computer systems on your guys right now? Oh, I've used and used practically everything. It really just depends on what's going to work best for any given situation. So, like my animal plastic racks, of course, have a Netflix lot, and it works great, it's fine. I don't really run it very hot at all. You're looking at an 85 degree hot spot, 84, something like that, so it's pretty low. I will eventually probably, because I also keep blue cones in that rack, and they're fine. I think I put it up higher, I think it's now 86 because of the blue cones. They like a little bit warmer than the snakes would, but not much. I mean, they're totally fine at the same temperature. I just, you know, this is the first time keeping lizards in racks. I'm just trying to be a little more careful about it, even though I've been noticed for two years, but anyway. So, it's about 86, and what I would like to do is have it, so the bottom half on one and the upper half on something else, I tend to keep the snakes on the upper half because I use mulch on board the blue time. So, trying to put mulch in a cage that's over your head is much more difficult. Trying to scoop out mulch that's over your head is pain in the ass. So, I keep the snakes up top and then the mulch, you know what I mean? Like, I try to run my room very logically. Like, okay, what would work best to me in this situation? And so, yeah, that's the kind of thing, but I generally use flex lot. In those situations, my baby rack, I have a little dragons for you, baby rack. I don't use any heat on my babies. Have you used any heat on babies since I've been producing babies for the last, you know, whatever, three years now, and they've been perfectly fine with my, you know, they seem to heat up quicker, so they're perfectly fine with the room temperature rising and they seem to heat up just fine that way. So, I don't use anything on them. But, in terms of thermostats, I like reptile basic thermostats for a few reasons. One, price is great, price is very great. Two, the guys are local. Meaning that when I go to Hamburg, I want to talk to them face to face. When I go to white planes, I want to talk to them face to face. I've had extensive conversations with those guys about their thermostats, and they know what they're doing. You know, I've never been able to talk to, you know, perks that people who make hurts that, and everyone will talk to them face to face, nor have it, you know, like heat leaks and things like that. So, the fact that I keep those guys, they're like, "Hey, you know, this is what I have." I can literally go to them and be like, "This is my problem I have with this thermostat." And I haven't had a problem yet, but at least I know who the guys are, you know, and I, you know, so that's why I prefer those thermostats, and they're really are tailored to what we do. And they're, they're pulse control. They do dimmer control too, but they're, so they pulse electricity rather than dimming the electricity. And their view on that is safer because it, as it pulses, it's all, it's pretty much a quicker on and off. And so if anything were to malfunction, it shuts off. It never, it doesn't lower down to it, so it just shuts off. They have a lot of fail-safes attached to it. It's great. They're, they're really, really nice. And you can get them where they have two probes, you get one probe one, so it's just like herp stats or anything else. You get the more up-the-diversion. I think, how high do they go up, um, stat-wise? Oh, I have no idea because I never run them really hot. So, um, I'm used to 120. No, no, I mean, like, uh, how many probes can you have for computer systems? Oh, I get what you're saying. So, I'm like, uh, I thought you meant, like, temperature-wise. Um, how many probes? I only think of this. I think, though, they're, the highest one is two. So it's not like a herp stat one where it's, you know, you could do, like, four probes, right? Or whatever. Well, not from all of them, yeah. With the herp stat. Yeah. Yeah. And then- I only issue- Yeah. My only issue with that is, I guess, it's one- I don't know. I don't know if the probability makes any sense here, but, you know, if that one fails, it's failing four different probes. You know what I mean? Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So that's why I try to think of it that way. Um, potentially. Yes, but also with herp stat, um, the probes are individual. Right. So the probe fails. It fails that one. Right. I guess your right computer system does die. It does take out four days. Yeah. Right. I'm an alarm system. You can stop. Yeah. That's still a good thing. Yeah. Perfect. And I- Perfect, but definitely nice. All right. Let's tell basic ones. I use them to run my baby racks. So I like them because also I can stack them. Yes. Beautiful features. Awesome. Yeah. They're great. Yeah. I also have a helix or an old helix thing. So move on. So use it anymore. I have a helix that I'm still using, but it's one of those things that you said that no matter how far you've come with your reptile room, you'll walk into your reptile room and you'll stare at this one thing and you're like, God, I hate that thing. So in everybody's room, you're like, soon, whenever I get around to it, you're getting your ass replaced. So I've got one helix for me. And it's one of those things where I've had some bad experiences with helixes. And I wouldn't say that it's the fault of the company helix, but it's the fault of the individual system itself and my not knowing enough to check it or recheck it or whatever. It was opened the death of a few animals. I don't know. I had some helixes and they guess I still have some. I don't use any anymore. I just recently took my last one that I had on a rack off, which was great because back in the day, they used to be like rock solid. And then I sort of bind them at a point where I'm not kidding. I lost two or three within like six months, just broke. I didn't do anything. They just turned off. And it was just terrible. Yeah. That I'm in my ankle. I do have a raincoat on my heater for my room. Right. Which is 200 watts. That's still and I ran coz to be a nightmare when you post up. You have a ran cover. You want to go like, you know, get that off your room, you know, but you have to use it for your heater. I guess it doesn't make it much better. If it literally broke and my heater ran, my room probably would get high, but it wouldn't be insane. Like it would be on a rack, you know, where they're just stuck. And all that stuff. Yeah, I use, I use, it's not a raincoat. It's another one that reptile basics use to sell. I don't see it on their website now. But it was a, it was like an all and all thermostat. Yeah, maybe, maybe I don't. Yeah, I have it. I have it downstairs, but I use it for my exhaust fan. Put it on cool. And so pretty much when the room gets too hot, the exhaust fan comes on and pushes all the air out. And we don't like that thermostat. You can set it to a cool setting. So it turns on when it wants to cool the room rather than heat the room. So that's the reason why I got that thermostat. It's an on and off. And it works fine for that. But in terms of anything I was going to attach Flex Law to, I would try not to do on and off. And I need to do, you know, post or dimming or something like that. Proportional for sure, you know. Right. Please, for the love of God, anybody who's listening, do not go to Petco. And by, you know, one of those dialy stats that's being told through like Zumet or something like that. So we're going to spend a bit more money and get something that can at least be run properly. I will say when I first started then Zumet one, not the Rio stats, the thermostat. You couldn't tell what the temperature was. You just got to like touch it. They were pretty good for me. I still have some of them in a box and I give them the people to start off. But when I say, I do say replace this as fast as you can because you don't have no idea. And eventually you'll just keep on turning that dial up and it'll, you won't be able to get anything. And it'll just keep getting hotter and hotter. You know, it's not the greatest thing, but it's better than not running one at all. You know. Yeah. Yeah. It's so funny because, you know, when I was younger and stupid, I guess, you know, I smack a, you know, one of those sheet pads under a tank plugging in and calling it a day. You know what I mean? It was a little thermostat. I mean, I kept a leopard deco for, I think, I had it for 16 years. And she just sat in a cage with one of those stick on underneath there and never had thermostat on it. Never checked temperature. Never did it in five or 16 years. It's so funny. Now, we're like, for like, meticulous. It's perfect and all that. But, you know, it's just definitely, it was stupid. I definitely want to do it again. But, you know, so I'm going to have stuff with decent. Like, someone had human stuff, but still decent. Some of it is still good. I mean, definitely the bulbs and things like that, but that's not how I eat my guys. Hell no. It's not how you're going to eat a rack now. Hell no. Yeah. Matt, what, what do you use computer system like? Do you have herb stats? I don't remember what you use. I'm trying to switch over to all herb stats. I have a lot of herb stat tours, one herb stat two. And then on the AR, my first ARS I bought has a herb stat, like the old herb stat. Look at things, but it works the same way. It's just a one. Yeah. Yeah. Stuff like a box. Yeah. But the other things I have on everything else, which is a decent thermostat is the V. I think that I got like a lot of the V 100 or 200. They all support one rack. So it's plenty pumping out. But they kind of click on and off. But it looks similar to the herb stat setup. It's like that same shape, has a green light. It shows you the temperature, whether, you know, and all that stuff. But I don't think it really has all the, it doesn't have nearly the settings that a herb stat does. So I'm in the process of trying to get all herb stat stuff. And my habitat system incubator still has a helix. They like built that thing into there. So if that ever breaks, it's going to be a mission getting it out and putting a different thermostat in. Oh, they got it like glued in on top of the wire covers. That's in your incubator, right? Yeah, it's in the incubator. It's never failed me. It's been working great for, I don't know how long I have that thing, but I think close to 10 years now. So I think the incubator looks great, but I mean, I'm surprised the helix is still working that good. So that's what I use for that. That's only here to have my room left. And like I said, I got the rain coheating my space heater. So it's all V and all herbs stat, you know. And unlike that, a lot of my animal plastics have the heat wire. That's how old my animal plastics are. I don't really have any animal plastics with the flex wire. So you have your heat wire, your the heat cable? Yeah, the animal plastics. I didn't give you an option years ago of a flex wire. I don't even have to give you an option to put the heat cable in there. Now, I think it's all flex a lot, but it's just one thick heat cable running. It goes all the way through and it's just one thing, but it works really well. I mean, especially because I have short towels and bloods, you don't need a ton of heat. So it does the job. It gives you a little strip of whatever, you know, you set up 87 and 87, but all around it, it's, you know, a little bit warmer. So everything else has flex lot. Yeah, it's not like that thin stuff that we have for the show. It's like a double. Yeah, I don't know what the heat wire is called, but it used to come with it. And you just, they cut out a groove and you kind of fish it through there. And then you'll jam it in so your sub slides good. I do know that I use a really thin cable for shows and Matt does now too. But that's cool. So real quick, obviously Zach and I were talking before the show about how we kind of like have a love-hate relationship with flex lot tape. And it's like, we absolutely need it. We absolutely use it. But I am, again, with the things that you're going to replace. I have a few strips of flex watt that use the old way of hooking up flex watt with the clamps and the plastic covers. Then I have a few that it's the new way where they actually punch the hole in it and then they put the washer on it and then like seal it with this like rubbery, plastic stuff over top. And that would be what I would want to shift over. So do you guys kind of see the appeal to the newer kind? I mean, obviously it's a little bit safer. Would you guys swap over all your stuff too when you got a chance? As long as it's working, I'm just rolling with it. It's already set. Anytime I have to pull a rack out and do something behind a rack, it is like a torture for me. I hate pulling my room apart. If a wire falls out or I got to check something, like I said, with the new thermostat, I got to constantly pull racks off the wall, get behind the wall to plug it in, run all the wires, you know, so it's not crazy sloppy back there. So I'm kind of, I'm where I'm at. As long as it's working, it's going. But all the heat stuff scares the hell out of me. Like, I think I ripped out deeper, you know, it all. You leave the house. It's like one day you don't even think about it. If you start thinking about it, you like have a panic attack. Of course. My entire reptile room is a Tinder box waiting to go up. Yeah. The one thing I want to do that I didn't even look into because I just started running on time. And if I would have been expensive, but it would have been worth it. And I moved in and I actually did a sprinkler system for the basement and I never did. And I'm sure it still could, but it might just be chaos trying to put it in with my room set already. I don't know, but it would have made me sleep a lot better at night or I shouldn't even say that. I should say when I leave the house, I wouldn't want to run home. If the wheels start turning, I'll be like, I'll just, I'll turn around 10 minutes down 95. I got to go home and check something, you know, my wife. Well, I mean, obviously, let's all admit that if our houses were on fire, we'd be the idiot sewing inside to wheel out racks. Oh, yeah. Dude, dude, don't talk about, don't talk about the episode. We're not going to talk about this. We're not talking about this. Dude, I know. Sorry. That's my fault. I had a fire in my reptile room, but it wasn't a problem. I didn't lose your mind. I did. I did. I lost my mind. I had all these big tubs that I could throw at all the snakes in the big tub, but I started to. And then I only got a couple in there before I couldn't even breathe. But everything was fine, shockingly, amazingly, nothing even. It was a Sunday and feeding day of Saturday. Nothing even regurged. Nothing. It was amazing. I love it, dude. You're like, I moved that one three feet and it had a terrible time. I'm like, but it survived a fire. Yeah. Yeah. You've been back. And the worst part about it is when it happened, it was like, oh, it's totally my fault. It's something that's probably it and here's my dryer. Part of me was relieved. And part of me was like, wait, there's still a fire in my house. Wait, my house is still on fire. Yeah. Yeah. Geez. Nope. And a fire call. Yeah, we'll get out. It's a fire call now. Yeah. What do you guys use? My temp gun wife, because my temp gun is actually is a professional one that they use in like the automotive industry to temp like engines and crap like that. And it has that thing where like if I hold the button and wave it around places, it has one number that stays constant, which is the highest temperature. It's red. And then the other one just kind of goes to wherever the dot is pointing. You guys kind of use the ones that are specific to a reptile stuff. Have you gone straight outside of the reptile world? I've got mine. Mine is the old probesotic model. That's all I got. I should get another one. I actually just want another one to have for a backup. I have like three. Yeah. I have several probesotic ones. I think they're tucked in random places. If I ever need to temp anything. Yeah. And long as I had one actually attached to my incubator because yes, I was that neurotic. Everybody is with their incubator. I think everybody temp guns their incubator here and there. You have to. That's the next thing we're going to talk about is the incubator. Now, Zach, what do you use for your incubator? I know. Mom's. Mom. All right. So. So. Zach, you're his mom. I use his mom. And mom doesn't want the eggs. And those eggs are going garbage. I'm kidding. What do I use? What do I use as an incubator? Eric's incubator. And then Eric used I want the incubator. What is going on over here? It's just cycle. Maybe we ought to get our own incubators. How about that? No, I do want to. Actually, I'm actually very curious about this because this is something I definitely want to have ready just in case Ms. Condro doesn't want to sit on hers this year. You know, if I get eggs or something, you know, because this is a joint project between me and Buddy. So I can't just be like, oh, well. Because I feel really bad. So I definitely need to get an incubator that has to be a priority. At least just winter to try to, you know, somehow get that together this winter and this little project. So I'm very curious about what you guys think. And so, yeah, have at it. But it has to be small though. I want one tabletop size. You know what I'm saying? Because I don't do a lot of clutches. So there you go. Incubators are probably your most important thing. And first rate off the bat. If you are new to this, do not buy the Styrofoam incubator. Hey, I want to know. I'm over there. I took my entire cut, my entire first clutch of carpets on. I burned because of that thing. So do not. Wait, wait. You remember the turbo home abater that just has like a fan on it? Oh, yeah. Slow. And now, yeah, it's stupid. Do not get that thing. I don't know the class. I'm guy. He's home abater. Opportunity. Do it thermostat. And it works. Congratulations. You did it. But for the most part. There are bedding products out there. The heat waffle. Oh, man. That was a bit of a shit in the world. Okay. So skip over that. The next thing actually after that, I ended up going and getting a POF incubator. And again, that's for chicken eggs. And I ended ripping out the shelves because they had shelves that would constantly rotate the eggs. I ripped those out and put stationary shells and had a little reservoir for water. And it had a whole heat thing. Now, I found out that the heat that controlled that whole thing was just larger heat waffles, or whatever the frick they called them. But it was a nice sealed wooden case. And people have used them a few kinds. And it was just heavy as hell. It wasn't that accurate. And you couldn't see the eggs through the door unless you had replaced the door with a piece of plexiglass, which I actually had. So, well, I hatched two collections in that damn thing. And then I got my refrigerator, which I'm not spending all these money on cages, but I have never bought a professionally made like incubator. So, my incubator that I currently have and I've had for years is a swear to God Coca-Cola refrigerator with a glass door that I've gutted and ran the widest heat tape you can buy up down on the floor and up the back. And then I've wired the lighting and the fan through the ranko that runs the incubator. And that's it. It works great. They haven't touched it. Don't need to add water to it. Don't need to have humidity to it. It works great. And I'm not going to do the same thing like Matt said. If it's not broken, I'm not going to fix it. No, don't fix it. Yeah. Forget it. Now, when I was building my incubator, I forget the company, but they had created this incubator that looked like a small little mini fridge. You know what I'm talking about? They were plastic. They sat on the top of your table. They had a thermostat inside of it. I'll start trying to look for it, but I've heard those things. The little ones that I'm talking about, they don't keep temperature. They fluctuate a lot, it's the reptile probe. Who makes that? The reptile probe makes it. Exotera makes one. Oh, yeah. Those are terrible. And Zumaan makes one too. Zumaan makes one too, yeah. They're tiny little. They look like little refrigerators. I've heard me now. I've heard of like 20 microwaves. They look like two microwaves. Yeah. I've heard nothing good about these things, unfortunately. I've spoken to numerous people. They said that they can't hold a temp. They can't keep anything going. See Evan knows. Shame incubator I got, thanks Evan. They're probably easy bake ovens when exotera. Exactly. You should bake oven with exotera. Andrew had a clutch of monitors and he threw them in there. And the temperature fluctuated so bad he lost the entire clutch. Oh, yeah. And I mean, it's no good. No good at all. And then he brought his next clutch to me and a hatch to my Coca-Cola refrigerator. So, it's almost like with incubators, you're either going to spend the money and get a really well put together one or do it yourself. You can pretty much do it. So, now Matt, I know you had yours built. And I like yours because yours is about as tall as mine, but it looks nicer. Yeah. And you're having a bottle for a handle. I have two of them. I actually had the refrigerator first. I had a Pepsi refrigerator. Huge one. And then I got it. I did the same thing I ran. The wide flex watt down the back and I put a little fan. It wasn't even a computer fan. It was a more powerful fan. I actually put one at the top in the back and then one on the bottom facing up. Like so, it would make like, you know, circular. And it was, I put my own shelving in there. It was great. My old house in the back of the basement. As soon as like June would hit, the room would hit like 87 back there. I don't know why it got so hot. And as soon as the warmer months came up, the incubator would have trouble. Everything would turn off when it was opposed to, but it would start getting up to like 91, 92. So after a year of losing some animals from these too hot and I had some money, I bought that have a touch system incubator, which is a great incubator. I don't even want to say what I paid for back then way too much. I could have bought five incubators now probably for that. But I guess in the long run, it kept everything safe. I will say that, you know, it was great. It fits a ton in there. And it does the job, you know, I wouldn't. Now there's just too many incubator companies that are good. I don't know what anyone would want to buy their incubator because they're just, the prices are ridiculous for them. I don't know how they sell incubators anymore. But yeah. And then I got an animal question incubator, which was, I don't know if they still make them. I think it's on the website, but who knows if they make it, it was at the time. I used to bug them. They put a picture on their website and they never sold any. And I used to call them and like, when are you making this incubator? And as soon as they did, it was, that was the first thinly show I went to when I drove my 15-passion van up, which is me and my wife and my buddy and my wife's friend. So I bought the incubator directly from Animal Plastics at the shell and drove it home. So I saved them shipping. And I was going with Italy anyway. I didn't go there for the incubator. So the animal plate for the incubator works great. And it was 750 at a time in great incubator. So I like both of my incubators. But I do want to try the hotbox. I don't know why. I have too many incubators at work. And I want to try these hotbox ones. They look nice. I heard great things about them. I don't like LED fan. I think LED light on the fan. So you know if the fan goes off all the time. I heard they're really nice. Yeah. That's the one. If I'm going to buy one, those are the ones I'm looking at. Especially if you can get them locally through sea serpent. So you can probably pick one up from hamburger. You just got to check if sea serpent is going to make it to that show. Yeah, exactly. So that's not too bad. It's just like if I could find like a tabletop refrigerator for drinks or whatever. You know, you human the malls a lot. You know, like a tabletop size where it has glass in the front. Because a lot of people have offered me like mini fridges and stuff like that. But I want one with the glass front. Eric also has like a huge, what does he have? He has like a, he has another like cooler, like a big Pepsi fridge or something that he offered me. But it's just too big. Like I wouldn't, no place to put that in my house. Like it's just too big. I need some man to put it on my table. Or I'm going to put it like it might be somewhere that's going to be small enough. Or for like maybe four clutches or the max would ever go in there. And that's all I would need it for. And you're looking at Maraleo clutches. I have a couple of six quart cups and I'm good to go. Well, maybe for you. Yeah, for me. Yeah, for me. I'm looking at something that I can use for me. I have a Coke fridge that like goes, it's a tabletop one with glass that I've already got it. And it's like two shelf size and that's it. Well, what the hell? Come take a look at it later. And if you want it, you can take it. Because I'm not. Well, that makes it easy. Anyway, anyway, there's just like, you know, obviously, you know, Eric and I joked about all the time is that you see people put a shit ton of money down on animals. And then you see people put like, keep them in plastic bins on like the floor with like. Oh, yeah. Same thing goes with incubators. You see people put a shit ton of money down on animal, but then they cheap out. They've got a piece of styrofoam. Yeah. That's so powerful. And that's what happened there to the surprise. That's the best thing you'll see on Facebook nowadays. They go, oh, quick, where do I get an incubator from? These snakes actually, you know, the mom actually laid eggs. Like they breathed a snake thinking, oh, there's no way I'm going to get eggs. And then they're shopping when they get eggs. But then it's funny because you go, you have an incubator. Just keep the mom on them. You don't have to panic. You don't have an incubator. You don't have an incubator. Yeah. I wouldn't panic if I didn't have an incubator. I would never be the guy breathing snakes would have an incubator if I plan on incubating stuff. But I'm saying, you know, they don't even think like, oh, I could just internally incubate. They have no clothes. It's annoying. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. It was just kind of one of those things. And I kind of felt like I needed to have one, but I was the dumbass who were like, oh, the styrofoam is fine. Because no one told me otherwise. You were a pre-Facebook guy. I thought you were that guy. I know. I was pre-Facebook and stuff. So, you know, I'm going to have one. What do I do with that? The stupid styrofoam bullshit is not worth the styrofoam that you're getting. Okay. It's worthless. Do not get it. Yeah. So anyway, so I would just do that. I posted pictures of my incubator. Please excuse me. It was not clean. And the funny sticker that I have on top of my incubator, which I enjoy several weeks. Anyway, so I love that sticker. Anyway, so next thing I would want to talk about is obviously feeding. Because I know that Matt and I do it a little differently. And then, Zach, I want to talk to you about your skinks and how they eat, which I know you'll love. So let's do that. So you let Zach just go. So now, I obviously get my guys frozen thawed from a breeder out in the middle of Lancaster who's got this pig barn that he's gutted and it's filled with rodents now. And it is a horrible place to visit because you just get this smell on you and you'll never go away. But he has been supplying me with rodents and my guys have lived long and very healthy lives on their rodents. But I get them probably weeks or so after they've been called and they've been frozen. Matt, you get your fresher, right? Like, does she kill them the day she sends them out to you? No, I get Lyme. She gets Lyme. Yeah, so I do SOS rodents. Sophia runs it. If you've ever been to Hamburg, she's next to me. She's in the back. She has a couple of shiv'n end cap. She has almost everything and anything you want. And I'm lucky enough to where she delivers on the weekends. She glibbers in a photovoltaic zoo, certain pet stores, and then just breeders if they order enough. And I'm lucky enough to where I buy enough. She drives right to my house and meets me at a certain time every Saturday and I just come out of my house 11 o'clock and she gives me all my feeders. So everything is live and I pre-kill everything myself. Okay. I see right on the spot. I see fresh pre-killed, except for it. Now I've never been frozen thawed until I got condoms and now I kinda text. I still, even though she does frozen thawed, I tilt them myself and freeze them. Although she does frozen thawed the right way because I hear nightmares about frozen thawed stuff, but I'm not that experienced in them. But yeah, so I would agree. Yeah, it's great. I mean, she general, like I said, I can get gerbils, hamsters, African softfurs, rabbits, you know, she's getting pigs. She has chicks normally. She can give you chickens. She has so much. She had a couple buildings full of rodents and all kinds of other stuff for pet and animal use feeding. So she's awesome. Cool. It's going to be one of the things where I'm probably going to have to be moving my olive pythons onto any pigs, children, which is. How relevant. You should check, you should check because you don't just live in a Philly. I mean, if you ever needed to, if you around here in the boobinies. Yeah, well, she's from, she's from similar, like, old EPI or something, I believe. So I don't know if she could be close to you. She, I mean, she only 20, 30 minutes from Hamburg. So. Right. Yeah, and she does frozen and she'll set stuff aside for it. Yeah, you should check her places and I know she's quality. You won't have to visit that terrible place. You say if you're going with her. So she's awesome. I mean, I sit there every, every weekend. I got to get like the cleaning and we wind up bullshitting for about a half hour outside. So it's. Nice. Funny as hell on a good conversation. Yeah, she cracks me up. If you were enough, you can get delivery rodents to your door without having to worry about filling a box from. Road. That's amazing. Yes. I've been extremely spoiled. I think I started using her. My buddy used to work at a pet store and he used to like, he used to hook me up. We used to get, he used to give me the wraps for, because he was a snake breeder too. So he used to just hook me up for the prices he would get, which was cost. And he eventually got a new job. And so I was like screwed. And I started talking to her at Hamburg and it just so happened that she delivered. Somewhere close to my old house, so I would meet her and I started buying so much. She goes, I'll come directly to you because you buy enough. So I'm, yeah, so ever since she delivers right to my door. That's awesome. That's amazing. Hey, you know, it's one of those things that like Matt one day is going to have to go get rodents himself. He's going to forget how to do it. I say all the time. I'm like, you can never retire. I don't even know what I would do. I'm so, I don't even have a backup plan. I would just be calling you. I'm like, what do you guys do? You know, I'd be trying to freakin out. So, all right. So, Zach, I know for your guys you get, you get your rodents from the same place. Eric got. Yeah. Yeah. We have a, we have a lady out in New Jersey and she, you know, she kind of works close to Eric. Well, it's a little out of his way. It's not too bad. And so, I've bought once a month or every other month, Eric goes and he picks stuff up. And I just pretty much add to his order. So, you know, because obviously he's getting a lot more than I am. So, I just kind of go, yeah, just add another, you know, 100 small rats, another 100 hoppers and, you know, sort of thing. And we get them. Prices are really good. And she always puts extras in there sometimes. We put a big order in. She'll put another 20 in there. Just because. That's like. You know. It's great because it'll hook you up, you know, if you're, if you're, if you're, I, that'll be my suggestion that everyone is get some money that you're going to be consistently getting from. And you will become a customer. Because if you become a, you know, a customer, you're going to get to hook up. That's just, that's just what it is. You're going to get better customer service by doing that. I mean, literally we call her. I call her what I, you know, get the word from Eric that he's going to go pick some stuff up the next day. I call her, she goes out to the thing, or her husband, and they go kill them that night and freeze them overnight. And they truly are super fresh when I get them the next day. It's an amazing, you know, kind of setup we have. So it works out. It's super convenient to me because then all I have to do is draw the Eric's and pick them up. You know, so it just, it works real well. And the prices are good. And I've never had a problem. She does mice, rats, African softfords. I think she does a few other things. But, you know, she just does exactly what I need. So I never have a problem, really. That's awesome. I know she doesn't really advertise much because it just seems like she has enough clients that she doesn't really need that, you know, she never has extra, it seems. You'll never really see her post, you know, so I don't know. So we're not going to share her pretty much as well. So if you're wondering anybody in the field of the era, shoot ours. You all can go to hell. And yeah, I should say that too. Like, I need to specify. I've ordered a lot. So please not going to deliver to you if you get two small rats and an amount of a week. Can I have a bag? Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Don't go to. How much on average, how many, how many rotors do you order a week? I don't know. Yeah, Matt. Matt. Oh, I don't, I don't know a lot. I don't know. Let's put it this way. Do you guys know your rodent bills off the top of your head? Yeah. My mind is, when it's a lot different, but usually in the summer between, depending on how heavy or when I go smaller or bigger, my rodent bill of anywhere between 275 to possibly 350 a week. So you can see why he gets stuck delivered to his house. When you're buying that many rodents. So every week. Yeah. Yeah. But I don't, I don't play every week. I will take off a few weeks. And then obviously in the winter, it gets way easier. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm more of a heavy feeder. And like I said, I have bigger bodies. Big snakes. Yeah. But believe it or not, I think, oh, he's probably seen in the short belt. Like they mostly get medium rat. Some get larges. And then only moms that look like flat tires. There were my old stocks of a huge jumbo here and there once in a while. Right. Right. And then we take four, five, six, seven pound rabbits, you know, whatever. Yeah. See, with my guy, the price kind of varies because he does cater to a lot of other breeders. So it's like medium rats in the winter time are really cheap. So I actually buy up more medium rats because I always know when the ball fights on have now come out of their, you know, down because the price of medium rats has gone up. Because that's terrible though, man. That's things. It does. No, it shouldn't change. But of course now I don't pay what is marked on the board. So I see the price, but I've not done anything. But it's almost like during the winter time is when he has a bunch of animals, but not a lot of people are selling because everybody or not a lot of people are buying because all their animals are down for winter or something like that. So that's when he'll be like, hey, do you want an extra bag of jumbo's for like nothing? And I'm like, yes. So like in the winter, that's when my freezer is like crammed full of rodent. I mean, it is stuffed and I'm only paying about like 400 maybe a month or something like that. Do you realize you're giving away your secret now, right? You do realize that? They don't know what my name is. I didn't say. Oh, okay. Okay. Forget all these people listening. So I'm going to say you're going to be putting up your flea market is going to be packed now with people. Not my rap, but jumbo bags. So anyway, that's how it rolls. The 400 a month for your collection, man. That's crazy. I know, right? I will. Did you get too much diamonds? They're huge. Anyway, sorry. Yeah, lots of money. It's almost like, and then now, Zach, going back to feeding. Yeah. This skinks. Oh, God. What the hell? What the hell do you feed those things? And what would you recommend to somebody? Because I know I was listening in a conversation that you and Eric were having about the snake sausages. That I can't bring myself to use, but that made a lot of sense for somebody like you that has animals that might eat, you know, dog food. And maybe this is better for them. So what do you feed them and then kind of what would you take them as often? Well, yeah. The skinks is kind of a different thing. There are omnivores in the wild. And out of necessity more than out of need, necessity. Then I guess they have to be omnivores in the wild because they live in the nicest places. And so generally speaking, they eat whatever they can find. But what we have found in captivity is they're pretty -- they do very well in captivity on a higher protein diet than what most people were feeding them for a long time. And so now the standard is dog food here in the United States. And a lot of people like you're going to feed dog food to a reptile? Absolutely. And most people say, you know, because you hear those stories of people feeding dog food to their iguana and stuff and a thing dying in like four years or whatever and things like that. And this is the one reptile that you can feed dog food exclusively and it will live 30 years. It's just kind of the way they are. I don't know what miracle has happened. But dog food has become a diet that the amount of vegetables and protein and carbs and everything else is in dog food actually pretty much mirrors exactly what skinks eat in the wild. Which is pretty crazy and really convenient. And so, you know, breeder is new about this forever and we're suggesting people to use dog food forever. I know that Ray down there, Ray, he's like a big time blue folk skin breeder. He lives down in Florida, whatever. He's been using dog food for forever. I mean, literally for the last 20 years or so that he's been working with them and has to have a problem using it. Actually, he started having problems when he tried to vary up the diet with more vegetables and things like that because growing babies need a lot of protein. And so, he found that dog food is a majority of what animal gets better off. And so, you know, there's still a lot of controversy about that as you can imagine because people think that's not natural. Well, neither is keeping them in boxes, right? You know, or like neither is heat tape. Neither is, you know, you're redoing a lot of things. It's not about what's more natural. It's about what's going to work more effectively. And it's going to take out all the guess words. Dog food is quality dog food. I'm not talking about no alpo, right? I'm talking about quality dog food. No kangaroo meat. No, right. Yeah, quality dog food that is whole prey that has no grain free generally is what I use. You know, that doesn't have any fillers. You're talking about, you know, you're talking about $5 a can type of stuff, that's why there were $3 a can rather than, you know, $0.50 a can type of stuff. That's why it's going to be higher quality. And they're using whole animals. They're using the organ meat, they're using the bones, they're using everything, which is exactly what I know that they're doing with those new links. And it's also like the same idea. The sausage idea, I think, is great, I think, for some species that is warranted. It definitely is going to help. Things like KU's, I think it's perfect. I don't see myself using it for the blue tones and been working so great. And, you know, I really don't see a benefit to switching. Now, when they were talking, this is on Nick's show, Reese's recent show. And then when they were talking about maybe using these sausages for snakes, it makes a lot of sense, because what you're doing is you're getting all that filler that's in rodents, such as hair, and a lot of their digestive tract, which is full of nothing but crap, and all that stuff, you're getting rid of that, and you're just putting nothing but the whole animal inside these sausages. It's a higher density meal. So it's a meal that's already pre-grinded, and it's a higher density in terms of calories and the person nutrition. And so it's just generally more healthy than feeling something that's majority filled crap, literally. And digestive system and hair, and stuff like that. Well, I see myself switching over to it, maybe not. I just because, you know, rodents are a cheaper, I mean, that's just the bottom line. What I find interesting about it is the concept of using it for something like baby conjure. We're feeding small snakes, you know, pinkies. Pinkies are mostly water. If you look at makeup of a pinkie, it's mostly moisture, it's water. And then the rest of it is mostly fat, and then some protein, and a little bit of calcium. But you're mostly getting a little lot of fat and moisture. And, you know, generally speaking, when you feed that to an animal, the other end comes as really floppy, nasty food. And we feel a lot of issues with baby conjurels like prolapses and things like that, and yet we like to blame hydration a lot. But it can also be that we're feeding them pinkies, something they will never eat in the wild. You know, they're eating little skinks and little lizards and stuff, and they're wild as a majority of their diet. You know, if you talk to somebody like Daniel, she tells you, you know, they're feeding on decent-sized skanks that you wouldn't even imagine they could eat. They're eating in the wild as first meals. And, of course, a little skink is going to have a lot more protein and a lot more calcium and it's going to be a more complete meal. So I can see having those, like, making little tiny sausages, which is what they were talking about making. The size of pinky, I could see that as something I would use for conjurels. I can definitely see that happening. I only have that bond with my carpets because they start off with hoppers, a more complete diet. I feel a more clean animal, so I know I don't feel like I really need to do that with them. But for conjure, definitely, I'm definitely keeping an eye on it, and I cannot wait. I'll be the first one to order pinky size of those when I get my conjure babies because I think that may work out. But in terms of the blue tongs, I go to a pet store. I buy, you know, I used to buy Merrick because they used to have a pet co-near me, and they sell Merrick talk to, which is really high quality stuff. I stopped using them because pets weren't going to carry that, and now I use a blue buffalo, but they're wild kind. I don't know what it's called, but it's like a wild wolf version where it's like nothing but meat. There's no filler in it at all, and I use that. I use the canned stuff, and I do 50% canned and 50% dry. Dog food, mix it up, and that's what I feed them. Super easy. I know a lot of people right now are actually transitioning not only away from wet dog food, but our transitioning to dry dog food only. There's a bulldog, dry dog food, and their skinks are doing fine. I haven't done that yet. I've thought about doing that, but they don't seem to eat as much, so you have to keep the bull in there almost a lot longer because they only nibble on that rather than going full bore needs the whole thing. They always peach skinks once a week. A lot of people peach skinks. One of them, I only see my adults once a week, and babies twice a week. That's it. They get, and I've been fine on that regime. The dry dog food, a lot of people keep it constantly. When the skink is hungry, they don't nibble on it. It's consistently peach skink without them overeating because generally they just eat it because it's there and not because they really like it, if that makes any sense. You don't have as much of a tendency for them to overeat on dry dog food because it doesn't really smell all that much food you're used to. It's kind of a mixed bag. I want to try it, but it's super simple. I go buy a bag of dog food. I'm good for a few months when it comes to the skinks. That's another reason why I love them. It's just so easy. I used to do roaches. I used to do all this crazy stuff, and roaches became a headache. I felt myself take care of them more than I was taking care of my animals. The population would bloom too much, and I wouldn't be able to feed them off as much as they were growing. It was just too much work. I was literally giving people thousands of roaches every few months because I was overwhelmed with them. But if you're going to be feeding anything that's expector, each insect, definitely go for roaches or something like that. I'm pretty much, apparently, I'm getting rid of every day that eats insects in my house. I'm done because we're all by snakes, and I'm not going back. I'm not going back. I'm done. I'm good. I've kept that stuff. I've read that stuff. I love it. I've kept that good. I've done all that stuff, but I'm just done. At least now, I've been working more. Maybe I want to have more time on my hands maybe again, but that's kind of where I'm at with that stuff. Stinks are easy. Works. Let's jump back to some of the other stuff we've got going on here. Obviously, I would see that there would be some use to feeding with the snakes with that stuff. Now, Zach, do you have hooks, columns, things like that that you use? Yeah. I use two hooks. Two different kinds of hooks for everything I do in my room. They're nothing fancy. I picked them up at just the hamburg. I actually picked both of them up. Two different hamburgs. The first hook is an ultralight hook. It's about, I don't know, maybe 18 inches, I think. The hook is maybe dangerous as a small hook on it. It's super lightweight. It's like maybe the weight of a pen or something. I just use that for really nippy babies. I go and I hook them just to hook them off and not just to call them now before I go in there. I'll use that for that. For my adults or anything a little bit bigger than that, I use a two foot cage hook. It's just a two foot hook. I feel like a lot of people would like those four foot python hooks with that plastic scoop. I think Eric has one of those things. It's just for what I do. It's just too big. I like the two footer because it's just an extension of my hand. I could just tap them with it or I could kind of manipulate them. Just here in my hands, you're fine. I think the two foot hook is perfect. That's pretty much it, man. That's all I use there. It turns it like staining tongs and stuff like that. I have hemostats and every size and every tweezer that I think has been ever made. It's just because I have a fascination with everything stainless steel. I don't know why that's the case. But I have a volunteer board. There's one in the picture of it on the group now for this in the background. It's a volunteer board and I stick a little thumb-taxing and I just hang all my utensils there. It's just something I like to look at. I don't know. It's weird. Every time I look at this new tweezer feeding tweezer I found on Amazon. I think Buddy posted one recently. I just usually order it just because I just like having that stuff around. Good, like 18 inch hemostats is good. You're going to be perfectly fine to feed in most things with that and not get bit. I saw the two foot ones. I find the two foot ones too unwieldy. It tends to be a little too heavy for my hands. I do have small hands. It just tends to be too unwieldy and I don't really need it. But 18 inch are fine and I usually do an eight inch hemostats when feeding babies and stuff like that. I try not to get the non-blocking. I can't stress that enough. Non-locking if you can because it sucks having a snake wrap around your hemostats and then they're locked at the same time. It's a mess. I try to get them all. It's a mess. If you do the non-locking it's easier to go the web and it's quicker if it's a non-locking. This is what I find. I actually made both of my hooks. Oh, fancy. Yeah, both of my hooks. Are my back on? I was making sure. Yeah, you're here. Anyway, I made both of my hooks and actually my one hook was made because I bought a cheap ass piece of crap hook. And it broke. At Hamburg and a few other places you can get those fancy collapsible hooks that like telescope in and out of each other. Oh, yeah. Yeah, they break all the time. It was the funniest type of aluminum ever. So that of course snapped in half and I had the remnants of it and then I took a golf club, cut the head off of it, inserted the remnants of the one hook and kind of like welded them and stuck it all together and glued it all solid. And that's been my hook forever. So I made those but then I bought a bunch of the Midwest tongs. I guess whatever you would call them tongs or something like that. But I don't really use them the way you're supposed to like grabbing the snake or whatever. I usually use them to feed my big guys so I got like some distance. Gotcha. Then I use the same thing you do e-mistats and things like that. Matt, I know you have some larger hooks for your guys. I also know you're a crazy person. Use your hand a lot. So. Yeah. I guess we just bought one of them really big hooks from the last hamburger show. I thought it looked cool and I guess I could use it. It's like 55 inches and it's got the big flat looking hook. Yeah, the big tripod hook. Yeah. Yeah, I bought. Yeah, I got two grips on there. I just format my kid like my kid very like. So. He bought. So he, he likes playing with that too. Yeah. And then I don't have many other hooks. I have a golf club hook. Kind of like how you said. Right. And I have a couple small hooks I guess for babies and. Now I'm a really stuff. My carpets and everything like that. Yeah, that's it. I'm not like a big hook collector like you guys. I've seen all your rooms. You just have tons of stuff like hanging on the wall. And they're never, they're always across the room when you need. So regardless of where they are. When I'm in trouble, they're on the opposite end of the room. Okay. So. That is. The wetlands are gone, but yeah. Luckily in my room, everything like I could touch. I could probably really touch one side and the other with my arm. In my little closet slash room. Situation I got. But I tell you what, I was always right there. You know, it's like always the arm lights away when I'm in there. But, you know. Lucky. Yeah. That's why I couldn't even have a big hook if I wanted to. This is like, I wouldn't be able to. To turn. Yeah. Yeah. You're like wall to wall. Yeah. Yeah. And then, and like you said, I rarely, I was used to kind of move stuff out of the way. And then I kind of just get in there. Right. But it was in short tails. If you're going to use anything, it, it's things to have to use a glove. I know everyone's like, Oh, they don't use a glove. They don't hook real well. So sure. And they don't, they really don't hook well. So if they are crazy tempered with, I don't really have any like that. I kind of just use a lid. Actually, I just go in there regular with my hand and take a lid. And get around that first little bit of neck and then they can't get me. It's like a shield. So. That worked pretty well. So lived to work well, I know read tip keepers use other use on paper towel roll. I don't even use a full roll of paper towels. That seems to be their favorite thing. And I've had that. Yeah. So I never, I never tried that. I just seemed like, I guess I'm not that experienced with my retics. I kind of just go in there and I just cap them on the head. And I just start trying to like get them out. Mine are, mine are pretty good temper. Besides time, Eric was over. And the one girl tried to eat my hand. But that was she wasn't there. So she's had to gently eat my hand. It was my own fault. But you know, nothing happened. But it was all good. It was just funny because it was the first time Eric was to my house. Right. And a reach that kind of consumed me. Yep. Yeah, but it was, it was in the most gentle way. It was the funniest thing. And I was like, I think the research is doing something. I'm like, yeah, trying to eat my hands. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And as far as I just have the big tons or tweezers, I guess you could say I have three different sizes. And I did buy them things that Buddy mentioned. Buddy Buscemi. Yeah. It's good to train thing because if I'm going to get into Kondros and I remember starting a few with the littler ones I had. The one you had to like let go at the right time. If not, it would take it and drop it. So I was like, I'll get one of them. Because they have like no grooves. So kind of it comes off really easy. I don't know if you could like, I don't know how to explain it. But it works really good. I heard Buddy talking about it. I'm like, yeah, I'm going to order me some of them. So. Cool. So real quick because I know we're already on recording at this point now. I want us to quickly touch. And I know this is going to be Matt's favorite subject. And that is water bowls and water dishes. Yes. Yeah. Now my day has come. So now what I use is I use stoneware for everything that I can get stoneware for. Or heavy crocked dishes. And I did post up on the rally python radio Facebook page linked to the restaurant store. Which if there is a restaurant, if there is a restaurant store in your area. I would recommend highly going there. They have these things that are many fluted to play dishes that are perfect as baby bowls. And then of course those two plate dishes do kind of grow depending on what your need is. So you can get medium to possibly even large bowls that can be used for this. I mean, I've seen people spend a ton of money on cases of stoneware bowls. You don't really need to go that far because it's almost like for 12 bucks. You get a whole case of these little mini souffle, souffle dishes and you're good at all. So what do you use Matt for your. What about. My I use the same thing. I go I go stoneware crocked dishes. I kind of the things that everybody basically sees them brown or tan looking bowls with the blue inside. I just search constantly on Amazon when I have money and there's you can find great. You can find deals where they're like the big five or seven inch ones are like a dollar 95 for however many the store has left. So I try I'm still I like I like to try to get all them although there's different brands of them too. I don't know why some of them are great and some of them don't like so much, but I do have them. And my whole room is that except for one rack is still these awesome target dog bowls which were big crocked bowls, but they have like a puppy dog on the inside and the stripe. Yeah, they look goofy as hell, but they were 99 cents. I like cleaned out a bunch of targets when that happened. And I had the same thing like these two play it was like a bigger bowl and then a little bowl in there and they were like wrapped. And a couple 99 cents was around Philadelphia had them and I like cleaned them out and it was perfect for all the baby stuff. Yeah, people were just like why do you need this many bowls like that. I'm a master chef. You wouldn't you wouldn't understand that. So, yes, I try to go with all them. I use the three, the four, the five, seven inch. I think I even got. I don't know if the big ones are the nine or ten inch for I have them in with the retics. So, yes, I try to have all uniform water bowls along with everything else. I constantly search Amazon when I got money. Yep. Oh, I don't do belly cup. I fill my water bowls up. No belly cup. I scrub water bowls. Yep, I fill the water bowls up too. I know Eric does a little like. Yeah, I go old school and I sit there and use this soap and hard sponges and scrub my water bowls. Yep. So, never mind. So, you put the plastic inside the crack dish, right? Zach? Well, what I do is more depends on kind of the cage, but generally I use two. Well, for baby, they use two ounce deli, well, portion cups, and I put them in two inch couplers. You could get these two inch couplers like Home Depot, if you like a dollar piece or something. They're like, you know, little couplers for PVC and they perfectly fit a two ounce cup, which is perfect for baby, you know, carpets. You know, it's just big enough where if they want to, they could go in there. But, you know, it's pretty much just drinking water and that's it and you're tiny and I could just throw those out easy when I'm changing if they get too funky. Sometimes I'll like, you know, just refreshing the water or whatever, but if they get real gnat, like they took a shit in it, still don't have to worry about, you know, cleaning any bowls, any little bowls or anything like that. So, that works great to them. For the condros, I use kind of, I use big, well, six quart tubs as, you know, bottom water bowls for their cages, and so they use to take a shit in there. And I find my males like to snorkel. They like to swim with their nose on the bottom of it. I don't know what that's about, but they definitely use that. And then they also have, they're called coop cups. You attach them to bird cages and they're little stainless steel cups attached to a side of a bird cage that just pop up or out or whatever. And, you know, I have those in my conjure cages, so I have perch height water dishes. And with those, I take a four ounce cup. No, it's like three and a half ounce, whatever portion cup. So it's wider than the two ounce. And then I put that in there. And so I just switch those cups out when I need to. So that keeps your water well fresh, and I'll have to, like, it's so easy to use that way. I also use those same deli cups or portion cups and the midget, they're called midget crock dishes. You can see them on reptile basic sites. I bought like one of them when they had a sale, like a dollop, 50 a piece, whatever, like a long time ago. And, you know, I've been using those and now every time I want more, I just, I bought, I now have to have it all uniform. It's really bad. So now, like, I have to order from them now. Like, I don't have anything like that's it. So now I use those for, you know, 15 quartiles. And then, for adult carpets, there were these water bottles from Petco that was in their budget. Like, they have this little section they used to have right before you would leave the store. And it was all their really budgeted cheap shit clearance area, but it was like this cheap, like, everything was a dollar in this area type of thing. And they had these no tip water bowls, you know, where it's like wider on the bottom, like, that's everything, no tip. They're probably maybe like eight inches in diameter and they're per, or six maybe, and they're perfect. And there were a dollar apiece. I bought every single one of that Petco. I think I bought like 12 of them at the time. I was like, these are amazing. They put them in a dishwasher. They're fantastic. Nobody's ever been able to tip them. No matter what animal I've used this for, they are perfect size. Everything is about those great, but I cannot find them again. I've been trying to find new bowls for the last few years now because every time I just want them, I want them so bad because they were cheap and they were great. Now, like, I go and I see these bowls that are not tipped, but they always have that little hand hole where you can put your hand underneath and pick it up. Like, you would think that's good for a dog, but it's terrible because the snakes put their heads on that thing and just flip that. And it's like, in totally ruins, the whole idea of why it's not tipped, and it's like, what are you doing? Every time I see one that doesn't have a hand hole underneath there and it's cheap, I try to pick it up because they totally ruined it. But if I could ever find those in, I'd buy, I shouldn't look to every Petco in the area and just bought all of them. Buy a hundred of them because they're great. They were absolutely perfect. They're lightweight because the crop dishes sometimes they get real heavy and you drop them, they break. These, you could throw them. You could use a Frisbee and they'll never break. You don't get all the crop bowls. Yeah, you can't be dropping bowls, actually. Yeah, well, I know I can't be dropping bowls, but yeah. Don't be doing that. And the only other thing I use, I also use a big stainless steel dog bowl for my two big cages, but for my blue thunks, I have the tub that has the water bowl holder or cup molded into the tub. I know you're saying, yeah. Yeah. And I don't use it for the snakes because I like to use newspaper and I like to lay it in my newspaper really flat. And I don't want to buy those ones. I had to pre-cut circles in them like now. Yeah. So I use unprinted newspaper with those, so I don't use that for them. But for the blue thunks, it's great because they use mulch. And what's amazing about them is they're tall enough where blue thunks are big a lot, so they kick a lot of the mulch up. And I used to use regular water bowls. They would fill their water bowls with mulch in a few hours, generally. Like the next day, their water bowl would be full with mulch. But now, being as taller, they don't get mulch in it. They could still drink from its fine, and it's molded around the tub, and it puts a belly cup, pulled a belly cup out, dump it out, put more water in. Boom. It's so easy. I don't know why not everybody has blue thunks, but to keep them with these exact stuff. It's so good there. You must show them the way. I have shown the way, but that's my water bowl spiel. Those are my different water bowls I used. So now we've finally done the water bowl thing. And obviously, we're probably missing a few things like tubs and other crap like that. If you have anything you'd like us to do or review on, please email us at info@melleyathice.com. If we get enough, we'll probably do another one of these things again. Maybe we'll start it a little bit better. Anyway, that was a lot for time to end. So I'm going to run down some stuff. You guys are going to stick with me. And then after I'm done running down the stuff, I want you guys to draw out your websites and all your fun stuff. Just bear with me for a bit. What we have coming on is next week, we have Dave D on, and we're doing rough scale Python talk. High reading and raising of rough scale Python, which we all know is because Eric now has got that bug and shot. I think we've all gotten that bug to be our end. I know. I'm actually, I'm very surprised all these conjures is dudes buying over here, Mr. Matt. I'm surprised you didn't have. You didn't pick up rough scale by now. My lord. For me, I know. I don't know what it is. Give me some time. Anyway, you can check out the website at merleapplythonradio.com. You can email us at info@merleapplythonradio.com. If you have any ideas of where you have cited a Bigfoot or if there's any type of information that you would like to pass on to Eric, please email him at eric@ebmerlea.com. Anything would be helpful. Any kind of sightings that you may have seen yourself, please email Eric. It's very interesting. Please give us some feedback and give us a like on our Facebook and Twitter page at merleapplythonradio on Twitter. And merleapplythonradio on Facebook. You can download us on iTunes. The only way you're going to hear the recorded stuff that happens after the live version. So do it. Next up is we have the carpet fest. The northwest carpet fest is October 3rd and that is in Seattle, Washington. They're trying to get ahead count. So if you're going, please contact Amy via Facebook and join the event on Facebook page so they can get a number of the attendees. Also, they are hoping to have an auction for U.S. Arts. So if you want to donate any items or if you're interested in donating or even contributing, please again contact Amy. The southwest carpet fest is September 12th. It's coming up soon. That is in Texas. You can contact Evan Browder or Bill Stegel for more details. And they definitely want you guys to come out for that when they keep trying to push for me and Eric to come. I'll send a hobbit, but I don't think I can do it. If you are looking for to purchase a carpet python or a type of merlea, go over to the Breeders Direct. It's the best place to buy merlea pythons on the web because you're buying them direct from the breeder. You're getting it from the guy who hatched it and you can give you all the information that you need to be successful in merlea. Alright, now I'm going to pretend to be Eric right now and you can go check out my website at ebmerlea.com. So ebmerlea.com, that's Eric. I know he's producing a lot of stuff. He's got a lot of babies that are cooking as well as a lot of babies that are getting ready to roll. I know he's got some albino stuff still hanging out there, some sun glow stuff, some good stuff. So if you have any questions, again contact him at Eric@ebmerlea.com also with your Sasquatch sightings too. So send that on through to him. And if you also check out the Facebook page at ebmerlea on Facebook, you can even message him about Bigfoot on ebmerlea Facebook page. Go ahead and do that. So he came to leave me. So what we have here is his next show. He will be on carpet row at Timley Park and I will be with him. We'll be splitting a table. So we'll be under the merlea python radio banner, but we will have rogue stuff as well as ebmerlea. And I'm sorry it's a Southern Carpetfest. I want to send stuff with. Thank you Evan. It is the Southern Carpetfest. That's my fault. So don't miss out on Timley if you can make it. If you can't, sorry, try this harder. Also, if you have not done it yet, go over to USARC and show your support for USARC. Become a member. Make a donation. If you are somebody who uses ship your reptiles constantly, it doesn't hurt to give them $1 out of every shipment towards USARC. They are here to support our rights as reptile keepers as well as allowing us to keep the animals that we want to keep. So now to thank my two guests who came on to watch me completely flounder. That would be Matt Minitola and Zach Vias. Thank you again guys. Matt, why don't you go ahead and throw out your stuff and tell us when we can see you again in the show. Okay, you can check me out on my website at sillyherp.com. It has pictures and some info. It's not very up to date. So for up to date stuff, you can just go over to Facebook and search "fillyherp" or "fillyherp" culture. I think Facebook backslash "fillyherp" or just put it in the Facebook search and I'll pop up I'm sure. The next show I will be at is "Termly Park" probably right next to you guys is what I requested. Let's hope so. Yes, I requested that last year. Yes, I'm pretty sure I will be. And then a week after that where Owen will be too, I'm sure is... Yes. A week or so. Certainly. Back hell week all the time. "Termly" is awesome and not that Hamburg isn't but a week after "Termly". So in the Hamburg, you're pretty torturous to drag yourself back up there. It's definitely a warning. No. Yes, so that is where I will be. Zach, how about you? Well, you can contact me at "Dark Side Exotics" on Facebook. "Dark Side" is two words. And yeah, I got some stuff for sale. I'm going to try and move some of those coals. I'm also playing up a few projects I'm letting go. Try to slim down a little bit. You know what it is? All these blue tones then. It's freaking blue tones. I got to tell you. So it's a lot of them carpet projects. I'm pretty much having the carpet collection. Let me be honest, after it's going. Oh, no. Yeah, it's just going to happen. I want to pretend it's not, but that's happening. So a lot of stuff is going to be put up for sale. Don't worry, none of the ideas are leaving. What else? So yeah, you can contact me there. I'm happy to answer any questions you may have on any of the stuff that I talked about. You can, yeah, I will be at Tinley. I will be carrying their displays and watching their tables when they're in the bathroom. And you know, the usual stuff. And running around telling them what cool stuff I can see that they can't see because they're at their tables. You know, the usual stuff. Like what we did last year. It's going to be great. So definitely come by, check us out, talk about Blue Tongues. It'll be good. So for sure. And we're going to have a lot of party. It's going to be a party weekend. Come on out. And that's it. And if anybody is going to be hanging in Denmark, and they don't see you there, all our Danish listeners. And other than that, that's it, man. All right. The one last thing I would want to say is that just happened, Mr. Ryan Young, past guest of ours, has posted up on the awesome My Assess page on Facebook, a DUNS Python. Well, I do see that one. I want it. So I'm just going to stare at that for the next 10 minutes. So gentlemen, thank you again for being on. And I will catch up with you guys sooner. And yeah, we'll have you back on when we need you. So can we get your made for this episode, the training rec episode? I'm going to change the made. Also, this will be my last episode. I quit. I quit. Oh, yeah. Out. Come out. So, all right, guys. Well, I'll say to you guys, and I'll say to everybody out there listening is thank you all for listening. And good night, everybody. We'll catch you next week for some more Morelia Python radio. Good night. Hey, Chad Brown here. You may remember me as a linebacker in NFL, whereas a reptile breeder and their owner of Proxox. I've been herping since I was a boy, and I've dedicated my life to advancing the industry and educating the community about the importance of reptile. I also love to encourage the joy of breeding and keeping reptiles as a hobbyist, which is why my partner, Robin and Markle, and I create the reptile report. The reptile report is our online news aggregation site, bringing the most up-to-date discussions from the reptile world. Then at the reptilereport.com, every day to stay on top of latest reptile news and information. We encourage you to visit the site and submit your exciting reptile news. Photos and links so we can feature outstanding breeders and hobbyists just like you. The reptile report offers powerful branding and marketing exposure for your business, and the best part is, it's free. If you're a buyer or breeder, you've got to check out the reptile report marketplace. 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