TV Guidance Counselor
TV Guidance Counselor Episode 18: JoAnn Willette
- Wait, you have a TV? - No, I don't like to read the TV guide. Read the TV guide, you don't need a TV guide. ♪ Follow me tonight ♪ ♪ Follow me tonight ♪ ♪ Follow me tonight ♪ ♪ Ah ♪ (upbeat rock music) - Hello and welcome to TV Guidance Counselor. It is Wednesday, time for a brand new episode. I am Ken Reed, your TV guidance counselor. I am freshly back from Los Angeles. I recorded some great episodes out there that I'll be releasing over the next few weeks and months and I think you're gonna love them. But my first episode that I'll be releasing from L.A. might be my favorite episode we've released so far. This is a big deal for me. As you know, if you're a regular listener, I am a huge fan of the television show "Just the Ten of Us." It was one of my favorite shows growing up. I think it's very funny. I still watch it today and still enjoy it. And so that's why it is my great pleasure to have as my guest this week, Joanne Willett, who played Connie on "Just the Ten of Us." She's had a long and great career on television and it was great to talk to her. She is funny and fascinating and has a million great stories. So I think you're gonna love this episode. If you're new to the podcast, we broke format a little bit with Joanne here. We kind of just got a stack of TV guides from the 80s and we flipped through them. And she just told stories that occurred to her based on looking at these TV guides. So it was a little bit different, but just as entertaining, if not more so. So I think you'll enjoy it very much. So please enjoy this week's episode with my guest, Joanne Willett. (upbeat music) ♪ So what's on TV ♪ ♪ So what's on TV ♪ ♪ So what's on TV ♪ ♪ So what's on TV ♪ Joanne Willett, thank you so much for doing the show. - Well, thank you, Karen. - You're welcome. - I have celied her table here with all kinds of TV guides that we've been flipping through. - Yes, TV guide has just taken over my kitchen table. - It has, but it's taken over my brain. - Well, I think you're almost like a TV guide reporter. - Yeah, oh, absolutely. - I mean, there's a fine line can between hoarding and collection. - It really is true. - And I think we've reached that point. - Oh, we reached that quote a while ago, I think. Yeah, and I try to tell myself, if they're organized, it's okay. - Yeah, and you know what? You can also get away with it by saying that you've actually found a purpose. 'Cause real orders just, they just collect junk. - Right, they're like, I'm gonna need these old newspapers at some point. - No, so thank goodness. - Yes, I do actually need them. And I'm hoarding things on two coasts now, which is, I don't know if that's unprecedented. - Well, that is, that's a whole other show in itself. - That really is, by coastal orders. - Like coastal orders. - Yeah, my friend Timo, I mentioned before, when I was coming out to do some episodes, I'm like, oh, can I sorry if I sent you a box? And he just, when I saw how large the box was in the context of his apartment - Oh, no, he had to pay extra heavy fee. - He may have, he may have just been counted as a roommate. (laughing) - He said, I should have just rented a room - No, I know. - from the box, it's sub-least for the movies. - He sub-least for the TV guys, yeah. - So we didn't pick a specific issue, we've just kind of been going through. - No, because I'm just so blown away with, it's like a Schmorgas board here. - Yeah, yeah. - It's not like a TV guy, so. - But we wanted to talk about first, 'cause this came up first, was the Battle of the Network Star. - Oh, the bad. - So that's what we were dealing with. - That was the highlight of my life, and my career. - So you're in a very elite class of people who are in this. - I guess so, I'm finding that out, because there's this whole sort of fan base for, and for whatever reason, maybe I was just so bad at all with the sports, they said, never again. - Yeah, it was the last one. - It was the last one. - Or they could have just been like, we did it, that was the best. - Yeah, that was the best. - We finally got right. - Yeah, they peaked. - They peaked that 12 years in, and they finally perfected it. - They did it right. - They didn't need to do it anymore. - Yeah, and we won. - Yeah, it was the first time that you see one, and you almost never won. - They almost never won, and we were also, I remember like, at the end of it. All right, so this is how I'd have one that got on. I got cast in it, like the, I had a publicist, the Warner Brothers, publicist that wanted, you know, everybody was trying to run gunning to get their actors on that show. - So how did that audition work? Did they make you like that? - I didn't even audition, I was just told, I got a phone call, and the reason being is because I had just won the fastest celebrity in the LA Marathon. - Oh, okay. - Which don't get excited, I really came in, in real statistics, 7,312th place. - But in celebrity. - In celebrity land, which is all that counts. - Right. - I was the fastest female celebrity, and I actually got a trophy. - Oh, nice. - Yeah, but they didn't want to give it to me, they kind of tried to rig it, and give it to Susan Walt, Walt hers, Walt hers? - She's an author. - She was on, you would know this, 'cause you're a TV guy guy. Night, night nurses, night-- - Oh, yes, yes, yes, the-- - Sexy show. - Yeah, it was a, it was an hour long, night time soap, yes, I came to give the name, it was in Aaron's spelling show. - Yes, yes, good, come on, you're almost there. - It's almost there, and I wanna say that it had Morgan Fairchild in it. - Yes, it did, that's right. - I think it actually was called night nurses. - Night nurses, something like that, 'cause it was like the sexy nights. - Oh, yeah, absolutely, yeah, 'cause hey, nice-- - So she and I, they actually, the LA Times did this little competition for us, but it was set up by all the publicists where she and I were gonna compete for that first-- - So were you very close in the race? - Well, we were so close. - It was a photo finish? - It was a photo finish, no kidding, where, and no one thought I was like the little engine that could, first of all, I'm not built like a runner, I'm short, you know, I'm not in the long legs, and she had run before-- - She's a marathoner. - She was a marathoner, she had placing times that was better than me, like by a lot. I think my first time was four hours and 44 minutes. - I bet she lost her mind when you'd be there, like I just mentioned like a mommy deer-- - She's her head expanded. - How could she ever beat me and the best? - No, her forehead exploded, and she's a sweetheart, but you know, I'm competitive and I'm from Maine and you're gonna win, right? - Right, absolutely. - So the publicists set it up, and then we even had a little photo shoot where that's like running and laughing, right? And she had a contract with Great Earth vitamins, but they expected her to win, so. - Did she lose the conference? - Well, I don't know what ended up happening, but all I knew was I was gonna win, darn it, so why are you not gonna throw her on? - I am not gonna throw this for a vitamin contract. - Right, okay, so you lose a little of your essential, you know. - Hey, you're on nightmares. You're gonna be on TV forever. That show is gonna last. - I know, plus, you know, with the filters and everything you look at, right? So they did this thing and it was pretty much that they thought she was gonna win. And I thought she was gonna win. And so we got there and I ran and I didn't even stop to use any of the porta-potties because that was just gonna slow me down. - You just need to win. - I need to win. - Was that the first marathon you were on? - It was my second marathon. - Okay. - It was my second marathon. I think it was my second marathon. And, you know, before you do that sort of thing, they make the actors go, well, they don't make the actors go, but they ask the actors to go to pick a charity, right? So I went to pick out a charity and my charity, it was, you know, there's lots of actors around the cancer, cancer was popular, you know. - It was big in the 80s. - Yeah. - And of course the heart disease, which I was a good one to go with. - Yeah, class. - So then there was the Savo Booth, was the Suicide Prevention Center, right? - Well, that seems appropriate. - And there was no one around there and I thought, well, that's really kinda sad. - So they had like a convention to woo celebrities. - To woo celebrities to run for them. - Wow, okay. - Because, you know, you'd raise money and awareness. - Yeah, oh yeah. - So I found myself going over to the Suicide Prevention Booth and I said, well, maybe I'll run for you 'cause they don't have anybody running for them and they said, why would you wanna do that? - Nobody runs for us. - Nobody runs for suicide. And I said, well, I'm gonna do it, you know. And it was-- - You can't stop me. - You can't stop me. - And it was me and it was just really sweet over me and he was an amputee. He was actually a special runner, you know. And I think he had lost somebody to suicide. And I, so I ended up working for the Center and I'm getting a little off-road here. But, but I remember when I called the publicist, my personal post until I picked. She said, you can't run for suicide! - People hate that! - People, I said, people, I said, get up. Suicide's not, you know. - Maybe if it's puppy suicide or something like this. - And she said, no, I'm not to put out a release about your not suicide and all things. And it was just like-- - Oh, they'll think you're suicidal. - The other suicide is a look at the sadder and more need. And also I was very, I was very attached to them and I thought this is a great thing to do. - That's a great charity. - Yeah. - And it's not like they're like, they're on a heart prevention neck. I probably is a heart attack. - Yeah, right. I said, this is fairly immediate. - Yeah, yeah. - 'Cause it's attention. And I thought, because there was nobody doing it, I'm not supposed to do it, so. - So maybe that's why you want, because you were killed by the underdog. - I was fueled and I am for the underdog. I like you and I are like doing something that's, you know, you have a lot of people running for these. So they're very good cherries that need help. Anyway, so they put this thing up against each other and I don't remember what she was running for. But then I came in, I beat her by like a minute and a half. - Oh wow, so that's not close. - No, I know. And I came in and everybody was boggled by it. So then they had the awards ceremony. They gave the big gigantic trophy to her. - 'Cause they already had it made up. - It's like, oh yeah, no, no, yeah. You know, this is for. And then, but Jamie, Lunar, and Brookie was there giving out water and they slipped and said, no, she didn't, she didn't win, she didn't win. Joe won, Joe won, you know. - 'Cause then they went, oh, all right. And they gave me back the trophies. - We scraped her name off it. - It's her name off it. They took like a little penny out of it. - Yeah, it was her name. - Yeah, that's fine. - What's your name again? You're known, Knight Nurse. - So you're more of a day nurse type. - You were totally, yeah. - So then they were like, you're an athlete. - Oh, so that was, yeah. So now we finally went through three circles around the earth back to the subject. Yeah, so I did. I apparently, Warner Brothers suggested me to the ABC team that we're looking for real athletes. - Right. - You know, I think that the networks really do want you to win. - They want to win, yeah. - They want to win, right? So they submitted me and then I suddenly got it and everybody was thrilled. Oh, you know, we got Joe on the show. And so then that weekend, in mind you, I'm living in this, this little apartment in Sherman Oaks. - Okay. - And we had just started the show. - Yep, since it was like fall of '88 probably. - Yeah, something like, I don't really remember exactly, but we just started the show and nobody really knew us. And, well, of course you did, Ken. - Not that helpful. (laughing) - Yeah, there was one boy, you must have to choose this. - Yes, we could just get through the war. - We could just, yeah. I lived in a sad little apartment where it wasn't really a one bedroom, you drew a curtain and-- - Oh, right. - So I was not in the room. - It was like a leading room as a bedroom, in a place, yeah. - Yeah, it was not a glamorous place. So let's just say I didn't get the special segment. - Right. - You know, like-- - Go in your house while you're training. - So I pull the curtain back and forth and back and forth. - No, look at my biceps. - Sorry, run to get my mail so I don't get stabbed. Like I heard it. - No, I know. I think they took a look at my apartment and went, "Well, this is just sad." - Yeah. - American doesn't want to see that, you know. - The glamour of, yeah. - We clear there's nothing glamorous about this, you know? So I said, "I'm sorry." And I remember they picked me up in the limo and the whole thing was just surreal. - Oh, yeah. - I grew up watching. - Oh, yeah, I mean, it was such a weird holdover of that '70s when the networks were huge. And they were still big by this time but the environment was sort of changing with cable and that's such a thing. And the team you had was all pretty young, aside from John Davidson who was the captain, who was doing Hollywood squares at that time. - Oh, was he really young? - These guys, I never knew why he was famous, like Bert Comfy. They were just always in like Fantasy Island, all the sort of big love boat type shows. And then they'd also sing. - Yeah, yeah. - Yeah, I know. - He was a quadruple threat. - Yeah, yeah. He could do anything much. - He could do anything. - So you guys won? - We won, well, when we first got there, Olivia Dabo, who was from one of years, who I love, and I met her that day. They sat us down and said, this is the whole part that I thought was wrong was, I thought, you know, our money that we would earn, we'd go to charity or whatever. But it didn't, it went to the actors. So we were told-- - So if you won, you would get money for sure? - For four hours of work, you know, and doing this competition, third place would get $4,000. - Right. - Each member, and I think the second place took eight grand, well, the top prize, whoever won, you know, for the top prize, the top team, we'd each get $12,000. So Olivia and I were like, we have to feed our families. - Yeah. - That's it, we have to-- - We just started. - We just started, and I think, I don't know if I'm gonna make rent next. - Right, so it will be suicide prevention. - Yeah, so, you know, so she and I decided that was it, you know, and then the rest of the team that we're really trying-- - Right. - To win, because it was like, I mean, I was like $12,000 for four hours of work was-- - That's a pretty good payday. - Pretty good payday, and just obscene to me. - Yeah. - And I didn't think, you know, who knew, we didn't think our shows were gonna go on. - Yeah, you think each payday is gonna be the last four? - It seems your family, yeah. But then most of the gals, and every race had to have at least two girls in the race, right? - You'd have something for the dads to watch. I'm sure they had some sort of statistic-- - Oh yeah, none of us wore bras, of course, because-- - Was that mandated by the-- - Yeah, it's mandated. - We call it the Cheryl Ladd rule, and we just covered the ratings on. - If you review those shows, you will say like, the sports bra simply wasn't invented yet. Most of the girls on my show, on my team, didn't wanna do the, like, they didn't even wanna get wet, or they didn't wanna, you know, and Olivia and I were like, that-- - We wanna win. - Yeah, we wanna win, dirt me up, I don't care, you know-- - It's like a lot of relay races, and you'd have to like-- - Yeah. - The paddling pool, the paddling pool-- - Yeah, well the first one, the first race out of the block there was the kayak race. - Right. - Well I'd never been in a kayak in my life, but none of the girls wanted to do it. So by default, I just said, well I guess I'll go for it, I'll do it, you know? And they literally put me in the boat, and you could see if you have, there's a clip running on YouTube, where I just looked terrified, like, oh, what am I supposed to-- - What's gonna happen? - Oh, what's gonna happen? I don't even, how does this work? Like, you know-- - Right, 'cause you didn't get a dry runner. - No, no, no, no, it was like seven o'clock in the morning, and they stick you in the boat, and so they just said, then you hear a Howard Co. Cell go-- - Yes. - And they're off, you know? - Which must've been very-- - Oh, it's all so surreal, because again, I grew up with Howard Co. Cell. - Yeah, hearing your own name coming out of Howard Co. Cell's mouth would be very strange. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. So we're going along, and then I managed to be good at it, and I turned around the corner of her haces, and she makes a nifty turn, all of a sudden I hear over the intercom, and it's well let all the way, and I actually stopped rowing, going, "What?" - It's a replay of the LA Marathon, how over here, and someone's like, "How you was supposed to win for the LADC team?" - I know. - That's amazing, I'm surprised we don't have that sort of thing now. - Yeah. - So that would be just a slim-- - Well, you would think so, but back then, there was like the three networked spots was up and coming, but it was kind of like the celebrities were our royalty. - Right, right. - We were like, "Ooh, that's--" 'Cause that's how I was when I was a little girl watching television, it was thrilling to, you know, and we wanted to see them compete, and it was just all just good fun. - Speaking of that, so you grew up in Maine, pretty as we would say in Master's, it's way up there. - Way up there, yeah. - Above Portland, and how do you go from Maine to LA? - To the glamour television actress. - To the glamour television actress. - To the glamour television actress. - Okay, you know how I became an actress? It's because I had to pee. - Okay. - That's the story I've heard many times from many people. - No, I really honestly became an actress because I had to pee. I was out here, my sister at the time was dating an agent. I had a big Hollywood talent agency called ICM. We were on our way, I was here to check out UCLA to go to school, I know 17, and we're on the way to the beach, and I had little jean shorts on, and a tank top. - Beachwear. - Yeah, beachwear, and I had a makeup on, and I had a little ponytail, and so she just wanted to stop by and see the boyfriend. So we stopped by, and there was Lee Nagers. - Oh, wow, this is really another man himself. - The only of Dollar Man was in the elevator, and I nearly died, and I was just like, "Oh my goodness." - Is that the first celebrity you were in? - Oh yeah, yeah, and I just wanted to say, you know, I'm in love with you, is it too early to tell you that, between the second and third floor? And so we got up there, and now I'm feeling very insecure because I'm dressed, I mean, everyone's immaculately dressed. - They're going to work, and you're going to beach. - They're going to work in a world of beach, and what am I doing here? So we go in and she starts making our boyfriend. Now I'm uncomfortable, so I had to pee, so I asked him where the bathroom was, and I'm not really listening to the directions, 'cause I just want to get out of there. So I go out, and then I'm going down the hallway, and I'm thinking of the laughter, right, and then do double doors, and what am I supposed to do? - Where's the big building? - Big building, so I keep walking back and forth in front of this one agent's office. And so finally, I hear this voice behind me say, "Hey, kid!" You know, this is too long in respect. So turn around, and I think, "Oh, no, I'm in trouble." - Yeah, I'm gonna get it out. - I'm gonna get kicked out. I'm loitering, and look at the way I look, and he's in that nice suit. And so he says, "You a client?" And I said, "Yup." (laughs) - Always say yes. - Always say yes. And so he said, "How old are you?" And I said, "I'm 17." He said, "Well, Christ." You know, "A lot of damn, a lot of damn, a lot of damn." He says, "You look like you're three years old. "Follow me." So-- - Which was a compliment to the parents. - Yes, yes. I thought, "Oh, no, what did I do? "What did I do?" So I go and I sit down, and he calls when I guess was a casting director, right? He gets on the phone, and he says, "Well, I found her. "She's a terrific little actress." And he goes, "He's great." And he goes, "What's your name?" You know, and-- - This is a, this is like a 1930s school ball comedy store. - Oh yeah, yeah. It's like this Schwab's pharmacy thing. - Yeah, I know. - Where, and I hadn't acted a day in my life, and I did, I think I did a play about the four food groups, you know. - That was a really good part. - It was a really good part. - Yeah. - I was a good carrot. - Yeah. - I was very believable. - Yeah, and that probably, weren't probably out over here for that, but he wouldn't recognize these from that. - It's like, is it good, is that the carrot? - It's a carrot. - She's in my office. - Which is really good for a short girl. - Yes, absolutely. - Yeah. - The root vegetables. - Yeah, the root vegetables, yeah. - A lot of better than the turnip. So he, he hangs up. He says, "Well, I'm sending her right over." And you know, she's 17, but she can play 11, right? So he hands me a script in what were sides, which I didn't even know what sides were. - Right, right. - And it was the scenes that they wanted me to do for the movie, and so I go back to the office, and they said, "Did you find the bathroom?" And I said, "No, but I did get this audition for leading the movie." - It just happened. - Just, you know. And then I said in the man, you know, down the hall says, "We need to leave right now." - Right. - 'Cause they're waiting for me. So I go, "It's the best audition of my life." - Yeah. - Because I thought it was the funniest thing in the world. - Oh, yeah. - I'm never gonna get this. And, but I laughed at it. - Right, there's nothing on the line. - There's nothing on the line. I'm never gonna get this. - Yeah. - This is just a great story to tell my friends about com. So, you know, I had to be able to cry, and, you know, I had to be able to be funny, and I was like, "So then I ended up screen testing for it, and the guy called me and asked me for what my quote was, and I said, "What does that mean?" - Yeah. - And he said, "Well, what was the highest that you got paid on your last job?" And I said, "Well, I make 20 bucks a gig singing at the VFW club so I could beat that on their girl." - Right, right. - You know. - And he thought I was kidding. - That's crazy. - Yeah, so then I didn't get the movie, but when I came back, there was nobody really liked me at the end of the day. - Right, right, right. - They could play that much younger than themselves. - Right, so they had you put you up for like, 13 year olds and 12 year olds. - Oh yeah. - So what was the first thing that you booked? - I did a Hill Street Blues episode. - Okay. - That was my first, so Stephen Botch go actually Taftart in the union. - Oh, nice. - It was an episode with Ally Sheedy. - Did you watch it before you were on it? - Oh yeah, sure, yeah. - So that must have been crazy. - Oh yeah, and I made the Portland Times. - Oh, 'cause that's huge news. - What huge news? I had an under five. - Yeah, yeah. - Part, but it was a big deal. - Oh, a girl from, you know, Native Girl from Lewiston. - And Hill Street Blues was huge. - It was huge. - That was NBC's, their critically acclaimed show. - Oh yeah, yeah. - That was a show that they were, it was doing well before they sort of made us to reinvent themselves. - Yeah, and this was a three episode arc with Ally. She had just done more games. - Yes, yeah. - And even this was kind of sick really. She had a, I think she had like an affair with one of the cops. She was 16, we were there. We were Catholic school girls. - Right, Catholic school girls gone bad. - Yeah. - Classic plot. - Yeah, that's exactly. And we just happened to want to take a tour of the jail. - Right, well, many Catholic school girls, it's like purgatory. - Exactly, it's a rite of passage, really. - And she started having an affair with this guy. - And she, yeah, 'cause so I believe, and maybe I'm wrong, but it was called The Bells of St. Mary's. - Of course, of course. 'Cause there's a Spencer for Hire episode, I'd also named that about a very similar plot. - I heard it was a lot. - Like two years later. - It was just, yeah, I know it's been plaguing me though. I've been playing these sweet little, you know, sexy Catholic school girls my whole life. And I still get residual checks for, Hillsborough police, for like a penny. - It'd be funny if the memo on the checks had like sexy school girls. (laughing) You're like, send those right out. Send those right out. So that was the first thing, and that was shot on film. - That was shot on film. - And it was more like a movie, I imagine. - Yeah, yeah. - So what was the first sort of? - The first big job I got. - The first big job or the thing that was the first sort of TV show that was sort of like a three camera felt in a studio. - Oh, okay, in studio. - 'Cause I imagine. - Well, the first big deal that I got, actually, and I noticed in one of the TV guides that you have was I got a really great episode of my sister, Sam. - Pam Dauber. - With Pam Dauber and Rebecca Shafer. - David Nomm. - Yes. (laughing) You really should be a publicist as you really have it all down. - Yeah, and that was the last show Pam Dauber did before she kind of retired. - Yeah, she did. That was, well, and they used this episode, Pam told me as a signature episode for the series. - So there was. - It's a particular episode. It was called, if you knew Susie, and I played Susie the wrong Susie. - Right. - Which is, she's homesick, she was from Oregon, right? And so Pam feels bad and says, well, I'll send for her best friend Susie. Well, of course, she sends for the wrong Susie. - I'm the classic mix-up. - Yeah, the classic mix-up. So I came and I'm, of course, a geek. And I know that I'm so thrilled because she is, like, yeah, she was popular, and I can't believe she'd want to spend time with me. And then when I get there, I realize that she's not happy to see me. And then, of course, I go crazy and I get lost in the city and I die in my hair and I become the cool kid, right? It was great fun. And they were really lovely to me. And Rebecca was just the sweetest, most wonderful girl in a very talented actress. - Oh yeah, she was always like the big, young actor that everyone was like, huge things. - Oh yeah, no, she was really popular. She was, you know, this fresh girl. She was from Oregon and she was a model to begin with and she started and it was just such a promise for her. And I remember when the tragedy happened, I got a phone call from my agent who told me because we had become friends after that. - Right. 'Cause you were on the same age, I imagine. - Yeah, we were the same age. Well, I think she might have been a little bit younger than me. I don't remember. - But you're also kind of outside or you a little bit and like, are you in Maine and you have Portland's? - Yeah, exactly, I remember Portland's, well. And she was just a lovely girl. Like I had, she treated me really nice. - Yeah, which is probably unusual. - It is unusual when you were on a guest star. - Yeah. - And I remember one time we were gonna do a network read through and I had, guess I had to use the bathroom way, way, way away. - Right, right. - That's so you have a separate entrance. - Separate everything, right? And she was like, no, no, no, we don't have time for that. Just come and use my trailer. You know, she's very sweet. She's very giving and I was like, really? And then we were very friendly. - Yeah. - And then when she was murdered, it was just such a shock and it changed the industry. - Oh yeah, that was the first stalker case. - It was the first stalker. - And I believe the guy just called Central Casting and got her home address or something. - Well, what he did actually is he went to the DMV. - Oh, right. - And I just asked for it and I gave it to him. And that started a whole-- - Which is crazy and I, it's like, that's the same and that. That was, it was that easy. - But back then it was just sort of a, you know, and also for her when she answered the door, like it would never, for me, I answered my door and it would never dawn on me that-- - It's just very trusting and you don't-- - Very trusting. So it was very sad and actually her boyfriend at the time, who's a pretty big director now, he to this day gives out an award at UCLA for up and coming actresses. - That's great. - With her parents. - Oh, that's really cool. - They give a scholarship every year and they interview people in her name and memory. - Right, right. - It's nice at least, I mean, it's, obviously it's not a good thing that-- - No, but definitely her parents have really stroked to bring awareness to-- - Right. - To prevention of, you know, not only celebrities, but-- - Just in general. - Just stalking her. - Yeah, I mean, 'cause that was definitely, you didn't hear about that at all, until after that. - No, you never did. - It was everywhere all of a sudden. - Yeah. - And started, you know, everyone was talking about it. And I remember, I did used to watch that show and it was, and it was a fun, like show. It was definitely not a show that that sort of topic would come up with. So it's a weird thing to be sort of intrinsically forever linked with that show, of all the time shows it could be. But it was the first time someone on a show that I watched was just, died. - Yeah, just died. - And it must be, you know, upsetting for a young man because it feels like, you know, we were talking about this really where we're invited into your living room every week. You get to know us and you feel like you're a friend. You really do kind of get this false sense of familiarity, friendship, you know. They welcome you into your home, literally, every week. And then for somebody like that, just to be suddenly gone. - Yeah, and not, and this will sound stupid, but not have it be explained within the context of the show. - Yeah. - And it's really, some shows try to do that, which is odd, but just, it's just like over. And it's a very, it's a very, obviously not as shocking nearly as the reality of it. But it's, a moment when you realize television is artifice to a degree because there's real life consequences that interact with all sorts of things. - Sure, because you do not know who you are affecting. You don't know the mental states of people that are watching too. And most people are, I find most people that ever contact me. You're very genuine and sweet and very polite, but you never know and you don't have to be careful. - Yeah, because there is that false sense of familiarity. And I imagine you probably get that all the time, or even if people don't know where they recognize you from, maybe they thought they went to high school with you. - Yeah, something like that. - Or something like that. - I knew you were somewhere, but they're probably up in the less around here, but it's so common. - Yeah. - But what was the first thing you did that someone recognized you from? - Oh, it would be, well, bizarrely, I was recognized a lot for a music video that I-- - Oh, 'cause in the outfield. - In the outfield. - In the outfield. - When I did that, my friend John Jopson, I had met him, he was a friend of a friend, Julio McCott, who was a cinematographer, and I were doing a movie together with Mershka Hargate. - Oh, okay, that's a welcome to 18. - Welcome to 18, yeah. And it was a coming of age fun sort of movie. And so he went to the set one day, and then he just asked me, "Listen, I'm doing this. "There's a song coming out called "Your Love." And I didn't know anything about the band, they were coming when, and sure, it sounds like fun. Usually they hire model-y kind of girls, but I don't know what you want me, but okay. And, you know, he flew me out, and I stayed with my brother, and I think maybe I got some pot-cut change, or maybe a couple of hour bucks, maybe-- - It's really 'cause of a one day lark. - Yeah, lark, and, you know, isn't it 'cause-- I grew up with an MTV. - Right, right. - Now, I mean, you know, MTV was like the big thing, and I was fine. - It changed the world at that time, and this was-- - Oh, yeah, I would rush home from school every day just to watch MTV. - Yeah, so you had cable growing up? - Yeah, yeah, yeah, in high school. So, to be the it girl, it was funny to me, you know, sir, and I got to go to New York, so I didn't, we shot all night long, and I thought, oh, this is kind of a fun song, right? And then suddenly, it played like crazy-- - Yeah, that was a huge single, that was their big hit. - That was their big hit. And then my twin brother would be at a bar or whatever, and go, it would be playing, you know, "Oh, that's my sister," and then he'd get hit, you know. That's not your sister. - What a weird thing to lie about. That's my sister there, I don't know if you noticed. - I know, wouldn't it be better to say, yeah. - Yeah, I know, I know. - I know, I know. - I know, I went out with her. - She's playing keyboards in this band. - Yeah, exactly. - I had a professor at Northeastern when I was going there, who, and I have no idea why she brought this up. She was a speech, speech and writer professor, and she's like, you know, can you probably know this? I don't know why I thought of this, but I love this on your love by the outfield. I like that tape of it, and I just used to listen to it over and over again for hours. You know, that song, right? And I'm like, yeah, I know that song. And she's like, okay, anyway, here's the class. I was like, what a weird thing to just bring up. - Oh, I know. - It's a much love song, but-- - It is a much love song. - She's a college professor. - Yes, exactly. And a lot of people made out to that song. - Absolutely. - You know, they could, you know. Although I find that when I meet men, they'll be like, I'll be part of their developmental stages at point, for good or for bad. And then I just wanna say I'm sorry. - Yeah, I'd imagine that's like a creepy prospect to a president to be like, oh man. - Oh man, let me tell you about my puberty. There's no way to delegate me. - There's really no way to navigate that count. - No, no. - You know when I meet somebody like that, I was like, really? Oh, wow. - Thanks for sharing. - Thank you. - Thank you. - Thank you? - Yeah. - I don't know what possible answer-- - There is no good answer. I just let them talk. - Yeah, yeah, I mentioned them for the best. Just get it out of their system and go. - It's just okay. - And then when they stop talking, I think that conversation is over. 'Cause I don't, wow, yeah. - No. - And that's probably just the ten of us, I imagine that's what they say. - Just the ten of us, yeah. - 'Cause that was my full model overload for many teenage boys, I'm sure. - Oh, well, if you just think about the premise alone, you know, you've got four just wild teenage girls just happen to be the only girls in all boys Catholic school. - Catholic school's got a girl's contact, yet again, it's close and smooth. - It is Catholic's girls gone bad. - I loved that. And I loved it for, it still was really funny. Like, it was a very funny show. And I remember, I watched "Growing Pains" all the time, and I think the season two and three were the best seasons, which is what your show spun off from. A lot of the writers from those seasons came over. - Oh, they all jumped over to just the time of us. - So it had that tone, and that was the first time I recognized that like all these episodes I like are written by the same people. That's when I sort of realized people write things. - Oh, isn't that interesting? - So it sort of followed over to that show. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - It was just so funny, and the family wasn't anything like mine, there was really no, nothing I identified with. It's about teenage girls, which I was not. - Yeah. - But it was just very funny, and the interactions were great. And I also loved the, it had a lot of weird meta stuff in it. Like, there were always fourth walls sort of breaking things in that show, which was very unusual. - Yeah. I mean, I did one of, they did some episode. I had-- - The fantasy episode, where you're-- - Well, the fantasy episode was also, well, there's one scene that, oh, everybody thought was hilarious, because we had the cam laughter. - Right. So you didn't have a live audience? - No, we had a live audience, but then they would just-- - Sweetness. - They would also sweeten up with a lot of cam laughter, just in case you didn't find it funny or not enough. And this one episode where I was supposed to be the pained writer on the show and the smart, sarcastic one, and they had this one scene with Deb Harmon, who played my mom, where I couldn't write and I was all upset and then I said something that I was gonna end up in Hollywood writing sitcoms, where they had cam laughter after the online, and then you hear the cam laughter and they say, "See, like that." - Yes, I remember that. - And do you remember that? And then she was confused like, "What?" - That sort of thing blew my mind as a kid, because you never said no. - You never did that. - That's very common now, where people sort of play with the cliches of television, but there was an episode I remember where I think Brooke gets home from a date or something, and Bill's watching TV with Deb and he says, "Oh, you just missed your favorite show." She's like, "What show?" And he's like, "It's not long that comes on after "Mr. Bellevue, you're welcome." - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. - That's the show. - Yeah, that's the show. - That's the show. - Oh, they love that stuff. - You never saw that. And especially on like a family sitcom on ABC, which was not necessarily known for being edgy or anything. - Yeah. - It was always more of a, like the family network for the most part. - Yeah, right. It was a family. But we got away with some edgy stuff. - Oh, yeah, that's the first show I remember seeing. It was Slut on. - Oh, yeah? - It was on that show all the time. - Slut was on the show all the time. - Stinking Slut and Can. Those are the three words that came up there. - The Can. - Stinking Slut and the Can. - Yeah. - That was came up very frequently on just the 10 of us. - The Dog Hooter. - Hooter, yes. - Right. - The Dee High Hooters, which is the team. - And then there was a lot of like sort of references that they would just write, just to see if the network. - Would ask them or not? - Yeah. - And did stuff just got through. They didn't know those stuff. - Yeah, like, I can't even say it. - Right. - Honey, you were without offending probably your listing audience. - Right, right. - But it was about an act, okay? - Okay, okay. - And we all got it. - Right. - But the guy from the sensor department did. - For some million year old man. - Oh, yeah, and then he left and everyone was like, "Ah, now we have to actually do it!" - We should censor it ourselves. - Yeah, they almost didn't, but no, they did. - So I had no idea you were in a band. So you used to sing in a band, as you said before, in the VFW and any of you. - Yeah, yeah. I've always been sort of the reluctant singer. They keep, I keep finding myself in, back when I sang in the band, back home, it was just because it was, wow, 20 bucks a gig. - Right, that's pretty sweet, yeah. - I didn't really know how to sing, but I suppose I could, so I just did. Then just the 10 of us, "Oh, how that happened?" - Yeah. - And that's really when I showed took off. - Oh yeah, that season was huge. - Because they, it was, we were so pretty Disney. - Right. - You know, we were the first, we were for our time with, now today you really have to be able to sing, dance, do the whole marketing thing, right? You know, of course there's a band on the show, right? - Yeah, you can sell that music, you can do everything. - Right, and then also the little girls glom onto it, and you make music videos, but there really wasn't anything like that on it back then. And how it started was, it was one episode where I sang "A cappella," a Helen Reddy song. - Okay. - You are a woman here, me, you know, that song. And so I stood up and I was singing it, and I was really like belting it, and then someone from the network said, "Oh, joke him, sing!" - See, dollar signs, yeah. - Joke and sing. So then they said, then the next table read, suddenly we were an all girls band. (laughing) - Just like that. - Just like that. They didn't even ask, if the other girls could sing. - So what did they think about that? They're just like-- - No, they were like, we just did whatever, like landed in front of us at the table read. So they're like, "Oh, okay." And then they always thought, "Oh, we can just dump them later." - Right, right, right. - Right, but it was such a great, great idea of like singing in the pizza party. - Yeah, yeah. - And then it became double the amount of work, because, well, first of all, those episodes were the ones that got all of the numbers. - Oh, really? - Yeah, that's when people were starting to really, we drew an audience from that, because they were fun. - Yeah, oh, absolutely. And there were some weird ones, too, like I remember, there was one where you all have your own little segment, and you're sort of fantasizing about your careers in the future. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. - And now one had a lot of that sort of commentary on the business in there, as well. - Oh, yeah, right. - I think you're doing the barber of Seville or something. - Yeah, I was always a melodramatic. - And there was a gun. - And then Brooke had a show called "Wendy and the Butler." That was-- - "Wendy and the Lesler." - Oh, it was hilarious. - Yeah, it was very, very funny. And yeah, the show was very popular then, but then that's also towards the end of the show. - Yeah, yeah. Well, we were at our hype. We won every week. We got something crazy, like a 30 share, which you just don't get. - Yeah, that would be the number one show on TV. - That would be the number one show on TV. - Yeah. - Because we didn't have cable to come really compete with. - Right. - And so we were doing really well, and no show had done that well in so long, but then we had a new change of presidents. - Right. - And I don't remember who our next president was, but he didn't like the show. - He just didn't like it. - He just didn't like the show. And maybe part of it too, this is all what we heard. - Right. 'Cause they never tell. When a show gets-- - They don't really tell. - They just tell you, the show's done, that's it. - It was shock. It was a shock to everybody because it's like, but we're winning. - Right. - We're winning by a lot. - And so did you wrap up that season? And you're like, I'll see you guys in the fall. - Oh no, we were like, yeah, we're gonna go off and do our summer, whatever, and see in a couple months, right? - Right. - And then suddenly we didn't get picked up. - That's very weird. - What? - Brookie had just bought a house. - Oh. - You know, we all were like, this was a complete surprise. - Yeah. - Then we heard it was because, this is what we heard anyway, that last episode when the girls get the cow knocked up. - Yes, yes. - Just pushed him over the end. He couldn't deal with that at the start, it was the cow. - It was the cow that thanked us. That was like, no, no, no, no, this is awful. - Yeah. - And they were very tied to Miller Boya. - Who produced the other three shows? - Yeah, and so they thought, and I'm sure they had to do with their contracts and wanting to please Miller Boya because they were their powerhouse for them. - They'd buy in bulk from them. - Buy in bulk, there's a Costco TV. - Yeah, they're not. - That's exactly what it turned into. - Yeah, that's right. - So they did, it was a Hello Walkler comedy 'cause that's- - Yes, going places. - Going places. - It didn't go anywhere. - I run a clean window where I like that just set it up for just mock clever reviews and things like TV Guide. - Yeah, I know. - The only places doesn't. - Doesn't. - And over for you. Alan Rock was in that. - Oh, really? - Well, yeah, that was a show that they try to retool twice. Like, they do a lot of shows where they go, oh, you know, you don't work in a newspaper. You're all on a TV show now. - Yeah, right. - Yeah, and you used to be stupid, but you're not anymore. - Yeah, you're their name's the same, but that's it. - Yeah, yeah. - So that was the last regular series that you were in. - Yeah. - And you've done a ton of guest star stuff. - Yeah, I've done a ton of guest star stuff. I've done pilots a long way that didn't get picked up, did some TV. And then I, you know, got married and had a couple of kids. - And had a real life. - Yeah, real life kind of, you know, it happened. And then I started writing and went back to college. And so, I'm busy with it. - So did you not? You didn't finish college because you were- - No, I was working so much. - Right. - I guess the 10 of us actually was one of the reasons why I stopped because that's another thing where, when I first read for that, I read for Heather's part, right? - Really? - Yeah, and the producers were like, and I thought to myself, 'cause I was almost 25 at the time, right? And to play 18. And I thought, oh yeah, I know they're right. I can't play 18 anymore, right? And then they give me the part of Connie. - Who was 15? - Who was 14? - 14. - And I just looked at it and my mouth dropped and I went, okay. And I'm right for 18 apparently. - Okay, wow, and then I went out to the hallway and then I called my agent and he says, well, just read it, you know? It's good part, kid. So I went back in and I read and then I got a call back and I wasn't nervous at all because I thought, this is a scene. - You're never gonna get this? - Yeah. - You're never gonna get this. And then at the screen test, they had two sets of kids. Brookie and Jamie were already hired. Brook, and they had both done growing pains episodes before. - Yeah, they were in different characters. - Different characters, but the producers loved them. - Right. - And they needed to cast Heidi's equivalent part. - And she'd just come off regs to riches and just got canceled. - Yeah, and she was, you know, she was just the best child actor. - Yeah, she was just a ton of stuff. - Also very precocious, she was nine going on 50. - Oh yeah, absolutely. - You know, she knew your line, she knew your blocking, you know, she knew everything. - Right, very professional. - Very professional for this little tiny thing. - Right. - And then Heather and I and so the three of us screen tested together for ABC. And then they had another set. - Right. - Right. - Did you see the other set? - Oh, we saw the other set. - It's not either. - It's like driving yourself to that, you know. - You're in a job interview. - It's terrible. - You know, like an office job. They're never like, the other guy that's up for it. - No. - They're just both, yeah. - Either you can have this incredible opportunity or she's going to this. - Life change, someone's life will be changing. - Yeah, I know, and it's horrible. - Yeah. - So I screen tested with the two of them. And you know, and you never know the politics of that, too. Like I found out later that the producers really wanted us. - That's why they put you together. - They put us together. I was screen testing against a movie star who had come out in Annie that year. - Oh, wow. - And I thought I'm never, and the network wanted her because she has a name. - Right. - But one of the producers stuck up for me and said, you know, you either bring Joe to the network 'cause they didn't even want to bring me. - Wow. - They didn't want to bring me. - But that must make you feel great when you do get it and you're working with those people every day and they're on your corner, right? - Well, they were in my corner and they went, they went to the mat for me. And it was nice. And so anyway, so I get to the show and the read-through, right? And then after they asked me to follow some guy to his trailer and I thought, well, normally I get a female for wardrobe. - Right. - Okay. So I follow him and then I go up into the trailer and he tells me to sit down. So I sit down and he gets me a stack of eighth grade books. He was the answer teacher. - There you go. - Wow. And so again, I called the agent and I said, I didn't like Joe would you the first time. Get me out of this. - I'll play for a team and I don't want to have to be for a team. - Be for a team. I don't want to go back to the eighth grade. And he said, suck it up, kid. It's a good job. After six episodes, they can't fire you. - So did you have to pretend to do that? - I did. I mean, I went to the, I mean, I went to the little ones set school. - It's like mat and Heidi. - Mat and Heidi. - And I'm, oh, and also Green Payne's kids. Like Joe Miller. - Yeah. - I'm almost 25. I've been to college, right? - And you never mentioned it. Did you just like? - Oh, there was a mix up in the production office. They just thought that I was really that age. So I went for a little while and then I finally said, you know, I'm just, I'm just a teensy bit older than you think I've got over this stuff a little. - Yeah. 'Cause I just thought, I know I'm doing math in my head, like my little brother or my big brother and, you know. - It's almost like a weird 21 Jump Street. - It was. - Like, you know, like under cover as a teenager. - Under cover actor. - Wow, that's very, very funny. And so do they pitch that as a spin-off of Green Payne's when you got it? - When we, no, we, they already had the deal. They had, we were back our pilots. So we did two episodes on Green Payne. - Yeah. - To set up the family. - Yeah. - And then we were given six episodes to start. The numbers were, you know, or the park. We did so well, but then the writer strike happened. - Right. - So then we didn't work for a while, but then we came back and we did a couple of seasons and we, you know, it was a surprise to be canceled. - They actually tried to get us back. - Oh, really? - You know, the president at the time said he made him stick. - He looked at the numbers in his pocket. - Yeah. - Yeah, I mean, he was like, but then other people, some of the actors had gone on to do other things into the conference. - No, you got their jobs. - You couldn't get, you couldn't get them back. - Yeah. - So, but today, you know, with everything, we would have gone on to the WB network or something would have happened with the show. - Yeah, so, yeah. So in some ways, you know, I always complain about TV now and how the way that it's made, and we have all this infinite things that we can watch everything ever, but no one ever does, and it's hard to discover things. - Yeah. - 'Cause you're not just flipping through and stumbling on stuff. - Right. - But in some ways, for areas like that, it is better because shows don't necessarily have to die, like politics. - Right. I mean, even shows like Arrest and Development comes back how many years later? - Yeah. - It's astonishing. - Or even family, I would just not show them that into, but it was off the air for like six years and they got really canceled. - It wasn't really. I didn't realize that. - It was in Futurima as well. It was airing in Cartoon Network and reruns and then they uncancelled it because it was doing so well. - The uncancelled it. - I love it. - Which is crazy. That's the way. - Yeah, well then we'll find a home because there's just so many homes today. - Absolutely. And just to have us also really ran in syndication, well in USA Network used to run them in the 90s. - That's where we got a whole other fan base. - Yeah. - Because suddenly those people, those kids were watching it every day in the summers. - Yeah. - In a loop. And I get so many letters from people saying, why don't they put it on DVD? Why don't they bring it back? Why can't I buy it? Well, for a couple of reasons. The producers definitely try, first of all. - Right. Even girl pains only got the first two seasons. - Well, yeah, because the numbers actually were not what they thought they would be for sales. So they were disappointed with that. They were also disappointed with the sales of Fresh Prince of Bel Air. - Right. - So they thought, - There's a huge show. - Which was a huge show. So they were gonna invest in just the 10 of us with those kinds of numbers, but also the music licensing. - Yeah, 'cause you're doing tons of Motown songs. - Oh yeah. I mean, we just simply couldn't do it. Because back then we couldn't forecast what was gonna happen with the different avenues and mediums. - Right, so you're just signing a release for it to be on that week. - Well, that week and that's it. Well, now you can't, what are you gonna dub? - Right. - What are you, you can't. There's a whole episodes with music in it. - Right, they're just about those episodes. And if they release the series without those episodes, everyone will be mad about that. - So yeah, music rights are really hard to sort out. And if you didn't, like with wonder years, it hasn't been on DVD for years for the same reason. - Oh really? - Yeah, they just announced that it's coming out in the fall, but they've been meticulously trying to work out the music for a decade. - No kidding. - What kind of music did they do? - So they used all contemporary music from the '60s and the big hits of the day. And so it was impossible. 'Cause those are the artists who were like, yeah, you can use it, I want $100,000. - Oh, I know, they want crazy amounts of money. - They'll just hold them hostage. - Yeah, and that's what would happen to us. So it's just not feasible. It's just not possible to do it. - And they showed it in Aaron's indication very much 'cause he didn't get to 100 episodes. - No, we only got to, I think, 48 plus the two or 49 plus the two. - So it's like with Fresh Prince, maybe that didn't sell very well because it's on all day every day now on 15 different stations. There's not some different demand for it, but you know, the numbers are the numbers, so I imagine people. But see, that's why it's really a tragedy for a producer to lose a show after a couple of years because they put all the money up front. They've done all the investments just shy of when it starts to pay off. It's like it's so much better just to get canceled out of the gate. - Then they have to pay you off. - Yeah, right, you know. - That's terrible. - And then we were even trying to think like, okay, so a couple of them can't back. We could be just the seven of us. - Yeah, maybe just the seven of us. They're college shows for-- - They have a special episode, it's okay. - We'll do a couple of specials for like a Christmas thing. Well, like the Brady Bunch came back after 20 years as a drama, weirdly. - Oh, I remember that. - Yeah, they did the Brady's, they did the Brady, I think they did the Brady brides. - The Brady brides, I love the Brady brides. - Then they did the very Brady Christmas. - Of course they did, yeah. - And they did the Brady's as like an hour long drama for which was a huge-- - Oh no. - I don't know why you're going, people like this Brady Bunch, but I think it's not serious enough. - Yeah, right, my daughter who's 15 loves the Brady Bunch. - That's such a strange thing. - She's got every single one, she watches them in the loop, she drives my son crazy. - Did she want you to do that to her, did she just find that on her own? - I did, I kind of forced my child on her own. - Very nice, well that's where you like it. - Well I think we have to. - Yeah. - I think it's a pre-requisite for being here. - That is, that is your, that's what you have to do. - You do. So I gave her, or Santa, gave her the collection. - Oh yes, and the green fur. - Yeah, with the green, like the again. Oh my God, it's a little sad that you know that it comes in green fur. - I know, it is true. - I think you have the collection too. - I may have the collection, yeah, I may. It may have been somebody I purchased. - Wow, so yeah, she washed it over and over again. Some of those episodes are even scary, like with a, what's the one where they, they basically get kidnapped? - Oh yes, by Vincent Price and why? - Vincent Price, yeah. - Yeah, in a cave with Vincent Price. - In a cave. - With Vincent Price, and he gets, they kidnap them. And then they invite him to Alua. - Yeah, well it's all good. - Yeah, it was just a little, it was just a little mishap, it was a mistake, misunderstanding. - Well, that's one thing that just a ten of us never did like a very special episode. - No, we did. - There were some sort of heavy topics that came up there, but ABC was sort of known for that sort of stuff. Like Mr. Belvedere, which year before you guys had two child molester episodes. - Oh, I didn't know that. - There was a date rape episode, that was all kinds of horrific things. And then speaking of kidnapping, there's an episode of "Different Strokes", also on ABC, where a guy's child dies, so he kidnaps one of the kids from the show and keeps him chained to a radiator, pretending to be his son. - No. - Yes, so I wonder if much like that, you walk in and find out that you're in a van now. The people in those days are like, I guess we, I get kidnapped this week. - Yeah, well then that's what would happen. You'd sit down, you'd read the episode and go, wow, okay. - Right, no one ever, I imagine no one was ever like, this is terrible. - I don't know, we were all some pretty fresh into it, and everybody wanted to keep their jobs. - Right, oh yeah, absolutely. - You know, 'cause that was the thing that, every season that we would come up, we would renegotiate our contracts, and the standard thing that everyone said was, it can always be just the nine of us. - Really? - Yeah, that's what we all heard, so. - What would they do if they'd just, they'd kill you off like Valerie Harper or something? - I think so. - Which little boy actually did? - Oh, did? - They did, yeah, she, so she goes, show Valerie. - They did, I know that. - She wanted to be an executive producer and more money, and they just killed her. - They just killed it, yeah, and they didn't, so they left on in the summer, much like you did. They come back, and all of a sudden, Sandy duck is on shit, they don't know what she's doing. - Sandy duck is the new Valerie. - She's the new Valerie, I tune in, and I'm like, "Where's Valerie?" - I know, isn't that confusing for a kid? - It's incredibly confusing, and the way that they addressed it was, show opens, the juice bait ones making jokes for like three minutes into the episode, and then he's like, "It hasn't been the same since Mom died, "and that's hard." (laughing) - No! - We went away and dropped that in. - Oh, no. - We got a white family sick home. - Yeah. - Yeah, they seem pretty ruthless behind the scenes on the scene. - Wow, yeah. The only thing that we did that was a little bit, I wonder if anybody would catch it, was after the first six episodes, you know, the first six episodes, Jamie played a very smart character. - Yes, they made him much more dumb. - And Brookie was the one that was supposed to be dim, but then after the six episodes, they thought that she was funnier being dumb. - Right. - So then suddenly, she just got a lobotomy, and she was like this dumb character. And does anybody not notice that? - I don't think people notice it. - They must not notice that it's that people get, maybe she hit that dumb age, or something. - No, because she just had a complete character reversal. - Yeah, and some of the stuff, they very, very much wrote it broadly dumb. Sometimes, they gave her a very classic dumb. - Yeah, and they pitted her character against mine all the time, because I was supposed to be the smart younger sister that, of course, she drove me crazy. - Right, and she was the trusting bumpy one, and you were the cynic. - The cynic, right, and she was, you know, the very pretty one that all the boys were lusting after her, so that would make me crazy. - Right, right, right. - You know, that she got it whatever she wanted. - Right. - Instead of, like, the hard drudgery that I always had to go through. - Right, and I imagine none of you really like that. Like the characters that you play. - No, not at all, well, first of all, I was by far older than all of them that were playing my big sisters. - It's kind of strange. - That was weird. Jamie was 16. - Oh, really? - Yeah. - And you were 25. - I was 25 when I first got the show. I was 24, almost 25. - Right. - And then we were on for a couple of years. So it was like 27, 28 when it ended. Still playing 14, right? - Right. - And then Heather was two years younger than me, but she was the oldest. - Right. - And Brookie is six years younger than I am. Bill Kirkambauer is only eight years older than me. - Really? - He was playing my dad. - That's very funny, I didn't know that. - Right. - It's believable. Like it never, I don't think anyone ever walks the show like that. - No, no, I got more invitations to the prom. - Did you really used to get letters to the prom? - There's the get letters to the prom. - How much like female and that kind of stuff do you get, do they just come in with your eggs? - Oh, we would get bags of fan mail. Sometimes we wouldn't, if it went right to the networks, sometimes they would go through them. - That's probably nice. - Oh yeah, because at one point, the FBI was brought in for Heather. Heather was really shocked by somebody that wrote some sort of letters. But the most part, it was just little boys. - Yeah. - You know, very sweet. And you'd get a lot of invitations to the prom. - And I actually wanted to do it, but I thought it would be just a little too sick for me to do it. - 'Cause you were 25. - Yeah, there was a little bit of that. - There was a little bit of a picture, let's see how you're doing that. Maybe I'll think about it. (laughing) You're five or 17. I would never even have thought to, I guess people still do that. They just do it on YouTube now, and they ask celebrities to the prom all the time. - Yeah, I think that they do. - Maybe that's the new battle of the network stars. - I know, that's like the battle. - It's going to the prom with the teenager. - And see if you can survive that. - Exactly. - Is this race? - Yeah. - You should get a trophy for that one I think. - Yeah. - Also a charity to network. - Oh, why not? - So you all, there's also a weird networked out-shoot connection. - Oh, I know, it really loves that connection. - But it's totally just by happenstance. - It's by happenstance, Heather. Well, we all, well, Brookie wouldn't have, but when I run out of the street was being made. - Right. - Pre-production for that, I read for Heather's part. - Oh, did you really? - Yeah, it's too hard that you read for her part for us. - Yeah, I know. - And that little witch keeps getting it. You know, it's some day, she has gotten, she has been my career stopper right there. - Is she the one, 'cause I imagine everyone always has, like some rival that's like that, every part I come up with. - Every part I got, you know, then Heather gets it. You know, so she, but, oh, that's the thing too. Heather can scream like no other person on the planet. She has, she is the scream queen. I used to make her scream for me on the set just because- - Just for fun. 'Cause I was like, Heather, could you do it? Could you just do it for me? And then she'd go, I didn't do it with that blood curdling. - Like it's nothing. - It's nothing, she could rip that off like it was, and then we'd all have a good laugh. Like, 'cause she was the scream queen. - Right, right. - And so I auditioned for a nightmare, I didn't get that. And the way I got nightmare two was I was doing a play here in town, some equity waiver thing, with Robert Shea's sister, Lynn Shea. - Lynn Shea, she's in everything. - In everything. - She's in so many things. - Yeah, she's funny and lovely and wonderful. Well, we were both playing ghosts, we were playing all ghosts and we put dead people. And all we did was, the whole play took place in the dark. And I was, and we'd walk around with flashlights. - Oh, okay. - And I was the grueling teenage dead girl. - Perfect. - And she was, you know, in her 30s or something. And so then we'd turn on the flashlight and we'd scare people in the audience. That was like the whole play. - I'd go see that play. - It was so good. Oh yeah, we had the reviews that we got. But her brother and Robert England came to see the play. - Right. - And so I talked to them after and Robert was like, "Hey, what are you doing this weekend?" This is how I got this, this is how I fall. - It's a pain. - It's a pain. - And no, it's like on the way to the bathroom, when I ran into Freddy Krueger. - And then he said, "Hey, come get killed on a bus." - Come get killed on a bus, that's how it happened. So he turns to Robert, he says, "She peed, she'd be pretty good, how about her?" Like, one of the, you know, the cheerleaders. - Yeah. - Here you go, show it. - Sure. - Sure. - Yeah, it's crazy. - So that weekend I just, that's what I went. Again, Nymer and Elsie, I don't remember it being that big, at the time. - It was huge. I mean, it was already huge? - Yeah, I remember the sequel was even bigger because it was, the sequel came out less than a year after the first one. - Yeah, it was so quick. - And it was a huge anticipation for it. Like, I remember going and seeing it on an opening day. - Did you really? - My parents who at the time, yeah, I thought they were cool, but really, they just didn't want to get a babysitter as the way that I know it was going. - Did you tell them that it was a homoerotic feeling? - I did, actually. - You did? - So I was like, how did you tell me? Because when I was making it, nobody knew that. - Yeah, and was it, is Chuck Russell ever ready? And he claims he didn't have it, I don't know. - I almost believe him. - Yeah, it's so over. - It's so over, but honest, honest. When we did it, but I wouldn't have known from my scenes, anyway. - Right, yeah, but did you go to like the premiere or anything? - Oh yeah, I went to the big Ollie with the premiere. - The other bar seemed to occur to me. It did not occur. I was like, oh, that's nice. - It's like cruising happens all of a sudden in the middle of the movie out of nowhere. - I know, and then like the towel slapping scene, you know? Wow! - Yeah, which is a great subtext for a horror movie about some teenager. - It's great, but it's 'cause I'm telling you, it's completely unintentional. - I think that the writer did not intend that. I think it was one of those collective, when everybody's working on it, and nobody sees what we're doing. - Right, it's the elephant. - Yeah, I really think that we didn't, because when we went to the premiere, nobody was like, oh, did you get a lot of that, you know? - Well, that happened to you, yeah. - This was the twisted nightmare. Nobody saw that, I didn't see it when I watched it. - Was that, so the first movie from where you probably went to was welcome to 18? Was it the first movie you were in? - No, Nightmare on Elm Street was my first movie. - So that was the first premiere you went to? - It was the first premiere. - Oh no, you know what? I went to Real Genius, I was in Real Genius. - That's my favorite comedy of the '80s. - Yeah, and I got cut out. - Yeah, 'cause nobody seems to know that. - Yeah, I've heard you've been references behind the class of the '80s. - Oh, people say no one for-- - Yeah, I'm like, I know that worked pretty well, I don't remember seeing it. - No, no one for Real Genius, but oh, they leave out the part that I got cut out of Real Genius. - She was in a science fair-- - I was in the science fair, Martha Coolidge. - Martha Coolidge, she was the president of the director who's killed from the average. She did Valley Girl. - Yeah, and I also knew Martha because I did amazing stories. - Oh yeah, that's right. - Or Twilight Zone. - You did amazing stories in Twilight Zone and there was one other anthology. - She direct, half directed, one of them. - Okay, it was probably the amazing stories, I think. But Twilight Zone, you did this very odd. I still don't understand that episode. I've seen it three or four times, and I'm like this one. This is one of the ones where it's like a head scratcher. - Well, welcome to Windfield. - Yes, so you've been chased by death basically. - Oh, you want to use a remake from the original? - Yeah. - Welcome to Windfield. - But it's weirder than the original. - It's weirder, but they also thought it was very funny. When we were shooting it, they just thought that Bruce, what's his name, Bruce? The guy who plays the lead in it. He plays death. - Yeah, he plays death. - Yeah. - Ah, it's not everything. - No, you're staring at some. - Not Billson. Is it Billson, or maybe that was the director? - Yeah, I'd have to look at it. I can't think of it. But yeah, I know who's funny. - Well, he was a very funny actor. And so he was playing death as this more me kind of guy. - Right, right. - You know? - But we were. - Sales guy. - Jonathan, Jonathan and I don't remember his last name at the moment. He was on Squarepegs. - Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yep, yep. - I loved the show. - I loved the show. - Oh, that was a great show. - It was such a good show. That show was so like, freaks and geeks or something. - Yes, it was a pre-freaks and geeks. - And there was a show where they came after it was definitely canned, 'cause it's not, clearly not a child for real audience, but that was totally jarring. - Oh, it was like. - A realistic sort of shot on the table. And then it's just, where are these people? - It's almost horrifying to hear it, like. - Disembodied laughter. - Disembodied laughter. Like, it was one of the people to go, what was that? - Yeah, there's ghosts or something? - Yeah. - There's people with flashlights coming up to Squarepegs in the audience as they make jokes. - I know. We played our stuff very sincere. - Right. - Webbers, right, you know? And I had to rescue my husband from this, 'cause he woke up and even that, like, no one, I didn't understand who was telling me to drive him away. - Right, right. - I think the husband was saying, we've got to get out of here or something. - Yeah, yeah. - I don't even-- - 'Cause I've been getting a script like that, that is sort of dense, like, you're like, I don't really even understand what I'm doing with this. - I didn't understand it. I was just so happy to have a job. - Yeah, yeah. - It didn't matter to me. - Just take the lines and make it to the alley. - You know, hit your mark, and even now it's hard because it was this big wind scene. - Yes, 'cause it's all in a desert tunnel. - It's in a desert, and when we first drive in, right, I pull up my car, they had this gigantic wind machine. - Right. - You know, I was supposed to be used in a deserted town and screaming and screaming, and then the cinematographer would yell, "Turn around," you know? But I couldn't hear him. - Could you hear that, yeah. - I couldn't hear him. And he did not like me because I would hit my mark, and then I would never turn around when he wanted me to, but it ended up working out because he made me cry, and so that worked for the scene. - Oh, here you go. - So I, yeah, just used it. - Perfect. - Yeah, so we got there, and it was all very serious between the two of us, and then all the other scenes were like the little he-hawn music. - Right, right, right. 'Cause it's like a ghost town. - It was a ghost town, and nobody grows old there. - Right, and you do tales from the dark side around the same time? - I did, I did it with Renee Taylor, who's hilarious. - And there was more of a comedic episode. - Yeah, it was a very funny episode, although I had to do all the screaming with her. - Right, right. - We did, and that was a very ricky-- - That's like a three-day shoot kind of-- - Yeah, because we did it at some sound stage where the set kind of shook a little tear. - There were almost all bottle episodes because there was one set. - Yeah, it was very much like that, and I played a nice Jewish girl, which I wasn't. - Right. - Not that I'm not a nice Jewish girl. - You see me as an capital girl, guys. - I know, I know, I know, I know, it's like-- - We're expanding the rules. - We're expanding my-- - You're not a nice cow Jewish girl. - Yeah, nice Jewish girl. That's supposed to be a nice cat that girl. So I, but, and that was the episode that she wanted me to be a nice Jewish girl and did some, you know, the mott's ball soup, and, you know, and everything that was a cliche with a thing, she turned into a, if she wore this tooth or something. - Yeah. - She turned people into things. - Yeah, it was a very confusing one as well. - Yeah, but funny, and the kid, the kid in the show ended up doing that big, I think a Tom Hanks movie, wasn't he a big? - Yeah, he was a big, yes, yeah, he was, yeah. - He was a big. - He spent time, did you just know every program ever, ever made? - Pretty much. Well, my knowledge base ends around 95, which is when I was in a band and started going to college, so I stopped paying. - Oh, okay. - I saw it, I sorta got a life a little bit. - Oh, okay, but that's astonishing, but you know everybody's-- - I don't even, I never tried to learn it. - I think you invented IMDb. - I might have, well, I didn't need it. - You really don't even need it. - IMDb and YouTube just made me so much less special as a human being. I used to get phone calls from people I hadn't talked to in ages. It could be like an ex-girlfriend from eight years ago and be like, "Hey, how are you?" She's like, "Good, who played this thing "in this movie that I tell 'em to be like, "All right, bye." It would just be like, "I know, we'll know this." And then we'll just call for this pub for these places. - You were like the million dollar question when you were the phone friend? - The phone friend? - You'd be the phone friend. - Someone did have me as their phone friend once on that. - Of course. - And they didn't get to that. - Oh, no, it's too bad, because they wouldn't work. - They could've won. So I don't wanna take too much of your time but I do wanna ask, just 'cause Real Genius is such a favorite movie online about the-- - How did I get cut out? - You know, this is what happened. I guess maybe that was my first movie. Yeah, that was my first movie. - Did you know you'd been cut out or did you just go to the premiere? - No, I went to the premiere and that's when I found out. It was devastating. - That's awful. - But I only had a couple of lines but I played the Girl at the Science Fair. - Yeah, since the beginning of the movie when they were crewed in Mitch for-- - When they were crewed in it, yeah. I had my own little display of some sort of science thing. I was geeky, I had the big flip of a hairstyle and I think I was interviewed or somebody talked to me and was talking about my thing. - Their experiment. - And my experiment, and then I got cut up. But ever since then, like I've gone to conventions and things or people will bring a poster of real genius inside it and I'm like oh, but, honey I'll do it, it's just, I'm not, you understand I'm not really-- - Do you think you'd just look at your MDB or something and are like, maybe I just don't remember-- - But they don't even care. Like they'll know that I'm not in it but because my name is in the scroll, I'm sorry. - That counts. - Okay, guess that counts. And I still get residual checks for-- - That's still good. - Yeah, well it's a penny. - Yeah. - You know what I'm talking about? - No, if you get a couple million of those and it doesn't say Catholic school girl on it-- - You know that I'm happy. - Yeah, although you could've been a Catholic school girl-- - I couldn't say it's fair. - Yeah, I could've been, I don't remember what kind of school it was. It might've been a private school. - I could've been a private school girl. - Yeah, it was always some kind of school girl. - That movie is so, that, I think anyone's trying to write a comedy, that movie is, because it has a really good spy plot basically. - Oh yeah. - And like a really good message about like anti-war, longer in government stuff, it was like sort of team comedy. - Yeah, the team comedy. - You do not get that now, with comedies at all. It's sort of, stuff's very specific, more general. - Yeah, yeah. But whatever happened to the boy, not me. - He, it was a vicious rumor that he became Sarah Jessica Parker. (laughing) It looked very similar. - Wow. - Yeah, that was-- - He's done very well for himself. - Yes, that was spread on the internet for many years, that he became, you see, he-- - He is so good in the sex of the city. - Yes, he's so good. - He's very good in the city. - He's very good in the city. And he was very happy with first be away from many years. (laughing) Yeah, I think he dropped that acting and he's, I was getting confused with Michael Ian, what's his name, that was in weird science. They both sort of stopped acting around the same time and became like academics or something. They teach college or something like that. - Yeah, I always wondered, because he was the big fan. I remember there was big campaign audition to try to find the kid. - Right. - You know, and they found the kid. - He was great in it, and he was perfect for that. - He was great, and we all thought, and I think he did go on to do some. - He was almost too real in that movie where he seemed too much like that kid, which was maybe like off-putting for people. - Yeah, really, he kind of, the small interaction I had with him, he was a very sweet boy. And Val Kimeter was, you know, like-- - So you met him? - Yeah, yeah. - 'Cause he wasn't in the scene that year. - No, he was around. - He was around, he had other stuff that he was filming, and he was a wildcat, and-- - Did they shoot that at Caltech? - I did not remember, it's probably, probably. - He didn't travel outside of Los Angeles for that. - No. - So I remember, like, even, I remember in Elm Street, I think we shot in Fontana, this is what I remember, all I remember is getting into my little dodge colds. - Right. - Okay, my 1975 dodge cold. - Nice. - That used to be weak, Anna, Anna Fluid, what do you call it? The 1983s, you know, so all my shoes were green. - Right. - And appropriate for an I mean, yeah. - Yes, and I had to drive out and meet some man in a van. - That sounds legit. (laughing) - He was on the side of the freeway in Malibu, and then he would take it from there. So. (laughing) - He's not hand off. (laughing) - Wow. - Yeah, this was like getting picked up, that was fancy getting picked up in the days for you to shoot. - Yeah, who'd meet you halfway? - Who'd meet you, that's all they would do. So they picked me up with a gal, Alison Barron, who's her name. - Oh yeah. - I don't know what happened to Alison, I think, I don't know that she acted after that, but she and I were the screaming cheerleaders in the bus. - Yep. - And we just had two days, and I remember, when I almost broke my nose that we were crying on the bus. - Do you think it was something? - No, you know when we first, that first day we went out into the desert, right? And it was a real bus. - Yeah. - And Robert was driving, right? - Actually driving. - Actually driving, and you know, this was the big technical advancements of the day, right? So we were driving, we'd be driving over the bumps and whatever, and then I started driving really fast. - Let's get stumped back. (laughing) - I should've got stumped back, because at one point, I slammed my head, my face, into the seat in front of me. - In the true seatbelts, huh? - Scrubbed seatbelts, and I got a bloody nose, and I'm like screaming, and crying, 'cause it hurt, you know? - Yeah, like this is great. - Yeah, they're like, that's great, that's great, keep it up. - You just saved money on special effects here. Did you see the first one? - I did see the first one, I think I did, but I didn't, I was in school and really tired, and I didn't know how popular it was. - Yeah. - To me, this was just a small horror movie. - Yeah, it's just like a weekend job, where you made a fan of Ann and Malibu, and then you'd have to go home. - And then you go to the screaming scene in the bus, and the next deal was a really late shoot somewhere, I don't remember, and they had a bus raved on a, on a, I don't know, some sort of mechanism that would make the bus go back and forth. - Right, right. - You know? - Like a ship ride. - Yeah, right, and then the mechanical bus would go back and forth, and then they would have us and look out the window and there was like the lights and stuff, but today I'm sure it's like really sad, a special effect. - Well, it looks somewhat convincing and terrifying. It must be weird for people like me or anyone who comes up and asks you about like these things that you did as a job from two days ago, you know, years ago, and like, you know, if someone asked me about what I did in my office job 10 years ago for someone to get a day in there, you'd remember. - There's so many things where I don't even remember, or somebody will send me a picture and I'll go, I don't, I really-- - Did this happen? - This is an early senior moment for me because I don't remember it. - But why would, I mean, you don't, you know, Mary Lou Hannah, you don't remember every single thing that ever happened in your life? - Yeah, no. - And so in person. - I know, she's amazing. - Yeah, she has a hypernesia. - Is it actually a disorder? - Yeah, it's a great disorder to ask. - Yes, absolutely. - There's only like 10 known cases of it in the world where they remember every single thing that happened. - She's astonishing. I worked on a Hallmark commercial with her husband. - Oh, really? - Yeah, it was one of them back in the day to know like mini movies. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Telly Savales' daughter was in it. - Oh, we're in. - Yeah. - Is this mid-80s? - It was mid-80s. It was just before just the 10 of us though. So when they were negotiated to put it back on, you know, they were only showed during Hallmark movies. - Right. - Remember my commercial agent was like-- - Hallmark Hall of Fame. - Hallmark Hall of Fame, yeah. Was one of those special card, you know, but they were like little mini movies. - Oh yeah. Yeah, did you do a lot of commercials? - I did, yeah, I did a lot of commercials. And then when I got TV, I was told not to do commercials. - She pins your image or something? - Yeah, right. - Who was the first person that you worked with that you'd like to really start struck you? - Oh, well, I remember one night, I got really, you know, I was in love with Mark Hamill growing up, but who wasn't? I'm sure you were too. - I wasn't, but that's who wasn't. - That's who wasn't. - That's who wasn't? - Okay, it was Ken, and that was it, because-- - 'Cause of course at summer, obviously. - Oh, of course, of course. - It's a big movie. - I would be happy and complete if I could just get a DVD copy of that movie. - Well, it's not a print sadly, Corbin. - Oh no, that's terrible. - I could probably hook you up. - Please. - Yeah. - You see, I, you know, that was my crush when I was growing up. His posters, just wallpaper in my room. - Really? - Oh, you know, it was off the charts, like, I was gonna marry him, he would, he would realize that one day that we would-- - Yeah, he just has to know about it, it's clear. - Yeah, he just doesn't meet me, right? - Right. - And I'm in, you know, loose in Maine. I didn't know how that was gonna happen. - He comes through every now and then. - He does, you know, it's impossible. - It's possible, there's lobsters really good there. - Yeah. - So I came out to California and I'd been working for a while, or whatever, and I've worked with, you know, different movie stars and whatever, but then I was doing a voiceover, right? I got booked and I didn't know who the other talent was gonna be, so there was a man already in the booth, and the door open, you know, open the door and I walk in, and I see him, and it's Luke Skywalker. - Yeah. - You know, and he goes, hi, I said, I thought to myself, oh, he said hi to me. - He must know me. - He must, this is love, see, this is the moment. This is the moment. - You probably asked for me to do this. - He requested me, I know he did. - Yeah. - So I looked at him and I couldn't speak, and he said hi, and I said, oh my, oh my gosh. I said, I'm in love with you, is it too early for me to tell you that? - Just get it right out of the way. - Just get it, just get it right out there. - He probably gets that a lot. - Oh, he does, I'm sure he does. He's so laughing, he was as nice as can be, but I really like, that was a hard, I don't remember what the spot was, I don't remember anything, I think words came out of my mouth-- - You're just trying to get through it. - I'm just trying to get through it because I kept trying to inch my mic closer to his. - It must be difficult to, when you started working on these shows and stuff to still enjoy things that are on, because you know what's involved in making them? - Yeah, you know, that's an interesting idea. That's a good point. Yeah, because it's demystified a lot for me. I think it'd be really boring. - I imagine, it's a lot of waiting around. - It's a lot of waiting around. It's thrilling to like, you go on a hundred auditions and then you get the one job, and when you get the one job you go, oh, this is dull, you know, and you're thrilled to do it and it's fun when you get to do it, but it's just, most of it, we really are waiting in a trailer or a room. - Right, leading the magazine. - Leading and then you put makeup on at six o'clock in the morning by the time they actually are ready for you. It's all duked off onto your, you know, your chin. - Right. - And so they have to redo you. It's always about when people, you know, fluffing you up on the set, which I never understand, 'cause you're ready to do a scene in the makeup arts, because that's a job, you know, they come in, they do a little bit of, and I don't know what they do. - What's the difference is, you like just lost the thing or straight that you were doing? - Yeah, I mean, now she's ready. That one strand of hair is bothering me. - That really would have ruined the scene. - It really would have, I couldn't act if that one hair wasn't. - You know all these people that you've worked with, and then it's difficult for you to watch them in something as a character and think of them as that character? - That's a very good point too, yeah. There's some things where I go, oh, come on, that's so not like that. - Yeah. - Or that's, or sometimes more of the point that is so like that, we all have our crutches that we do, that we know that we'll get a laugh at, right? Or, and it'll be something characteristic that you would do, that you, because we can only be so different than us. - Yeah, and that's why you can't. - 'Cause you're, it takes you out of them as that character, 'cause like that's them doing it. Or imagine you might get really technical and just be like, oh wow, they're looking what they're doing and you enjoy that sort of thing. Is there anything you watch now? - What do I watch now? Oh well, my son and I watched, and my daughter, we watch Jeopardy every night, we love Jeopardy. He wins all the time, 'cause he's brilliant. He wins, and I want to get him on Jeopardy. - Get him on that college tournament. - Gonna get him on that college tournament. The high school tournament, he's silly. - I got to get the high school tournament, yeah. - Well, we'll watch Game of Thrones. - Right, as you discussed earlier. - We discussed for different reasons. - For different reasons. - What do I like to watch? You know what I like to watch? I like to watch 48 hours. - Okay, so more reality. - I love reality stuff, but not like Honey Boo Boo. - Right, but like New Year's stuff. I like Newsy stuff. I like Dateline. I like anything that I get involved with all the people and try to figure out, you know. - Stuff without actors. - Stuff without actors. They're using finger me out. This feels like a therapy session. - Oh, I'm sorry. - No, I think you know that's good. I'm fine. - I don't know which one is going to happen. - Thank you, and oh my god. - Yes. - Yeah, thank you for that. No, but it's true, I do, maybe that's it. Maybe that's my escape. - That's how you unwind. - I unwind, because I don't, yeah, I don't typically watch a whole lot of-- - You should be thinking about work, I guess. - Yeah, although, you know, one show I was absolutely addicted to was Malcolm in the middle. I've seen all of the episodes, as a family, we used to watch that over and over and over and over again. - I've only seen a few episodes, but that was a great show. That was very, nothing was on like it. It was very, very-- - No, it was so good. It was so funny. - No laugh track. - Brian, no, no laugh track. And Brian Cranston-- - He can do so much. - Yeah, I mean, he's really funny on that. And he was just a job and actor that was in-- - So many things for years and years and years. So it's nice to see people get a huge break later. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. My son was a big fan of Breaking Bad. Well, my dad, my dad's 90, and his favorite show is Breaking Bad. - Really? - Yeah. - Which I kind of love. - My dad really likes it too. I've never seen it. - You've never seen it. - I've never seen it. - Oh, you know, I saw the, I hadn't seen it either. I just saw the last episode. - That's all you need. You watched the first one on the last, and in the last episode of Breaking Bad, they get a cow, right? - Yeah, as they get a cow. - And then that's it, and then they gotta get canceled, but you can't-- - We don't need you any more. - You get a cow pregnant? - You can't get the cow pregnant. I think we get, did we not learn a lesson? - Yes, I think that should be in the vernacular now as the new Jump the Shark. The show got canceled because they got the cow pregnant. It's crossing the line. It's crossing the line. - It's crossing the line. - It's crossing the line. - Absolutely. - Because you do not leave the heifer alone. - Right. We're calling you phrases here. Thank you so much for doing the show. - Thank you. This is a really low fit. (upbeat music) - And there you have it. That was my episode with Joanne Millette. I told you it was a really good one. I'm sure you would enjoy it. I had a lot of fun with that one. A couple of corrections. I had forgotten that the show was not night nurse. It was called Nightingales. I remembered that after we had done the episode and somehow I forgot that her co-star in the amazing stories episode was John Cryer at the height of his ducky, pretty and pink, no small affair powers. So there you go. Also post-script to the suicide prevention charity, Joanne managed to raise so much money winning that marathon because her producers committed to donating so much money per mile that they had so much money that actually reopened the teen suicide hotline that they could not fund before. So she single-handedly reopened the teen suicide hotline. So great end to that story. Also she had so many stories and so many things that she didn't talk about on this podcast that we're gonna have to do a part two at some point. So the next time I'm out in LA, we'll sit down and we'll talk again and there'll be more than enough for a second episode. So if you wanna check her out, she still acts. She also is a very good writer and an amazing storyteller. She's working on a one-woman show that should be done very soon and she should start performing that at some point that you're definitely gonna wanna see. I know I will. You can check her out at joannewilllette.com and she will have updates from when that show will be done and produced and you will definitely wanna see it. So that was my first LA episode. As I said, we have a lot more with some amazing guests that blow my mind that I was able to get. We'll be releasing those in the next few weeks and months and definitely email me at candidateikendread.com. Subscribe on Stitcher, on iTunes, on SoundCloud. Make sure if you like the show that you tell other people about it that you review the show and rate the show. It's a huge help and we'll see you next week on TV guidance counselor. (upbeat music) (upbeat music) ♪ Heaven is ready, heaven is ready, heaven is ready ♪