TV Guidance Counselor
TV Guidance Counselor Episode 9: Hari Kondabolu
Wait. You have a TV? No. I don't like to read the TV guide. Read the TV guide. You don't need a TV guide. ♪ Tell me to let it ♪ ♪ Tell me to let it ♪ ♪ Tell me to let it ♪ ♪ Ah ♪ (upbeat music) Hello, welcome to TV Guidance Counselor. I am Ken Reger, TV Guidance Counselor. If you're a regular listener of the show, welcome back. Thanks so much for coming back and checking out the show yet again. If this is your first time with the show, I want to thank you for checking it out. Hopefully you'll stick around. And I think this is a good one to check out. My guest this week is comedian Harry Condobolo, who you may know from television. He was on the David Letterman show. He's been on Jimmy Kimmel on "Totally Bias." He's all over the place. You've seen him, you've heard of him. He was in town recently, where he was doing a small tour to promote his new album, "Waiting for 2042," which is out on "Kill Rock Stars," which as a side note is infinitely impressive to me as a teenage mega fan of "Bikini Kill," but that's something I'll get into at another time. This is a long one, so I want to warn you of that in advance, but it's interesting all the way through. Harry is a very smart guy in addition to being obviously very funny, he's very smart, he's very interesting, and I think we had a great conversation. So enjoy this week's episode of TV Guidance Counselor with my guest, Harry Condobolo, and I'll be back with you at the end of the show to chat a little bit. (upbeat music) - Harry Condobolo, how are you? - I'm good, how are you? - Good, thank you for walking to my home. - Yeah, it's a pleasure to stay here. - Oh, thank you very much. We run a little bread and breakfast. (laughs) As I was such a big fan of "New Heart," I said someday, I'll do that. And so you picked a TV guide from September 30th, 1989, what specifically drove you to this particular issue? - Well, I very much loved "Perfect Strangers" and the TGIF lineup, but I had "Perfect Strangers," so I figured, let's make that the starting point right now, 'cause that was like the biggest night for TV, it was pretty nice. - Absolutely, 'cause I wasn't leaving the house, I was like, "Yeah, seven." - It was the first branded night I remember too, like there wasn't, later they tried to recreate that on a Saturday night, where they called it "Saturday Night is Funny," it was a huge-- - They did, right? - They did, and they tried to bring TGIF back in the early TBCs. - He did that? - Yes, with Bonnie Hunt's "Life with Bonnie" show, which was actually a really good show, but it just didn't work, and I never-- - I never quite got Bonnie Hunt. - Really? - Like, I just remember there's a few different shows trying to push Bonnie Hunt down like this. - Yeah, Bonnie Hunt famous, I never understood. - She's amazing, so she's like one of my personal heroes. - Really? - So she was a second city person, I'll do the whole Bonnie Hunt reveal here. - She's a second city person, she turned down SNL three times because they wouldn't let her be a writer performer. - Wow. - Because they said they didn't do women writer performers. And she also turned down Designing Women. This gives me the most respect for her ever. I love Designing Women, but after Delta Burke left and the sort of original cast left, they tried to keep the show going, and Linda Bloodworth Thomas, who created the show left, they offered her a part in the show, she didn't like, she didn't think it was good, she read the scripts, and she's like, "This isn't good." She turned down $60,000 in episode to go back to Chicago and be a cancer nurse for $20,000 a year. - I feel terrible that I knew nothing about Bonnie Hunt. - She's amazing. - And that she's an incredible human, that's all like, whoa, so you're telling me, she's a very inspirational figure, incredibly talented in the show, every break she ever got, I did not know any of this. - David Letterman produced her first show called The Building. She wrote, produced, and directed every episode of the show. It got canceled, she canceled it herself because midway through the season, 'cause what some people probably don't know this, what networks will do is they'll sign actors for a whole season, and so they'll be a pilot with them, and if the pilot doesn't get picked up, they'll recast them in another show that did get picked up because they already have them under contract. So that's what happened to Bonnie Hunt's show, she had cast her friends and propped people that she'd been working with for years, and midway through the show, they said, "We're not canceling your show, "but we're recasting everybody with these other actors "from shows that got canceled." And she said, "No, you're not, "'cause I'm canceling my show." And so-- - You can actually do that. - You can do that, 'cause I don't think they would believe that you would do that, because who would do that? People would go, "Fine, as long as I have my own show, "but she canceled her own show." But she also wrote this movie called Return To Me, that's one of the most bittersweet, sad, really funny movies that I really enjoy. So, Bonnie Hunt, I always go on my Bonnie Hunt rent, and then people go, "You really--" - Has this happened before? - It has happened before. My Kaplan is always completely shocked about my love of Bonnie Hunt. - How often does Bonnie Hunt come up? - She really seems to come up frequently. It's probably just when people talk to me, Bonnie Hunt comes up. - Why did Bonnie Hunt come up right now? - Because I had brought her up. - And what was it called? - Because they brought back TJIF, and they used her show Life With Bonnie as the first one for the show. That show had a really interesting concept, because she was a talk show host on the show. - The Bonnie Hunt Show. - And the Bonnie Hunt Show. And she's a big improv person. So, the structure of the show was that the sitcom part was written, but the segments that were the talk show were all actually like an improv kind of talk show. So, it had a lot of weird moments on it. But she's good to check her out. So, anyway, we started here with Saturday night, eight o'clock, the night after the previous evening's TJIF, which we'll get to at the end here. And what did you go with at eight? - Mr. Belvedere. - Mr. Belvedere is an all-time favorite of mine. This is sort of at the very tail end of the show, where Wesley was a little bit too old for it to be. - Right. - I also, this was part of a sub-genre that was very odd phenomenon in the '80s, that was sometimes referred to as the many sub-genre. - Right, right. - A thousand charge and who's the boss? I never knew anyone that had a housekeeper. - Right, right, right. - Or a butler. - And they weren't rich families. - No, these families were rich families. They were middle class families. - Like middle class, blue collar families, and they were just like, yeah, I have a butler. - Yeah. - Like, that's a normal thing. And everyone accepted this. No one ever questioned it on the show. - I didn't question it until now. - Actually, it is a regular thing. - But if you knew someone in elementary school. - Those homes weren't gigantic. - No. - Like someone was like, my butler's gonna pick me up from practice today. Like, would you be like, what do you, what? - Yeah. - Everyone's like, yeah, but Mr. Belvedere makes sense. It makes sense. So in this episode, Belvedere and Wesley team up on a quiz show called BrainBusters, but when Belvedere answers all the questions, Wesley wants to bust him. Meanwhile, Heather's breakup with a boyfriend breaks Masha's bank account. This was an odd thing where so many sitcoms, some point they ended up on a game show. - Right, right. - I don't know anyone that's ever been on a game show, but this happened to everybody. I think it was just remaking that "Honeymooner's" episode where Jackie, where, oh my God, I'm, Jackie Gleason just is the home of the home and I'm just completely panics on TV. - Is that what happened? Is it happening in that particular episode? - No, no, and this one, Wesley gets mad that Belvedere like keeps hogging the spotlight. There was a lot of weird conversation. - You don't remember the episode? - I do remember the episode, yeah. Belvedere was a huge, a huge show in my world. I loved that show. I had, I've told this story on stage before, but I had my first sexual dream about Heather and my first daughter, which was not really that sexual. I dreamed that I saw her bra and she was like carrying it in like a laundry basket. - I kind of remember the older brother. - Yes, he used to be Doug Benson's roommate. - Really? - Yes, for some reason, I'm thinking, I remember his haircut. - It was very unusual. - It was very of that error, right? - Yes, yeah, Kevin. There was an episode where he date ripped somebody. - What do you mean? - There was an episode about, 'cause Belvedere had some dark episodes, there were two molestation episodes. - Who got molested? - Wesley did. - By who? - By his, is not camp counselor, his boy scout leader. - He got molested? - Yes, full on, like, it definitely happened. They didn't obviously-- - Not a different stroke kind of, oh, they just, Dudley just got out. - How do you think Dudley got out? - I think I probably, I think I decided as a kid that he must have gotten. - Yeah, see, I couldn't have been. - As a kid, I was like, Dudley got it, man. - Really? - Yeah, that's right. I thought Arnold obviously escaped, but I felt Arnold was kind of a dick. I felt like he threw Dudley under the bus to a skate place. - Yeah, yeah, yeah, that sounds about right. - That show, that particular episode, I remember that this is the most-- - The different stroke. - The different strokes, yeah. The most disturbing part of that was the game that he made. - The shirt thing when you do this. - Do you remember what the game was called though? Neptune King of the Sea. He was like, "You kids wanna play Neptune King of the Sea?" And for, which was clearly a comedy writer came up with that. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And that, just for years as a kid, I was like, what was that? Why was it the sea? I don't understand, and it just terrified me. - Yeah. - What a weird, I was-- - Well, let's go back to the Belvedere. - Oh yeah, Belvedere, yes, yeah. - So he definitely-- - Yes, yes he did. - Well, that Wesley definitely got molested. - Wesley definitely was-- - And there was another one where a kid from that he went to school with was getting molested at home by, I think, his stepfather. - And was the situation where Wesley and the other-- - They didn't call back the other one either. They were self-contained. - As if it never happened. As if it never happened. There was a famous episode of Belvedere, which was the first family sitcom to mention AIDS. - Wow. - One of Wesley's classmates got AIDS from a blood transfusion, so you wasn't bad AIDS. - Right, right. - And-- - Both of them were young. - Yeah, very young, yeah. - It was a Ryan White kind of situation. And they kicked him out of school, and Wesley, he was supposed to play Lincoln in the school play, and they said-- - Well, I remember the Lincoln, yeah, yeah, yeah. - You can't play Lincoln 'cause you have AIDS, and then he came over to give Wesley his costume, and Wesley was like, "I don't want this 'cause you have AIDS." And he's like, "Oh, my mom washed it. "I remember feeling very bad for him." - Wait, but so the date rate there was-- - Yeah, so Kevin, the other date rate? - Yes, yes, and Belvedere had to tell him that's what it was. He came home drunk, he was like, "Oh, she wanted a Belvedere." He was like, "Kevin, no, he means no." - What? - Yeah. - Wait a second. - Yeah. - And that was something that everyone had to be okay with, that one of the characters on the show was a rape. - But they taught you a lesson that he shouldn't have done that. And in another episode, someone attempted to date rape Heather. - Did they call back what-- - No. - They never-- - It was very rare. - They're not communicating that family. - I don't think so, I don't think so. It was very, and then in the next episode, Kevin, the older brother, tried to become Amish, to date an Amish girl. There was some weird stuff going on on the show. - Is he a rapist on television, like it was a regular character? 'Cause it wasn't an attempt that he raped you. - Yes, but they were on a date, so it wasn't like a full on-- - Oh my God. - Yeah, and then there was another episode where he wanted to do it with the school slut, that everyone, and she had a reputation. So he started taking her out, and she thought he really liked her because he would take her on actual dates. And there's one of the most uncomfortable scenes that's straight out of a senior art project, one act play, where he's like, "Come on, we got our eight times and nothing's happened." And she's like, "I thought you liked me. "Let's just do it on the pull-out couch here, Kevin. "Come on, that's what you want." And he's like, "No, it's like this. "I remember being like seven years old "and then this is very awkward." - Yeah. - And I really-- - He's an awful person. - He really is an awful person, yeah. Yeah, he really is. It was a very unlikable character. - Yeah, I don't think any of this registered. - Probably not, your brain probably just shut down so that you could live your life. - Well, yeah, and also it was just like, "Gah, 'cause the Belvedere." - It's funny. - He's looking at that guy, he's British. - Well, the tone of it was so weird because now you wouldn't get a three camera live audience sitcom that tackled these sort of-- - Yeah, yeah. - Dramatic, and that happened all the time then. It was like a very-- - And it'd be like tourists I'd imagine or getting to be in the studio audience and just like, "What the hell is this?" - And they would laugh the next line. Like, in the AIDS episode, there's one of the most-- - Was it a live audience? Is it a chance it was a laugh track? - It was a live audience on Belvedere. And actually, Doug Benson used to go to the tapings every week 'cause he was a Canadian dude. - He was an amazing dude. - The guy there. But in the AIDS episode, Wesley's playing Lincoln in the school play and there's a black kid at his lunch table with him. - Yeah. - And he goes, "Hey Wes, I heard you're playing Lincoln "in the school play." And he goes, "Yeah, if you give me a cupcake, I'll free ya." - Cheesers. - So they have like a writer's room where they're like throwing these kind of things in there. And I always wondered on different strokes or something when they're pitching stories and someone's like, "All right, how about this?" Mr. Drummond goes out of town, they throw a party, they gotta clean up before he gets home. And they're like, "Perfect." And then he's like, "How 'bout this one?" Someone molest Dudley. And then they would just be like, "Great, okay." - Check, check. - Check. - Check. - It was very, very odd timing to think of the average. - A bunch of people who were like, "Ah, I should be doing moves." "Ah, my stand of career didn't work out of me." - I'll show 'em. - I'm gonna pitch something, they'll never go for this. - They'll never go for this joke in there. - Well, weirdly on Mr. Belvedere, a bunch of the guys who worked on Mr. Belvedere formerly worked on Barney Miller and some of them worked on WKRP and Cincinnati and these shows that were kind of more adult. - So that's what some of the themes might be. - I think so. Some of it, I would love to talk to a writer from that show just to be like, "Did you know, like, how aware were you?" Like, "I can't believe we were getting away with this stuff." - Right, right. - Or just like, "No, it was just the times, it made sense." - What happened? What was it? Remember that SNL sketch was Belvedere? - Brought to him. - Brought to him. - Yeah, couldn't remember the name that they gave him. - Yes, Brought to him. Yeah, I really, Belvedere had this weird, dirty air to me. I thought I was gonna get in trouble for watching it 'cause of some of the topics. So I used to actually tape it and then sneak downstairs and watch it with headphones on 'cause I thought I would get in trouble. - I mean, I'm shocked about Bob Yooker being, I keep forgetting he's, and it's very unlikable. - In that show? - Just generally. - I like Bob Yooker. - I guess compared to like regular baseball announcers. - I think he's really, I loved him in Major League. - Well, yeah, he was on his hall of fame speech is great. - But as a dad, he was kind of a dickhead. - Oh, he's on that show. - Yeah, on that show, it wasn't his best lightness. - No, but I felt like it was probably an accurate portrait of Bob Yooker. - At least on what? - I don't know, he just seems like that kind of like a faded sports dad who's disappointed in his children. (laughing) And I was just like, yeah, you'll never be what I was. It could have been something, maybe I'm projecting. - I think so, because I never got that at a hall. - It was a weird thing that, I mean, that show was built around him. - Right. - What a weird, that doesn't happen now. Like I can't think of a sports caster that'd be like sitcom. - It's where it was built around him. The show's called Belvedere. - Right, 'cause Belvedere. - 'Cause which was a series of movies starring Clifton Webb in the 1940s. - Oh, okay. - So ABC had purchased the television rights for that and just had it in their vault, basically. So they kind of slapped it on. That happened a lot where they would have two or three disparate, either franchises they owned or contracts they had to develop shows and were slapped them together. Like Webster was a case like that. That was actually two shows that they made into one show. (laughing) 'Cause they only had one slot on the schedule that year. So it was just, these things where you think are, all this thought went into it. It's just some executive decision. I don't know, flip a coin and then it's on for eight years. So Belvedere, this was the last season of Belvedere and this was a sort of a pre-TGIF lineup. It had been moved from Friday nights. The reason being that it was not produced by Miller Boyette who produced all of the other TGIF shows. And so they dumped it on Saturday nights. I probably would have watched that as well, although COPS was on and that is a favorite of mine. I watched that every week 'til this day. In this episode, a dying witness in a triple homicide gives testimony to department chief Chris Peterson, which is funny 'cause that was the main country. - On COPS. - Yeah. - On COPS, that not the Fox Show COPS. - The Fox Show COPS. In the first two, three seasons of COPS, they used to actually show the trials. They would show them processing the people. - Oh wow. - They would do follow up. It was almost like a real social documentary. - Like that they were human beings. - Exactly. - That's not complex as opposed to just like. - Azam! - Right, right, right. - It was, I had no idea. - It was an interesting show. The idea of COPS was brilliant because Fox was trying to do cheap programming. And in most states, I don't know if this is still the case, but as a taxpayer, you have a right to go on ride-alongs. So if you call the police station, you say, "I wanna go on a ride-along and they'll do a date and time." You can film it, that's your right to go on these. - So they basically took the ride-along concept and made it. - And said, "Can we film?" And they had the right to do that. - They had the right to sell it as a show? - Yes, yeah, there was like only in certain states though, which is why it kind of reoccurred in certain states. And there's some states you never saw COPS as COPS. - I mean, I liked COPS as a kid because, you know, just the, it's COPS and arresting people and good guys and bad guys. - Yeah. - And I think as I got older, it was just like, it's just, it feels like poverty tourism. - It absolutely is. - Yeah. - And then sometimes you just feel bad for like so getting into the, but some of it, I just, I love the excuses. - Right. - I brought it up here before, but my favorite is, I've never once worn pants that weren't mine, but if you watch COPS, - This happens all the time. - That happens all the time. - Or even like these pants are mine. - Yeah, they'll be like, "What is this on you?" And he's like, "I don't know, he's not my pants." And he'll be like, "Where'd you get him?" And he's like, "I just found him." And it's like that's-- - Yeah, he's just running out of it. - It's not a thing that happens. So come up with a better excuse for that. So I probably would have flipped back and forth. 8.30, what'd you go with? - Cosby Show. - Cosby Show. Now this was an odd phenomenon and you would ask me when you were looking through this that wasn't Cosby on Thursdays, and it was, but this is a Providence edition of TV Guide. And for some reason in New England, on various stations, they wouldn't air-- some shows, they just wouldn't air. And they would always fill in with a rerun of Cosby Show. So like in the Boston area, WCVB5, which is our ABC affiliate, on Friday nights at 9.30, when Perfect Strangers was in that slot, they would air the Cosby Show. And I would have to pull the cable out and try to get Perfect Strangers from New Hampshire or Rhode Island if I wanted to watch it. - Like you couldn't see Pro Exchanges at all. - Yeah, it was like blacked out like a baseball game. - Were they-- what was it? - I have no idea. They would just be like, "We're not airing it. We're wearing a Cosby Show rerun." And they never explained it. It was very strange. And there probably wasn't an issue in New York. I don't know why. - No, I've never heard of this. I think I was confused, though. Why was it on Saturdays? I remember. - Yeah. - It was on Thursday, and then there was a whole competition with The Simpsons and The Cosby Show. In The Simpsons was killing it. - Yeah. - Which is why, you know, it was probably some weird New England blue law. - Right. - Like you can't buy alcohol on Sunday, and also you have to air every Cosby Show's every week. I probably would have watched this, although Amen was on, which I was a fan of at the time. However. - Well, the thing is, if I had known that there was a rerun, I think I probably would have done Amen as well. - Amen was a fun show. I always like Sherman Helmsley. But at the same time, there was the very short-lived spin-off of Who's the Boss On. And this was a show called Living Dolls. And this starred Alyssa Milano and Lea Remini of King of Queens. - Oh, that's amazing. They are actually a good pair. - Yes. The concept of this show was that Lea Remini was one of Alyssa Milano's friends from the old neighborhood back in Brooklyn, kind of a tough Brooklyn show. But it's very pretty, obviously, 'cause she's Lea Remini. And they get scouted to become models and their teen models. And it was what's her name, Holly Berry. It's her first show. - She was on two shows at the same time. - She was. She was on the first couple episodes of Living Dolls to sort of transition the fan base and then pull back. And it was just Lea Remini, it was the main character. - With Holly Berry. - With Holly Berry. And there was a couple of their actresses in here that let me see if anyone I recognize. No, Holly Berry is really the only famous person that came out of this as a model. This episode with an unwitting assist from Samantha Micelli, this is a big Charlie, who is Lea Remini, finalizes plans for her own birthday blowout, unaware that Trish plans to surprise her the same night. - Her name is, I like how her name is Charlie, she was called Sam, Sam and Charlie. - They're like guys, they're Tom boys. It was not a very successful show, but I loved it. I actually liked it better than who's the boss. But I was also eight years old, and a household model so it was very appealing. So we're gonna go with that, nine o'clock, what'd you go with? - And what was Mag with Children. - Mag with Children, now this has come up a few times before how I always watch this show at the time. But sort of you the way you are viewing cops, I kind of view Mag with Children that way. It was sort of, I love blue collar shows about poor struggling people 'cause it was kind of how I grew up. But Mag with Children was such a cartoonish. It was a laugh at, not a laugh with. - And I think for me, I mean, certainly watching it as a kid, it was no critical analysis at all. It's like, and it's Al Bundy so funny, his hands were always down his pants. - Oh man, he flushed the toilet. - Right, it was like his lot of potty humor in his faces, his face is where his stay. - I like him as a kid, like he's great, and he's great in the movie Dutch. Did you ever see that movie? It's John Hughes movie. He's also in Wayne's world, he's a highlight. - Right, right, that's where I used to be. - Yeah, I mean, I like him in all kinds of things. He was in a TV version of the French connection as Popeye Doyle didn't last too long. But I loved it at the time, and when I try to watch it now, I feel like bad about it. - Yeah, yeah. - Like it just seems so. - Well, I remember they always made jokes about, I think this might have been the era when it was hard to get Fox. - Yes, absolutely. - Like you were talking about the bunny ears, like you had to put it on just to get Fox, and they used to make jokes like, all right, we're gonna watch something on Fox, and they put tin foil on, and they-- - Oh yeah, 'cause Fox was an interesting concept when that for 40 years, we had three networks. And Fox decided we're gonna be a new network, which is like saying, I'm gonna start a football team. It's right behind the NFL, it just sounds crazy. And I can't believe I made a sports metaphor coming from this, it's a very odd thing. But when it first started, it was only on two days a week. So Fox, so your local UHF station was Monday through Friday, and then Fox would be Saturday and Sunday. - Why was it hard to watch? - It was usually, so what they would do is they would go in and basically get the cheapest station they could get. So they would say, what station struggling, that's the lowest rent station, will make a deal with them to be the Fox affiliate. Because most stations were like, we don't need you, everything's working fine. So they literally went into like a UHF station, like weird aisle UHF, and we're like, all right, we'll give you X amount of money to have two days a week. So really the only stations that were willing to give that up were stations that really didn't have much of a broadcast signal or were like, you know, if it's, if you're in New York City, it's out of, you know, upstate New York, but it's only broadcasting to New York City. - Made with children was a hit, right? - It was, and it was a surprise hit. So it was actually a very cheaply produced show on Fox. And Fox is what they were betting on when they first came out, was a show that they invested all their money in called "Wearwolf." And it was a very serious sort of rip off for the incredible Hulk about a teenager who gets bit by our "Wearwolf" and spends the rest of his life trying to find the guy that bit him to kill him and rid himself of the curse and travels around and helps people. And they spent a ton of money on the special effects and the promotion. I remember they had this giant lenticular 3D poster in Boston on the subways when I was growing up, and it ate it. No one liked the show. And so the two hits from "Really Fox" were "Matter with Children" or "America's Most Wanted," the two shows that they kind of had as filler. And then they used those shows as the models for what built Fox. - And then when "Simpsons" happened, that was-- - That was, it just really took Fox to the next level. Once "The Simpsons" came on, Fox was a seven night a week show. I mean, "21 Jump Street" was a pretty big hit. - Tracy Elman. - Tracy Elman, but Tracy Elman was sort of a cult show. Tracy Elman was Fox's critically acclaimed show. So that was back in the time when networks, which will sound crazy to people who only know TV now, would want a show that was critically acclaimed, even if nobody watched it, so that they could be like, "Here's our rating show, "and here's our critic show." - Right. - You know, like saying elsewhere was that show for it. - I wish that still was the king. - Yeah, like we need some credit and some money. And Tracy Elman was their show for that. It was like, it didn't really get a ton of ratings, but it always, everybody loved it. It always got great reviews. And they could be like, "Now we can show stuff "like "Matter with Children." And it kind of balances it out. So yeah, they would never do that now. But they did, a ton of shows sort of in the wake of Maricopa, and that sort of set, I think that set the Fox reputation of like sleazy. I always felt like Fox, it was like someone took a 1989 porno movie and just cut the sex scenes out as a Maricopa. It was like shot very garishly. - Yeah, yeah. - It was like, it's like a soft call with no nudity. - I just even, the levels, what was the big ones? - Big ones, is the magazine up, no ma'am? - No, yeah, it's funny 'cause there's this whole like misandary movement and everything and men's rights and all that and all that. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And it's like, I put this on Tumblr, I think, just how funny it is like whenever I think of like the misandary movement and men's rights movement, I just think of no ma'am. - Oh yeah. - I just think of, oh, this is a real life no ma'am. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's weird how, I feel like society's grown into married with children and that's kind of terrifying. - Right, right. - And it was so ridiculous. And now you watch it and you're like, this is fairly tainty. - Yeah, right. - It's one of the reality shows that we have. So 9.30 would you go with? - Well, it was 9, right? - Yep, 9 you were with married children, right? - Oh, I was looking at the wrong, what was looking at Sunday, sorry. - Oh, Saturday at 9 o'clock today. - Saturday at 9 o'clock, sorry about that. - Oh, that's all right. - Saturday at 9, I went with World at War, which is a documentary about World War II 'cause it was tricky 'cause there's this funny thing between, okay, what would I watch now if I had the chance, what would I have watched as a kid? - Right. - And I feel like World at War, I would not have watched as a kid. - Don't have been like a punishment. - Right, why did I watch this World War II thing? - Did your parents watch that kind of stuff? - Yes. - Did you only have one TV in the house? - Yes. - So you were at the victim of what they would have watched so if they would have been like, "We're watching this World War II documentary." - Right, and we eventually got a second TV but initially, yes, like I think at that time I think we only had one, so yeah, that was the end of the night. - Yeah, I'm going to bed. - At the same time, I was seven, so I would have been asleep probably anyway but not 10. - True, true. So this was World at War documentary on PBS, this was June 1941, Hitler sends three million Germans to attack Russia and what was to be a war of destruction. - And you know, when you read it that way, it's like, yeah, why wouldn't I want to see that? - Sounds pretty exciting. - Yeah, right? - It's so weird that I'm like, I want to see you marry with children, I guess, as opposed to like the World War. - It's real stuff that happens. - Yeah. - Weirdly, almost along the same lines, there's a thing out at this time that I'm not familiar with, but I would have watched, it's something called Soviet television tonight. - Oh, I did not. - And this is two glass-nosed era films, the view from my window on the plate of the elderly and a ray of hope about orphans and delinquents. Curiosity really, what I think would make me watch that. I don't, I can't imagine a time when an American network aired glass-nosed era films. - Well, it was 1980, so it was, what would have been after the fall of the war? This has been a rare-- - What would have been the wall fall, 1989? - The late '89, yeah, so this would have been after the fall of the war, so maybe it was just to rub it in. - Yeah, it is. - This is what you had. 9.30 would you go with? - Well, that goes an hour. - Oh, that's an hour. - Yeah. - So at 9.30, I would have watched one of my favorite shows, it was a science magazine show called "Beyond Tomorrow." This aired on Fox at the time, this was Fox's sort of high-brow show at the-- - Yeah, yeah. - And it was originally started as an Australian series and it was, they're fun to watch now because they're sort of visions of the future to see what actually happened and what didn't. And then this one included a new drug that may increase the human lifespan, a new look at the wheel. I can't imagine a television show that-- - A new look has a new wheel. - A new look at the wheel. Who wouldn't watch that? And it was a square. - Yes, it's more round than ever. Sunday night at a clock, what'd you go with? - America's Most Wanted. - Did you watch that every week? - I watched it regularly, I think there's something about a show like that or "Unsolved Mysteries," which with the re-enactments and stuff. Me and my brother always found it kind of exciting and creepy and weird and we'd have bad dreams at the same time, it was just so like-- - Oh my God, this really happened. - Oh yeah, that's what was very terrifying about it. Did you ever see anyone you thought you knew on "America's Most Wanted"? - No, you? - No, I always ask everyone that 'cause somebody had to. - Right, well that was the best of the show. - Yeah, someone even supposed to call and then-- - Exactly. - "America's Most Wanted" was the most sort of, had the most credibility because they didn't do like aliens and stuff like some mysteries did, but also in many ways was the most terrifying. And I loved how badass John Walsh was. - Yeah, yeah. - Like he just kinda came across like, "I go get these people myself but I'm busy today." - Well, I didn't even know the backstory behind it until I'd say that I'm like, "Of course." - Oh yeah. - The sun was killed and was taken and killed and it was just like, "Yeah, this guy means business." - Could you imagine that happening now? Like if some vigilante got his own TV show? Like I can't imagine that kind of thing now. Like, I'm actually speaking-- - Is that really a vigilante though, right? - No, I mean, but he was very close to being a vigilante. - He had the tone of a vigilante. - Yes. - But he's not a vigilante only because the whole premise of the show was called law enforcement. - Yes. - In the '90s, they don't call them. - He would be like, "You hunt them down and find them. "Then tell someone to see you." (laughing) - I mean, he also had a thing about that show too is that like a friend told me that they had a friend who was a reenactment actor and that was an issue 'cause people would call on him. - If they saw him, they thought it was-- - Yeah, 'cause they were-- - Oh yeah. - That's a reenactment, no, that's a reenactment. You're confusing the mugshot or the sketch with-- - That doesn't, I mean, I worked at a local TV station and when I was in college and I worked in the audience complaint line basically, which if you ever become a crazy person who calls TV stations to complain 'cause there's no way people do that, just know that the person answering the phone is a college kid in the mailroom and they're like, "Shit." But they would often confuse that stuff. So yeah, if there was a movie on, sometimes they'd think it was a news report or that they would think the news was a movie and routinely. So I imagine just that someone, I'd like to hunt someone out who manned the phones at America's most wanna just to hear some of the things they, in the Unsolved Mysteries number, 1-800-876-53-- - Oh God. - I never, I have no use for knowing that phone number, but just the way that he said it will always stand. - That voice is so creepy and got that and the music and the-- - I've always asked, has there ever been a rap group that sampled the Unsolved Mysteries-- - Oh, I have been, I wish. - 'Cause there has to be. - I know, yeah. - That would be the best song I ever made. - It is, boys. - Yeah. - I'd listen to it. So that's what you want, I would've avoided it just because it kind of terrified me. - Yeah. - I would've gone either with the show Sister Kate, which was a sitcom about Stephanie Beacham as a nun with a house full of orphans, including a very young pre-90210, Jason Priestley. - Jason Priestley. - That was a fun show that I watched all the time. Or a terrible show that was on ABC. They were drunk with power in TGIF and started trying to do Sunday night shows. And this was called Free Spirit. And it was the first show Alice and Hannigan was ever on. And she was the daughter of a single dad who hires a nanny who is a witch. And that was the show. And this one, the kids try to turn to Thomas' search for a date to a wedding into a Cinderella story by fixing him up with Winnie, who's the witch. But Thomas turns the plot into a botched version of My Fair Lady. 'Cause what kid doesn't like a My Fair Lady or friends? That's really gonna sell it for children. 830, what'd you go with? My Two Dads. - I really liked My Two Dads. - I liked My Two Dads, and think about it now, it's like an unconventional arrangement. Like at the time, it was a bit cutting edge. Also, Paul Reiser, like, pre-Man About You. - Yes, and I always went to Paul Reiser. - Yeah, and I, weirdly, so I knew Paul Reiser from Diner and Aliens before My Two Dads, which made me very scared for the life of Stacey Keenan. I was like, "He's gonna turn you in, man, he's no good." - Pre-step-by-step, pre-step-by-step kids. - I forget, she had a career before step-by-step. - She did, she did. - I remember when she did step-by-step thinking that they're underusing her, because-- - Oh, yeah, I was always like-- - She was huge on that, that was about her. - She was the main star of that show. - And then she was in this weird ensemble where she didn't really get, that she was just kind of smart out. - You don't wanna take a backseat to Patrick Duffy. - Right, well-- - At a certain point, it wasn't even Patrick. It was everybody watch a show for-- - Sasha Mitchell. - Yeah. - The worst. - What was his character as a Cody? - Cody. - Yeah, it was just like-- - Cody Lambert. - And then where do you go? - He was a martial artist. He was in Kickbox of three and four-- - Yeah, that's where we left the show for that. - He left the show for that, and then he went to jail for beating his girlfriend. - Ahhh. - Yeah. - He was, 'cause it became his show. He was basically-- - Oh, absolutely. - He was their Erkel. - Yeah, yeah. - And yeah, he's basically, he can't arrange. - Pretty much, yeah. Far past the sell-by date of Canada. - Yeah, right, right, right. - It was like four years past that being, I would have really liked to have seen a show with him and Erkel like as detectives or like in a van traveling cross-country. - Remember what Erkel was on step-by-step? - Yes, they did a lot of cross-by-step. - Did they interact with Cody and him interacting? - Didn't they, 'cause they had like, they both built machines that were like time, this was when it got really crazy and they were doing the Stefan Erkel and they somehow were cloning things. There was something along those lines. I think if you're running a show like step-by-step and you get to the point where eight-year-olds are going, I don't believe that. (laughing) You need to just hang it up. - Yeah. - And they definitely got to that point. - And my two dads also, I always had a theory, even as a kid, that someone wanted to make a show about two gay guys. - Right, right, right. - And there's no way you could have done that. But they were like, no, they both knocked up this woman who was of loose moral character. And they're like, we're fine with that. - Yeah, well, it's also like, what was the agreement in a baby? - So maybe would that have been the precedent for this? - No, my two dads proceeded three men in a baby. - Oh, it did? - It did, so three men in a baby, interesting thing about Full House, if we can get to on the TJF lineup, but originally the pitch for that show was three stand-up comedians live together. And it was created by Jeff Franklin, who wrote the movie Summer School, and he was a former stand-up. And the network, speaking of matching things together, said, hey, three men in a baby is very popular. If you can somehow make your three comedians living together into three men in a baby, we'll green light your show. So that's where you have the whole premise of three guys raising the steps. - It's all from there, really. - Yeah, I did. - Three men in a baby is really, I don't feel like anyone ever rewatches that movie. Everyone loved it, it was huge. - It was huge, they made a sequel. - Yes. - It was a three men in a league. - But it was a remake of a French movie, three men in a way. (laughing) - It was, yeah, it was like a French one. - Have you seen the French one? - I have seen the French one. - How was it? - It's severely lacking in Steve Gutenberg. (laughing) Most French movies are. - Right, right. - Was it good? - It was pretty good. I think I liked the US one better. - Yeah. - But it was, you know, it was pretty good. And there was a sequel, I believe, for a minute, a little lady in France as well. - But three men in a baby is a very 80s movie. - Oh, absolutely. - It's like Steve Gutenberg, Ted Danson, and Tom Selleck. - Yes, yes. - Yeah, I mean, Tom, Ted Danson kind of goes to be. - He's very 80s for you, but he's had a great career. - Yeah, but never had a movie career. - No. - And neither really did Tom Selleck. - It's-- - Mr. Baseball. - Mr. Baseball, Runaway with Gene Simmons. - So. (laughing) - But-- - Steve Gutenberg would have been a big movie star. - Steve Gutenberg's the big movie star in that lineup. He was hot off a cocoon in short circuit. - I love Ted Danson. I mean, you know, I loved Becker. - Becker was great. - It was an incredibly good show, and I never understood what more people didn't watch. I loved Becker. - What was the show he was on, Ink? It was another show he was on-- - Oh, he was his wife. - Yeah. - He had a married steam burden, yeah. - And Becker is, he wasn't exactly a date rapist, but he was a completely unlikable miserable career. He was not a good person. - That's okay. That's okay, because he had a heart at some, I mean, he's kind of the precursor to house. - Yes, yes. - Right, there's a bunkery quality to him. And he had a continent, a moral continent, always one out despite how-- - He had a code of ethics. - He did, yes. He was a very debny Coleman-esque character. - There was a 9/11 episode, I remember, where he had to go somewhere to meet somebody, and there's an older lady who, you don't know it's not a 11 episode anymore, though, so-- - They don't warn you, okay? - It's basically she doesn't know how to use the subways, and she doesn't have trouble getting around, and basically, he's helping her to get to downtown, you know, Manhattan, and Wall Street, and he doesn't, you know, he doesn't know why, and finally, he like walks her all the way to where this bench he has to get to, and he's about to leave, and he's clearly annoyed with her, and she, and it, she like, then hints at like, she has-- - Is her died now? - Yeah, like her son died, and the tower's done, and then all of a sudden, he just puts his arm around it, and it's just like, that's a great job. - You want a great, yeah. - It's funny the whole way-- - Call the rug out from under here. - Right, and it's like, it was such a good show. - But it doesn't seem exploitive to have that. 'Cause I think a lot of shows-- - Wasn't the point of the show. - Yeah, a lot of shows, if they did that, they'd be like, here's how great we are, here's our 9/11 show, I wonder if there were any other sitcoms at that time that were tackling that, 'cause I kind of checked out of regular sitcom watching around in 2000, I was actually living in England. - I can't look at the Pedia, actually, I don't, I can't think of another sitcom that did it. - Because if you're writing a show set in New York, like you feel like you would have to address-- - How did they address 9/11, yeah. - That's interesting, I'm gonna have to check that one, I have not seen that episode. 9 o'clock would you go with the marriage show? - The marriage show. - So we had that discussion, 9/30 would you go with? - Open house, but I don't remember why, can you read the description? - Yes, so, oh, I do wanna mention this marriage show, they're an episode though. excruciating pain forces Al to see Marcy's dentist, who's played by Joe Flaherty, who's one of my absolute favorite people in art from SC-TV. I used to down on-- - Oh, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. - So funny, a man dedicated to his profession, almost as much as he is to this week's dental assistant, Tracey Lords, so this was the second, or actually third main stream role for Tracey Lords after her teenage porn career, the first being a remake of Roger Korman's Not Of This Earth in 1988. - What's your marriage show? - Shoes and marriage children multiple times. Marriage children actually used either current or former adult actresses many, many times on that show, it was really, I think that probably added to the era of generous success. - That's what they're going for. - Yeah, Tracey Lords was on a few seconds, she was on a resume for a while as well. - I do remember that, yes. - She was on a lot of stuff. So big, big night of stars on that one. So open house, and this one, Linda and Ted get to know each other a little better when a bear traps them in the isolated home of a prospective client. So this was a show about real estate agents. Ellen DeGeneres was on it. - That's why I picked it. - Okay. - Because Ellen DeGeneres was, I didn't know Ellen DeGeneres was on that show, and I'm like, I would like to see a show. She was on quite a few sitcoms before they were, yes. And this one also starred Jack Lemmon's son, Chris Lemmon. - Oh. - Yeah. This had a spin-off show that turned into the show Duet, which two of the characters they sort of-- - The show was a hit? - It was sort of a hit. People liked these two characters who were dating each other. So in the next season, they sort of reformulated the show to be about those two characters. And it was, they changed the name to Duet, but it was the same people and sort of the same premise. - But it was a spin-off though? - I don't know if you'd call it a spin-off so much as like a reinvention of the show. That used to happen so, every so often, when they didn't use to cancel shows outright, like they do now after four episodes, it doesn't work. They would retool a show. So sometimes they'd rename it and they'd maybe recast some things. - It was something they would do at the pilot stage they would do after their-- - They would do midway through the season, which was very confusing 'cause you're like, is this the same show or is this a different show? - They did that with Ellen a little bit. - They did, 'cause these friends of mine-- - These friends of mine, and then it turned into Ellen. - And they got rid of the supporting characters. - Yeah, and had some new ones in there. So that, I think you would never see that happen now. - Right. - Ever. I was like Ellen DeGeneres' brother Vance DeGeneres. - Yes. - Yes, he was in a band with Kathy Valentine from the Go-Go's. - Oh, I did not know. - Before he started doing the Daily Show. - The very talented-- - The talented fan? - Monday night, eight o'clock, which one? - Oh, before Monday, eight, eight. I wanted to add Sunday at 10. - Okay, so you went with Tracy, I'm gonna guess. - Tracy, I'm gonna guess. 'Cause that really open house was an excuse to get to Tracy, I'll admit at that point. - Did you watch this every week, Tracy? - I love Tracy, I'm gonna say it was late, but I loved Tracy. - Did you have to sneak to watch it? Did your parents have a cut off time that you weren't allowed to watch? - I think I probably said, I can't remember. I don't know why it wasn't told to go to bed 'cause I didn't go to school on Monday. - Yeah, it's a Sunday night. - Tracy, I'm gonna move up to an earlier slot. - Lifetime network used to air Tracy, I'm gonna reruns at like five or six o'clock in the early 90s. - I definitely saw the reruns obsessively. I remember the reruns, but I'm sure I saw it Sunday late at some point. - I definitely, maybe it was like a Monday off from school Monday, holiday kind of thing. - Maybe. - Which maybe we'd have seen more of a treat. - 'Cause I remember watching the show and just being like just taken by like how different it was. And it was so smart, the Simpsons, like the short, you know, the real thing. - Oh yeah. - And I just, I remember there was that two gay dads, 'cause even we were talking about how my two dads, they wouldn't have let them be gay characters. - You could do it with a sketch. - Right. And it was a brilliant sketch. - And they weren't really cartoonish. - No, that's the thing that always shocked me about it. 'Cause even back then I'm like, huh, they're just a family. - Yeah. - And it's just a family. And it's really about the dynamic of this young woman's Francesca, right? - Right. - Being just kind of a teenage girl with braces and being weird. And the fact-- - She just has two dads. It's just a-- - And it was fairly addressed. - Yeah. - And they were just real people. - The great thing about Tracy Elman's show, and I feel like I can't think of many sketch shows that were like this before or after, is that it was really a character show. - Yeah. - So I think a lot of, and I love sketch shows and it even shows I like, I think things are given credit as being a character when really it's a joke. It's not a character, they're just a human joke. And with Tracy Elman, it wasn't like that. Like they were pretty well-rounded characters, and they weren't so much sketches as almost like, you know, three-minute sitcoms. - Right. - And when it would recur as the character, instead of the usual thing, you would see where it's just like, we're just redoing the same sketch. - Right, right. - It's a different setting. It was just like a continuation of these people's stories, which was unusual then, and I think really unusual now. And so in this episode, you have Isabella Rossellini has a dual role in a story about how a young woman's denial of her own passion changed the course of history. Also, a thrill seeker needs to experience again the thrill of thrilling a new thrill seeker. - That's actually what it says in there. - Isabella Rossellini doing a guest role on the Tracy Elman show at the height of Isabella Rossellini's fame? - The theme is one of like, it's funny, I don't think we talk about her enough now. - She's sort of a character to be like almost like Bonnie Hunt where when people mention women in comedy, those two almost never come up. - That's what, well, Bonnie Hunt, I can oh, - She's a little more obscure. - Yeah, which is strange, but she's always been around. Like, I know the name, you know, but Tracy Elman, when she had that show on HBO, Tracy takes on. Like, she was talked about all the time, and then all of a sudden she doesn't have a show, and it's like, that's it? We're not gonna talk about anything. - I feel like for most people, I feel like youth never got into Tracy Elman. She always seemed like someone that adults were into. Like, even when I was a kid, it would be like, like a critic would like her. Even though I felt like her stuff was way more cutting edge and kind of almost like kind of punkish and flipping. - She should get more love and attention. - I think the Elman is a legend. She's an absolute legend. It's funny where we talk about the great all-time comedians and stuff. - Tracy Elman, I'm really good at this. - I'd take her over Carol Burnett. - It's really. - Absolutely. - Wow. - Yeah. Tracy Elman's more interesting to me than Carol Burnett. - I mean, I mean, the social stuff. Like that's just the idea of the two gay dads thing is to me. - Oh yeah. - That was, you know, 1989. - She started in '87 and this was '89, yeah. - Okay, so that's groundbreaking. - Absolutely. - Yeah. - And it wasn't really not controversial at all because Fox was kind of under the radar at that time. - You know, there's an interesting, there's a college student writing a paper about Fox. I'm sure. - There should be. - There should be. 'Cause that's actually just the history of Fox as a, 'cause television is still relevant. Fox is kind of like a cult channel, even though it's still bigger, the numbers-- - It's establishment now. - Well, even then though, the numbers that they were drawing, even they were considered kind of like the fourth station or whatever, the numbers they're drawing are still bigger than most shows now. - Oh yeah, I mean, there was less on now and a show that would have got canceled in 1989 would be the number one show now. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Starting on the ratings. - Yeah. - It's so narrow-casted and specific and everything's so niche now. - Yes. - Everything's extreme now. I think that this is my old man talk about it. Everything's either so niche that it only appeals to the tiniest amount of people or has to be so broad, you know what's common to the number. There's almost none of that middle ground sort of stuff that we kind of had at the time. - You know, it's funny 'cause it actually cut, it does cut both ways. In one way you have more people with different points if you're potentially being represented with their niche, right, and that's great, but at the same time, I was thinking about like, in the BBC context, they had to show a goodness gracious to me, which I loved, South Asian sketch comedy show in the UK, and it was like a mainstream show, but this is before everything got privatized. There's a lot of channels. So you would have people watching the show that wouldn't normally watch the show if they had other option, but how many things were on? - Yeah. - So they would watch it and they'd be exposed to new ideas. - And they'd love it. - Yeah, and if they had the choice between that and four-year-old shows, they might not have seen it. - Right, which is why when people always complain about how they want a la carte cable. - Yeah. - As much as I don't want 400 golf stations or whatever and would be happy not to pay for them, it sort of subsidizes the smaller channels with stuff that I might stumble upon that I've never seen and that wouldn't even get made. And I just like, even if that never happens, I like that it could happen. And that's important to me that this stuff gets made so that somebody sees it. I mean, when I was growing up, there were shows that I watched that. I was just like, wow, this is just for me, that I can't believe this exists and it sort of gave me faith in humanity that someone made this. - Yeah. - And I would hate to see a world where that doesn't exist. - That's awesome, right? So we're on Sunday night, you went for it without a 10 o'clock, Monday night at 8 o'clock, what'd you go with? - That was a really hard choice. - It was a tough night. - It was either MacGyver or Elf. I went with MacGyver and it was really, I don't know why, I just, it was really hard. I just couldn't figure it out. Like, but I just remember loving MacGyver. I mean, you really only need the last half hour technically. - The setup is, you can catch up right away. - It's like, okay, now we'll get to the scene where you have a piece of string and a hanger and a little bit of bleach. - What a weird shit, like they never, you never found out if his first name was MacGyver or his last name was MacGyver. - Oh man. - Never found out. He worked for that really weird organization that they never really told you what they were or what they did. In this particular episode, MacGyver teams with a bounty hunter played by Cleveland Little from a place like Sennel. - Oh my God. - To track down a Bulgarian scientist on the run from techno bandits, techno bandits who are seeking the location of an ancient gym. - Wow. - That's pretty complex. - It's all stuck. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - That sounds like a pretty good video game plot. - It's a complicated one. - And then it's like a piece of string and a hammer and a hammer and a pen. - Ballpoint pen. - Yeah. - I remember one of my favorite episodes of MacGyver is when he's trapped in a mine and because he's trying to save some Amish people from evil corporations, it was very, you wouldn't get a plot like that. - I know. - I remember everybody wanted to be like, in school everyone tried to be MacGyver and we'd create little contraptions and pretend we'd play games of MacGyver. - But would you just make weapons of destruction and claim that it was in, 'cause we'd just see that in my school. One kid came, I don't know where this kid came up with this but he claimed it was MacGyver. He would soak toothpicks in salsa and then shoot them through straws. - Oh my God. - It took people's ears. - Is that episode of MacGyver? - I don't remember that episode but this kid claimed that's where he saw it. That was he would blame MacGyver. - I can't imagine, I feel like especially, like MacGyver is pre-internet. - Yes, absolutely. - So like back now you just like, let me Google some crazy shit. - I remember kids used to buy the Anarchist cookbook to write it up and they used to sell it, there was a record store chain in the Boston air call, no wait, no I mean not knowing the comic, Newbury Comics and they used to sell it behind the counter. - Which is amazing. - Yeah and it was like, now you could find that information on your phone. - The person who created the Anarchist cookbook now feels, has a great deal of regret, they could not realizing this is what would happen in it. - But what do you think would happen? - I can't say that. - I made this anarchist cookbook for good. - He's right, right. - I wanted a whole world of MacGyver's. - Right. - A race of MacGyver's to make the world a better place. So Alph that night was Alph tries to protect Willy from the long armor of the law, when his picture is flashed on a TV crime stoppers show, but Trevor is one who reaches out to grab the reward in the FBI. So weirdly, just like we were talking about with America's Most Wanted, that actual plot was happening in Alph this night. - And guest appearance by David Allen Greer as an FBI agent. - Or DAG. - DAG, good old DAG, good friend of Bonnie Hunt and is in many of her shows, yeah, yeah, hang on. So 8/30 you're not watching anything 'cause you're watching MacGyver, nine o'clock murder. - Murphy Brown, no question. - Did you watch that every week? - I was in my mom's of Murphy Brown, so I'd always watch with my mom. - Was that your mom's favorite sitcom? - That, I feel like for a time it was, yeah, absolutely, in Monday at nine o'clock, she's like always watching Murphy Brown. - Did you feel like it was too old for you? Like, did you feel like you were missing things 'cause it's a show for the middle-aged woman? - I definitely felt there were things I was missing, but I liked that Miles character. - Yes. - And I liked, what was the name of the character that was her house painter? - Oh, that was the father of her child. - Yeah. - Elvin? - Elvin, yes. - He died after that actor, OD'd. - And heroin. - During the show? - No, after Murphy Brown. - Yeah, yeah. - I mean, I just, I remember the characters were-- - Elvin. - Elvin, right. - Robert Pesterrelli, that was nice. - They were just fantastic ensemble and she was Ken's driven so good. - She's great. - And that show is like, I mean, obviously it was a culturally important show, it was Dan Quayle also. - He made it a culturally important show. Did you ever see the movie starting over with Candace Bergen and Bert Reynolds? - No. - It's a very good movie. It's 1980 and she plays his ex-wife and it's basically a, it's shot in Boston actually. I'm probably about divorced and she's so funny in it. She plays this sort of blue blood woman who wants to be a disco singer. She's very, very funny. - And she was always great when she hosted "Saturday Night Live." - I think people forget that Candace Bergen was in just generations that she's a very important figure on television. - Oh, absolutely. - Like, like a brilliant, and she won every year. - Yeah, she should. And she was also, she was on "You Bet Your Life" with Groucho Marx when she was a teenager. Yeah, her father was a famous, was it Charlie Bergen? He was somebody either Vaudeville or an old TV performer. My memory's failing me. I probably would have watched a "Made for TV" movie that was on at nine o'clock this night only because it started Nancy McKeon. And I was such a huge, facile-- - Oh, a facile, yes. - This was, after "Faxile Life," this was ripped from the headlines. It was a movie called "A Cry for Help" that Tracy Thurman's story starring Nancy McKeeman based on the true story of a woman who took her fight to court and won. He gave her his hand in marriage, which doesn't seem to make a lot of sense unless you look at the picture and she has a black eye. They've made that joke. He gave her his hand in marriage about spousal abuse. - Oh, go with it. - Who wrote that copy? - It's like it's worth it. It's worth it. - Yeah, it's absolutely worth it. - I can't believe that they got away with that sort of thing 'cause it's not a joke. It's a serious movie. - That's how it's really fucked up. Television's fucked up, but back then, especially. It's a date rape, this doesn't mean it's not a polymer. - You would never have this stuff in comedies, but I probably would have watched it 'cause I like Nancy McKeon and then just felt really bad about what was it? - What was her character's name and effect? - Joe, pull the check. - That's another character that comes in the tough girl. - Tough Brooklyn Broad, yeah, on a scholarship. - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - So where are we? That takes us to 10 o'clock, so we're on to Tuesday night. - Oh, 930? - 930, I didn't like any of the options, so I'm like wrestling. - So you went to-- - And it was WWF at the time. - Right, not WWE, not the world wildlife. - Before it was Raw as War. - Right, this is USA Monday night wrestling before it became Raw. This was, I think, still Bruce the Barber Beefcake era. - Right, right. - Which funny story-- - Hulk Hogan. - Hulk Hogan, Brutus Barber Beefcake is from Boston, and he got his face cut up in a boating accident and quit wrestling. He was a token seller at the T, at Downtown Crossing in Boston, and after 9/11, they had an anthrax scare at the Downtown Crossing T station 'cause they found some white powder. That white powder, Brutus the Barber Beefcake's cocaine, and he had to go to rehab, and he got his job back, but he was the-- - That's a bad story. - I bought tokens from him. - Did you know who he was? - Oh, yeah, and he was like a superhero in 1989. I mean, this was-- - Yeah. - And you buying T tokens from was very weird. - No one said anything. - I assume people said anything, but people probably just like, "Baba!" You know what I mean? - Yeah. - Beefcake. - You passed up a show that you had never heard of before, but it's actually one of my favorite shows, The Famous Teddy Z. - Right. - And this was a completely underrated show. It's our John Cryer, and this was convinced that Teddy is doing something illegal. Deena visits his office where once she understands the game, she has ideas for making Teddy a bigger player. So he was someone who fell into the game of being a Hollywood agent, basically. And Alex Rocco starred in the show, which most people know as Mo Green from The Godfather, and so this was basically a show about old men who are Hollywood agents, but they kind of disguised it as a show about John Cryer, and as the show went on, he became less and less of a character, and it just became about these 60-year-old men who are Hollywood agents, which was a major network sitcom that would never ever happen now. And this show has probably my favorite realistic portrayal of how a good idea can be ruined by Hollywood. And so, and it seems logical as the show goes on. So this couple is making a documentary about the plight of education workers in South America, and the network buys this show. And by the end of the show, it becomes a show about a girl on a tube top with a magic porpoise. - Oh my God. - But it makes sense how they get there, and you're like, this is probably exactly how these things happen, and it's brilliant. I feel like anyone who ever wants to work in entertainment or is creative or writes something should watch this episode as like a cautionary tale. And it's really funny, but at the same time, you're like, oh, this is really sad. - How many years did it go? - It only went half a season. - They did all that in half a season. - Yes, yeah, and it was a really smart show, and it did very well with the critics, but people felt it was too inside. And it was sort of a non-aspirational view of Hollywood, and I think people didn't like that. I think it was like, oh, they're just working jobs like we are, I don't wanna watch that. - Now that would be that. - Now they would love it. Yeah, the show came out now, it would be a huge hit. So we'd move on to Tuesday night, eight o'clock, what'd you go with? - Who's the boss? No question. - A show I watched every week, but honestly, I wasn't that into. I don't know why I watched that. Honestly, I actually, like, I never loved it, but it was there, and it was consistent. - It was just there, and you were kinda like-- - Never laughed that much. - Maybe this week it won't be bad. - Right, right, right. - It never got that level. I also told you-- - You're into the-- - He's so off-putting. - Oh, no. - Yeah, he's just like, I mean, something about him. - Yeah, honestly, I mean, I've had times where I watch that show fairly consistently, but like, I never loved it, it was just there. - And Judith, what a wet blanket. - Yeah. - That lady, just a buzzkill. - Actually, who is, I guess, Tony was kind of, you know, was kind of the-- - I just wanted that show to be about Mona, which is a weird thing, you know, I'm eight years old, and I'm like, I'd like to see a show about our red-headed 65-year-old woman in some of the characters. My favorite was when he would try to coach the son about dating girls, and everybody knew that that didn't make sense. - Right, right, right. - Everybody. - When do you come out? - Not that much longer after who's the boss, like a year after Soak got canceled. I mean, officially, but, come on. There would be episodes where he's like, all right, I'm gonna get a prom date, and I was like-- - Even when? - Everybody knows. So this particular episode, after meeting some of Tony's married friends from the old neighborhood, Angela dreams of life with Tony, barefoot, and pregnant, in Brooklyn. So this is a fantasy episode. - Wait, so did they, at that point, were they together? - No. - They got together in the last season of 1982, which is kind of the, which was the final nail on the coffin for that show. Nobody wanted to see that. That might have been the least appealing, will they, won't they, I think, in television? (laughing) - I think I might see it definitively. 8/30 would you go with? - Wonder Years, that was an easy one. I love that show. - Absolutely great show. - Careful show. - Wonder Years held up the whole time it ran, coming on a new show. - Unless you and your kid, and you're watching another kid in his adventures, it was like-- - Yeah, and it was, it managed to be nostalgic and bittersweet without feeling sort of heavy, you know? - No, it was funny, and it was, the acting was great, and the stories, and it was also history. - Oh yeah, and it didn't look like, it was a single camera, a sitcom, which was sort of unusual at the time, it looked like a movie. I remember when I first started, I was like, this is like, stand by me, which I loved, and my dad used to watch it and just cry. 'Cause it was exactly the age he was, so Kevin was his age at that time. The weird thing is, if Wonder Years-- - He loved that show. - He loved the show. But he would always pretend he didn't. Are you already watching this show again? (laughing) Oh no, I'm doing something else in the room. If that show was on now, so the equivalent of 1989, Wonder Years, was on now, it would be set in 1989. - Oh man, we got it. - No, I'm sorry, 1994, is that true? 20 years, so '89, it was set in '69. - Oh my. - And it went 'til '92 and ended in '72. - Oh my god. - Can you imagine watching this show? - It'd be much less interesting. - About growing up in 1994, and having that be interesting at all? - Nothing, and nothing happens 'til like 2001, really, like it's just like-- - It would be people sitting and watching the Wonder Years. - Yeah, and being like-- - Hey, do you know this Geo City's web page? - Oh yeah, it's great. The Angel Fire's better. - Kevin, get off the phone. - I got this TurboGrafx-69 on the flea market. Are we just jaded because we're the wrong age, or was the world much more exciting in 1969 than it was in 1994? I feel like there wasn't anything going on. - There were books about 1969, there were no books about '94, and I mean, there'll be like what the internet's starting. - Maybe, yeah. - But like, you know, there's like the '60s and-- - There wasn't a great time of social change that I took me for. - And there was, but not in the way the '60s were, you know what I mean? Of course, things are changing because of the engine. Things are changing, be it the tech boom. - Right. - You know, is it ever of prosperity, apparently? - Prodigy. - Right, both the band and the system. - Yeah. - You know what I wonder too, is that nostalgia, this will get a little academic for a moment, so all the people want to tune out. But nostalgia really wasn't invented until the '70s. It is when, and the nostalgia went in 20-year waves. - Right. - And so the '70s had '50s nostalgia, the '80s and '60s nostalgia, the '90s was sort of mostly about '70s nostalgia. - Yes. - And so it's sort of hard-- - And there's commercials and there's commercials that would have different clips of different songs from the '70s where you don't-- - Yeah, absolutely. - I don't even know the songs, but I know what songs segue into the next-- - Into the next one on the commercials. And so I think it's hard to have a nostalgic view of a time that was already filled with a nostalgic view. So it's not like the '60s people were in a nostalgic for the '40s. - Right. - That would be ridiculous. - Everyone times were hard. - Remember when we had a war and it was no one had any money? - Right. - So I wonder if that's part of the reason why you're sort of getting a copy of a copy. - Yeah, yeah. - I think you're going to '94. Like, wasn't the Brady Bunch movie great? Which actually was pretty great. - The one to use, did everyone attend awards? - No. - Why? - I don't know. - It was, again, it was critically acclaimed show. It didn't do very well on the ratings for the first two years. - Really? - It absolutely would have been canceled today. But it hung on, they moved the time slot around a few times, and then it sort of became a hit, maybe the third season. - That's one of my favorite all-time shows. - It's great. And it's finally coming on DVD in the fall. - It is. - How come in hadn't been-- - Music rights issues. So time life finally sort of managed to wrap all that sort of stuff up in a complete series is coming on in the fall. - With the music and the original music, yes. - Another show that I really loved that I felt like never got enough for, so it was Quantum Leap. - Yeah, Quantum Leap was a great show. - Love Quantum Leap. - Again, it's very nostalgic for all the 20th century. I love Quantum Leap until it got overtly jesus-y in the last two seasons. - I don't remember that. - So the switch happened on a Halloween episode, which was, I think in season four, where Sam jumps into a Stephen King type writer's body, and actual Satan tries to, and it's like, I'm the one who tries to thwart you all because it was-- - How does that fit into the science fiction aspect? - It didn't, so that's kind of what ruined it, because it was sort of like God's pulling the strings here. He's the one who's sending Sam to these times to do these things. - Oh, everything. - Yeah, because before where it was just sort of like, is fate a thing, is this just flu? - Is he ever gonna get home? - Yeah, almost like Dr. Who is now, where if they all of a sudden were like, oh yeah, Dr. Who, he's an emissary for God. You'd be like, I don't know, yeah. So that's where I sort of checked out a little bit. - You never get home. - You never get home, and that's a great last episode. - I liked when he jumped into his own body. That was a good one. - I remember this at all. - And when he jumped into, who is this buddy's, the computer guy? - Oh, Al. - Al? - Al, he jumped into Al's body at one point, when Al was like a teenager. That was a pretty good one. So we're at nine o'clock, which is-- - Roseanne. - Roseanne, no question, Roseanne. Great show, always a great show. - Yeah. - One of the great last episodes. - Yes, which was amazing, 'cause they pulled out of a nose dive, 'cause that last season was garbage. - Yeah. - And do you think it was a way to justify the last season, or was it the plan? - I don't think it was the plan, because then this may be apocryphal, but this is what I heard as to why the last season was as it was. So Roseanne had bought the US remake rights for absolutely fabulous. She had made a pilot and didn't get picked up. So she said, I'm gonna make Roseanne into absolutely fabulous. So that's why she did that we won all this money. We're sort of low class people who now have money. How would we act? People hated it. One of the reasons John Goodman left the show. And so I feel like she realized it wasn't working and then pulled out of the nose dive with that brilliant final ending. - Oh, it justifies how terrible it is. - Oh, amazing. I mean, it made the whole thing worth it. It was easily in the top five final episodes. - He took fantasy. - Yeah, absolutely. - He said he died and she couldn't deal with it. - Yeah, which is like the whole show. And even the other stuff, that's what the piece everyone remembers, but the other stuff she says were like-- - It was a different boyfriend. - The boyfriends were different. - It's what she wished they were. - Yeah, everything was different. And when you go back and look at that show, it's almost like the way people look at the sixth sense. They do kind of lay hints about how she's a writer and Dan builds her a writing room and all this stuff. It was so consistent. The characters on that show were so consistent. That was one of the things. And the writing staff on that show, Judd Apatow. - I did not know that, really? - Yeah. It was all the people that formed the foundations for the last decade of TV here. All were writers for Roseanne. - Wow. - It was a great show. Definitely would have watched that 'cause really your only other choice was a show called The Wolf. - That wasn't gonna happen. - Yeah, not a good show. So Wednesday night, eight o'clock. - Oh, 930. - Oh, 930, I'm sorry. - Didn't like anything went with baseball playoffs. Even though in 1989, I was not a baseball fan. I would have watched baseball playoffs. - So you passed up Chicken Soup, which was Jackie Mason's terrible sitcom. - Hey Jackie Mason's? - Yeah, not a good show. I would have gone with Car54 or Ure runs on Nick at night. One, probably my favorite sitcom of all time. Wednesday night, eight o'clock. - Growing pains. - I love growing pains. - That was a shame though. He's ruined the legacy, but. - He has. He has. He's a classic. I was a co-kid and now I'm Jesus freakin' up. - Bigger than that. He's his own. He's a huge industry. - Yeah, he really is. He's the post-war for this. But this was in the height of growing pains. Season three and four are my two favorite seasons. - Pre-de-caprio. - Pre-de-caprio. - Right. Growing pains was the first show where I realized people wrote sitcoms. 'Cause I started to notice, I always liked the show but there were certain episodes I liked better than others. And I noticed that they were all written by the same. - You actually noticed that back then? - I noticed that back then. Tim O'Donnell is my favorite writer on growing pains. And so I would see his name come on and be like, "It's gonna be a good one." And I was really aware. This one is a crushed one to her enrollment at Columbia University's Delayed Until Spring. Carol considers Plan B, spending the semester at a junior college, but then resorts to Plan C, getting a job in the real world. This is a Carol-centric episode. If you didn't get many of us, - Right, right. That's why I was thinking I don't remember any Carol. - Yeah, yeah. Although I liked the Carol episode, I liked any episode that didn't focus on Mike. - Right, right. - Just 'cause I thought he was an easy character to write for and it was always more interesting to get like a good Ben episode or a Carol episode. - One of the greatest cameos that, I don't know how many cameos have been made, but it was in Jeremy Miller? - Yes, Jeremy. - Jeremy Miller was on episode of Ghost Rider. - Really? - Oh yes, he was the original Ghost Rider, yes. - I loved Ghost Rider. - I remember being super excited leading up to Ghost Rider 'cause PBS really promoted that thing. And Max Wright from Elf was on it, which I was very excited about. - Who was? - Willie from Elf. He owned that the store where they first found Ghost Rider. Yeah. - 'Cause I used to watch that show every single week with my brother. I mean, I didn't like when they switched Gavys. - Yeah. - It was confusing. - Yeah, that was like our generation's Darren's. - Right, right, right. - That show, man, how long did a Ghost Rider reunion? - I'd like to see, I'm surprised the internet hasn't done this, but like a mashup of Ghost Rider with the movie Ghost Rider. Just have a Ghost Rider play. - Ghost Rider that big though, the PBS series? - I, it was in my world, but I don't know. You're the only other person that's ever brought it up. I remember it was on, and the PBS affiliate in Boston was on it 6.30 on Sunday nights, and then I had to watch Erie, Indiana after. So I always link those two shows for some weird reason. - I never saw Erie, Indiana. - Oh, Erie, Indiana was great. It was produced by Joe Dante. It was a very, it really went well with Ghost Rider. - Joe Dante from Agoonies, right? - Joe Dante from Gremlins. - Gremlins. - Yes. But Ghost Rider, did they ever, did they ever conclude who Ghost Rider was the ghost of, or where Ghost Rider came from? - I can't remember, I know it ended abruptly because they didn't, it was PBS around the funding. - Ah, there we go. - Yeah. Did you ever see a PBS series called "Read All About It"? - That doesn't sound good. - It was in the mid-80s, it was about some kids who lived in an abandoned newspaper printing factory and fought some evil demons from another dimension with literacy. - No. - Terrifying. - It sounds like it would have been the first attempt at Ghost Rider and failed. - Yeah, it seemed like it was a very similar, Ghost Rider was a lot less terrifying. - Like a ghost that makes the kids read to find clues. - But just that stuff is, do you have all the letters in the world, Ghost Riders? - Yeah, what? - Yeah. - That sounds like something your parents would tell you to get you to do your homework. - Right. - There's a ghost, and if you don't read, he's gonna, and he was that really unconvincing pink blob. - Yeah, and we all, I loved it, oh my God. So there was an episode with a homeless Vietnam war that he doubled tea, everyone was thinking, this is a lot for a kid. - And he wasn't an amputee. - No, he wasn't, he wasn't. - That would be a very cruel video. - Yeah, his show was so, I would love to, that's on our DVD. - Not that I know of, but I think there's some episodes on YouTube. I'll see if I can hunt down some ghost riders. - I would, I would certainly watch that again. - We'll do a Ghost Rider marathon. Wednesday night, eight o'clock, would you, when we were growing pains, eight thirty would you go? - Head of the class. - I loved head of the class. Head of the class made me wanna be smart. - Yeah. (laughing) - And I always, I wasn't a very popular kid, and I felt very lonely and miserable, but head of the class, I was like, when I get to high school man, everything's gonna be okay. - What was the teacher's name? - Mr. Moore. - Mr. Moore, I remember finding out Mr. Moore was on WKRP, but that one has for my time period, so I was like, but that's Mr. Moore. - We'll see you DJ, did you get confused when the same actress played different characters that they weren't the same person? - Yeah, sometimes. - I'd be annoyed by it. - I wonder if anyone's written like a character, like a biography of a character to be like, first he was a DJ at the time. - Right. - He became a teacher. - And then he murdered someone and changed his name, became a teacher. - Yes, so that's, yeah. - And this one, Simone and Eric, probably my least two favorite characters, Simone was the Toriyimos-esque, red-headed, sensitive soul that Eric, the-- - He was a greaser? - The greaser, had eyes for her. Have eyes for each other, but neither sees eyes to eye, eye to eye with friends who advise, their honesty is the best policy. This, a Simone and Eric episode was never my favorite. I always liked a good Dennis episode. - Dennis was the heavy set guy, the nerdy guy. - Yes, who now runs Nickelodeon. - Right, I remember he was on episodes of All That. - He created all that. - Oh, really? - And the guy who plays Eric, Brian Robbins, directed all that. - Oh my god, really? - Yeah, he created iCarly. Josh and Sam, Keenan and Kelz. - So they went from head of the class to Nickelodeon. - To just reinvent into the world. - Wow, Dan Schneider is like the king of tweens at this point, very rich men. - They arguably ruined Nickelodeon. - I believe they did ruin Nickelodeon. - Nickelodeon was before, when we were growing up, was a very kid-centric, kids can change the world. - Us first them, adults versus kids that band together, - Very super short show. - Yes. - Yeah, like Turkey TV, Pete and Pete. - My all-time favorite show. - What's being a bit of sweet. I mean, that show had just an amazing heart-breaking, great quality that was unparalleled. - Yes. - Pete and Pete's also-- - They don't make programs like that. - I don't think they could. - It's so much adventure in the idea of kids. And part of it is just kids being creative outside of the summer without video games. - Oh yeah, and when you're a kid, the thing that they gathered, I mean, everybody growing up, your world had a mythology. - Yeah. - And every town has that. - Yeah. - And it's this very layered mythology that's built up over generations and when you're kidding, everything's a huge deal. And that show really captured what it felt like to be a kid. I think the one New Year's did two degree as well in a more realistic way. But everything feels like a big deal. And I think when shows, occasionally I'll try to watch a teen show now to try and recapture the magic of my so-called life or Pete and Pete and Pete and Pete. And when they try to capture that everything's a big deal, it's more just like, get over it, you idiot kid. Like, everything's gonna be fine. But with Pete and Pete by making it sort of a surreal, not quite cartoonish thing, it manages to see more real. It sort of captures the actual feeling of what that was like then. That's my Pete and Pete rent. Actually, you'll see, I don't know if you saw it when you went upstairs, but I haven't already don't give up at all. I do, yeah. Original shirt from the show. I love, I love that. Great show. Great show. So, nine o'clock, what'd you go with? I don't, anything but love, which I don't remember seeing, but I remember it being there and it's Richard Lewis and Jamie Lee Curtis and I remember that being like a hit show. It was, they were very unconvincing couple. I can't even imagine the two of them speaking to each other. What are they coming from the beginning of the show? Was it like they? The show started as their sort of courtship. Right. Anything but love always struck me as like a dry run for Matt about you with less like a good cause. Yeah, that sounds good, yeah. There was another show that aired on Lifetime, incessantly, they've always shown super market sweep. Super market sweep, David Ruprik. Dad, there's no super market sweep. What an unfortunately name, man. I used to watch that, my grandma's a lover. She loved game shows and she's, you know, obviously, she's a, obviously, it's the podcast. But she's a, you know, she would stay with us for a few years and go back to India and like she loved game shows and we would watch super market sweep all the time. Did you watch the show was paired with Shop to the Adropper? I did, which I didn't like as much. No, but Mark Wahlberg, not from the Wahlberg of Mark. Right, right. Now when Antiques Roadshow got his heart, it started as the announcer. He shopped to the Adropper. Antiques Roadshow. Yeah, he's the host of Antiques Roadshow. Mark L. Wahlberg. Is he go by Mark L. Wahlberg? Yes, yes, he had the full name as Mark Wahlberg. Like if you just said Mark Wahlberg, people would be like, "He looks different, what's happened?" But I also love those shows on Lifetime. Shop to Drop and Super Market Suite. I was big on coming up with strategies for, you know, when I got on those shows. (laughing) Still hasn't happened. I love Super Market Suite 'cause it was very much like super toy runs. Right. And that has a star, so that has a prize. Yeah, I got a map. I know when I'm doing these kids don't plan, right? I probably would have watched a rerun of the Bob Newhart show at this time, right? It was not a huge show. I never saw a Bob Newhart. Did you watch regular Newhart? You neither. Newhart is one of the most underrated shows of the '80s. That's why I hear, and also I know that both those shows, not both of them, but what was the second one? There's Bob Newhart show, which worries the psychologist. That was the '70s, and Newhart was the '80s. Oh, and Newhart, I know there was stuff from the first show that they did like crossover. They did, speaking of great last episodes. Yeah, so the last episode of Newhart, he woke up in bed with his wife from the '70s show. And that he is the whole thing was a dream? Exactly. That's great. That show, we were gonna get a life. Oh, Chris Elliott shows. Yes, I love that. So the interesting thing about "Get a Life" is that David Merkin, who co-created that show, he was the show runner for the last couple of seasons of "Newhart," and most of the writing staff on "Newhart" moved with him to get a life. So weirdly, if you like "Get a Life," the last couple of seasons of "Newhart" are almost identical to "Get a Life." Surprisingly, it got really bizarre. There's an episode where "Newhart" and his buddies form a gang and fight another gang of old men that have like a matching jacket. Which is such a "Get a Life," it's a really fun show. Yeah, "The Life" is also just like Bob Elliott from "Bob and Ray" with his son Chris Elliott, it's amazing. Oh yeah, that show was fantastic. It's when Abby Elliott doesn't seem to be like stylistically like her father or her father. No, no, no, and they're really quirky. His other daughter does stand up as well. Really? Yeah, younger than Abby Elliott, in New York. So there's a New York, her name is-- It's like Zoe or something like this. I think you have to name it, she has a lot of-- Yeah, I saw "Stamiliate," yeah. I don't know that one. I've seen her once and she was very funny. I just, oh god, Chris Elliott, it's amazing. Oh, he's great. And the stuff he used to do on "Lederman"-- Oh yeah. He was doing Q&A last year. And he's also one of the most down-to-earth, normal people you would ever talk to in your life. And he was just talking about how weird it was, how big "Lederman" was when he was on it, which he was just on this week, and how he couldn't believe-- He's in the movie "Manhunter," the Michael Mann movie based on "Red Dragon." He plays an FBI. And people would just offer him these roles because he was the guy under the stairs on "Lederman." They were like, kids like this guy. And he was like, this is ridiculous. He played a Vietnam vet buddy of Crockett on Miami Vice. He was like 22 years old. And even then, he was like, this is completely ridiculous, but whatever. And I always like when people in those such situations are aware of it, which is always great. So Wednesday, where are we? 930? Yeah. What'd you go with? A "Duty Housing" MD. I didn't like it. You don't like "Duty Housing"? I don't like Neil Patrick Harris. I mean, I haven't really seen it. But I like "Duty Housing." I love Neil Patrick Harris of that era. So did you like "Duty?" Not that I don't dislike him now. I'm just like that era. They're like as a kid watching a kid genius. So you like the aspirational aspect of it? I love that novelty. The novelty of it, plus I like to him. And I like Max Cassella. Yes, from Lynn, Massachusetts. Is he? He was like, that dynamic was for me. The idea of like, oh, I have a best friend. And he's like an every man. Right. And you know, they're dynamics funny. It's not much reminding me of the dynamic of Tom Hanks's character and his buddy in "Big." I don't know why I was afraid of this. That's really interesting. Yeah, like an extraordinary circumstance with one friend and the other friend. Just the grounding force. Like just a little kid. Yeah. You're still a kid, even though you're an adult. You're an adult life. And it always seemed so much older than Doogie. She did. And I also-- Inciderably. Yeah, and I was always-- I think one of the things I hated was how much he fucked up with Monda. Yeah. I'd be like, what do you-- I was eight years old. I'm like, I even know that you did this wrong. What are you doing? What is wrong with you? But at the same time, it's like he's also a doctor. And being a doctor is hard. And how his friends are in high school and he's a doctor. You know what's weird about Doogie Houser is that it precedes ER Chicago scrubs and all these shows? And when you re-watch them, it's shockingly similar to a lot of those shows, which I never would have thought up until I've re-watched an episode. There's a lot more hospital drama than just about the kid. Is Neil Patrick Harris no longer Doogie? Has he gone to a point a fame where he's just Neil Patrick Harris? Yeah, I think most people don't know him from Doogie Houser. I think he's-- That is remarkable. It really is. I think if you found people-- that would be like when we were watching Doogie Houser or someone goes, is Neil Patrick Harris still not the kid magician? Well, you mean the kid magician? Oh, that's what he was sort of famous for as being a kid magician. She's a stage magician. She won a career. Yeah, he still does magic. He's like at the Magic Castle all the time and does magic frequently. That's a myth. Gee, that's a life. Yeah. And a gay rights icon. Exactly. Yeah. Max Costello, he was in "Newsies." He was in "The Sopranos." Right, he played Benny. He was a big buzzer. I loved him in "Newsies." He was a big buzzer. Yes, well, who wasn't good in "Newsies?" "Newsies" is one of my guilty pleasure movies. I love that movie. "Christian Bale's finest work." Right. David Masco, who was in "Big." He played Tom Hanks's, you know, he looked very similar. But I saw the Broadway version of it. The recent Broadway version? Yeah, what do you think? It was good, you know, it's weird because everyone else was kids, really. It was me and my friend, who, like, I love "Newsies," which I remember when I was 15 or 16. She bought me a VHS copy from my birthday. Were you a fan of musicals generally? Or was it just "Newsies?" "Newsies." It was "Newsies." I just loved "Newsies." I think part of it, I think, just the social justice aspect, because there was a lot of that in there. Oh, yeah. I don't think I was that kid who was like-- I wasn't, like, an actor. You have 1940s nostalgia for "Newsies." Yeah, I can. It was actually '20s, right? Yeah, '80s, the '20s. It was-- man, there's a lot of stuff in there that's really kind of subversive. When I saw the live version, I'm like, they're talking about, like, well, the stage versions, they were talking about women's rights, they were talking about-- Stuff hit you as an adult that kind of skipped over. As I'm like, the kids are watching, this is incredible. Yeah. Like, and the kids trying to fight for their rights and for their parents and poverty. And I'm like, kids are watching this. This is amazing. And again, that's sort of back to the empowered kids world of Nickelodeon, where kids change the world. And now it's not like that. I feel like when you have a kid character, they're just like a spoiled prick. Well, it's also like all that and all these-- Carly, it's just the way Disney shows were. And Mickey Mouse, like, it's just these kids are either going to be out of the business or fucked up. And watching Pete and Pete and all that, that's not the impression you get, like, these are just cool kids. No guys are still around, but they seem really down to Earth. I can still think, though, because I was watching all these reunion things about Pete and Pete. Like, I had this kick of, like, ah, Pete and Pete nostalgia. I went to a bunch of them. Did you? And Michelle Trakenberg was never in any of them. She won't do any of them. Why? She's too good for it. That's ridiculous. Yeah, I went to the first one. I actually-- when they announced the first one at the Bowery Ballroom in New York, I instantly bought a ticket. I went down to New York that weekend. And I often will pretend that I belong somewhere that I don't. So I'll, like, walk backstage and that kind of stuff. And no one ever stops me because I just look like I just have this, like, look on my face and go on. So actually, my wife went with me and we went to where all of the cast members were sitting in this balcony area. And we sat down and they came out and they opened with, hey, Sandy. They played it. And I started-- By Polaris. Polaris, yes. Me and my brother used to sing that song together and pretend we were in the band. Mark Mulcay from Polaris lives in Connecticut. Now, he just played up here in Boston. And he was in a band called the Miracle Legion, which was supposed to be what REM ended up being. Wow. And REM used to cover their songs. Really? Because I think they always felt bad that the Miracle Legion had to go. Is that any reason why Michael Steigt was in-- Yes, yeah, a little bit. He was sort of in that indie world, but he was mostly in it because one of the directors of Pete and Pete directed shiny, happy people. Wow. And she knew that world of people. And so they opened with, hey, Sandy. And I just inadvertently started crying. Like, it was just like, in the weirdest thing, I turned around and all of Little Pete's friends were behind me. So like, everyone except Michelle Tractenberg. But like, Teddy and all the kid actors and the guy who was bus driver, Stu was on a ton of Hell Hartley movies. They were all just there. And it was one of the most surreal, bizarre moments for me because that show was so-- was just everything to me at one point. And to just be like, these are real people, and I could just go down to New York, and they're just there. It was really, really strange. Are you sure Michelle Tractenberg doesn't want to do it just because of that? That's what I've heard. I've heard she's not. She just doesn't know it. Because I mean, I can get-- she was like four or five, right? Yeah. So I'd imagine that's weird. Like, you four or five. They've gotten everybody else back, except for her. Everybody. And I've been to more than one reason. I like their podcast. It's very fun. They're Danny and Mike. They have a podcast called The Adventures of Danny and Mike. And why do they have comics on all the time? Kurt Browner was on. Benadei, Chris Ginnott. You should get on it. Are you serious? They're doing Brooklyn. They both live in Brooklyn. Because I know, you know, Beth Hoyt? Yeah. Beth, I know, I think it's friends with them or some things. I saw something that she did where she was interviewing Pete and Pete and Pete and Pete and Pete. And I'm just like, how do you know by a mess? We don't marry him. Who books shows? Wait, yeah. She's good for Danny and Mariah. Are you kidding me? Oh my god. Yeah, I have to. I have to find what it means. Because me and my brother should interview Pete and Pete. Yeah, I agree. I think you should. Well, my brother and I have talked about getting the original Gabby from Ghostwriter on. Hey, Tana Morales, I was obsessed with that. You've got to do that. OK, yeah, I remember writing a spec script for Pete and Pete. That's really awesome. Yeah. So we are at Thursday night now, eight o'clock. Yeah, Cosby show. Second and second of the week. Because this was the not that we run this. This would have been the normal spot spot for Cosby. And this one Vanessa learns the ABCs of drinking. Oh, I love this one. When she and some girlfriends spice up a boring party by playing the alphabet game. I don't know if you remember this episode, but Vanessa gets caught drinking and then Bill Cosby makes her play the drinking game with Rudy. And they think that it's actual outcome. And I was like, what are you doing? He's like, no, we're playing it. And he does a drink or no. And they're doing the whole thing. Oh, it's really funny. It's probably my tide with the episode where Theo moves out. And Cliff pretends to be the landlord. That's the episodes of the Cosby show. This is a really good one. 8.30, what'd you go with? Well, I went from 8.30 to 10. I didn't like anything. So I went with the baseball playoffs. So baseball again. So in the world, there's always baseball. There's always a good connection. Which is the one thing that has stayed true throughout eras. And this is game two of the National League Championship series telecast from the home of the Eastern Division winner. None of that. I don't know what any of that means. So '89, it would have been-- let me think here. '90, it was the Reds and the Pirates '89. I think it'll tell me. Let's see how accurate you are. We flipped between '90s. '89 would have been-- oh, that would have been San Francisco and Oakland. I wonder if the earthquake was that week. So what night are we on Thursday night? No game. And that doesn't say who it is. I think the earthquake-- Well, the San Francisco earthquake? Yeah, it was either game one or game two, right? I think it was in '89. Yeah. Yeah, because I remember there was a big thing. It was an interrupt to the game. Someone can correct me if you know. Email me at kennedy.com, and I will let her know. So I would not have watched baseball. I never really got that into sports. So at 8.30, I probably would have gone with, are you being served, which I did not really like, but I would watch a British show if it was on. And at 9 o'clock, again, this Thursday night is tough because baseball has preempted the usual sort of must-see TV. So I probably would have switched over to WROR and watched Remington Steel, a rerun of Remington Steel. Was must-see TV what it was called on Thursday even back then? No, they started that around '91. OK, that's when they would have had pre-friends then. Pre-friends, yeah, I'm so- Mad about you. Mad about you hadn't started on Thursdays. It was Seinfeld and Cheers. Seinfeld, at that point? By the time they moved to Thursdays, it was. But the first two seasons, it was not doing well. It got killed by Get-A-Life, actually. The first two seasons were destroyed. Get-A-Life ratings were good at some point. For the first season, Get-A-Life ratings were huge. Really? Absolutely. And then they moved it. They moved the night for the second season. Oh, and they killed it, yeah. I think which I think they did on purpose. What, because it was so weird? Well, I think one of the things- That's always a weird- Fox had weird shows, but it was one of those situations where a new head of the network came in and they tried to just get rid of everything that they had nothing to do with. Man, the first few years of Fox should be studied. Absolutely, it was the Wild West, much like Nickelodeon where it was people like, look, there's low risk where everyone thinks we're going to fail, so do whatever. That's great. And you would just get this great, innovative stuff. We don't have a world like that now. I felt like G4 reminded me of sort of old MTV for a while when it first started. But that was the last network I remember being like- Doing something. Doing something sort of interesting. So finally, we are at the last night of the week, Friday night, eight o'clock, what'd you go with? This is all TJ of line up. Yeah, this was the reason you picked this TV card. Yes, absolutely, Full House, which was a, and also Friday, we watched as a family. We watched TV as- For the full two hours? Yeah. And we watched, a lot of shows as a family. That's what you say, we never did. Do you have an older brother? No, younger brother. No, younger brother, okay. My mom, Friday was all four of us watching TV together. And- Did you get like a pizza or something? Sometimes, yeah, I mean, that was the thing. That was always the thing that we did. And there were other shows that we watched together, but Friday was like Family Night, watching TV. And Full House was, you know, a definite favorite. And we watched, you know, Mima really watched the reruns obsessively too. Though, you know, Full House is a strange show in that like, you know, the mother dies. Yeah. Which is the reason why the, you know, Danny's best friend and brother in a love move in. Hope to help him out. And then after the first episode, the kids are fine. There's no therapy. Every so often it would come up. Yeah, but it's not, that should be, your mother's gone. That should be a big deal. That's a big deal. The fact that Danny's not gonna therapy, the fact that, like Danny needed help. He needed support. And not just like these two dudes, but actual people to say, Hey man, this is hard. You have three kids. The youngest one is still a baby, yeah. Like this is hard for you. I always, I remember. Where were his parents? They never came in and stepped in. I mean, the mother's parent, the dead mother parent came in sometimes, but his parents didn't show up very often. I remember telling my dad that I was like, I think he's a clean freak because he's processing his wife's death, right? Yeah, I thought that, like, like, is what? He's just so, and not like it's a dress. Like, if you, if someone did another, you know, like a Garfield without Garfield? Yes, yes. Is that's it? Yes, yeah. John's just talking to no one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I feel like John is basically Bob Sagg, it's character on that show. Yeah, pretty much just a sad, lonely person who did an aisle. Yeah, yeah. Like, 'cause he, what he falls in love with Vicki, and that doesn't work out. Like, that could have been a drama that honestly could have been a drama. Oh yeah, you could, you could remake that. I've, I think it would be interesting to do a prequel series. Right. Like what it was like, or like an alternate reality. Yeah. Where Danny died to see whatever it should be. Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah, fantastic, yeah. Else worlds of Full House. Some sure fanfic. Oh, there's definitely that. That's incredible. But yeah, what, there was a lot of dead mom shows at this time. Well, the dead mom show. Or dead parents. There was, why am I drawing a blank? I feel like there was a lot of single parents, but there was a dead parent. Well, Valerie, Valerie died. I'm a Valerie Shonner. Sure, right. It can begin to poke in to me. How did they address that? So this was horrific. So that was a behind the scenes. She wanted more money. She's like, it's my name's on the show. And I'm like, fuck you, you're gone. So they didn't say anything about it. Season ends in May. Season picks up in September. They're all the boys sitting around the table, making some laughs. About two minutes into the episode, Jason Bateman goes, hey, dad, you know, it just hasn't been the same since mom died in the car accident. Just like that? Just like that. Just like that. Rugged out for money. Wow. Yeah. That's awful. That show ran for a while. Four more seasons after that. Who was Sandy Duncan's character? She played the father's sister. I don't think I really watched that show. I feel just there. The first, when the incarnation is valid, it was actually a pretty good show. And it addressed a lot of things. It was the first family sitcom to address condoms. Really? There was a, oh, this speaking of characters with AIDS. This is a very long episode, everybody. But this is, I'm enjoying it. Now, Belvedere Handel Day is pretty well compared to what they did with this kid. So later in the final season of "The Hogan Family," one of Jason's Bateman's friends is Kid Rich, who had been in the series since the beginning. He left the series 'cause he wanted more money. So they said, oh, he went to Europe. And then he had some sort of behind the scenes problems with the producers. So they're like, we have a contract. You have to come back and do this episode. He contractually obligated to come back. They bring him back, give him eight. How many seasons later? Eight seasons later. It's the last season. See, he was under a contract, how was that work? Well, he was in for like the first six seasons, and then was out. He owed them an episode for something. So they brought him back, gave him AIDS, and killed him in one episode. Wow. So this was a character that we knew for the whole run of this show. It wasn't like we just introduced him for this episode. And the way they introduced it is horrific there. Jason Bateman and his buddy are filming some documentary in a hospital. And they seem to be like, Rich, how you doing? Where have you been? He's like, I was in Europe. So then he's like, are you guys-- They did not do tragedy well at all. Yes, no, they didn't. And they go like this. They're like, oh, where did Rich go? And some guy, I think he's like a janitor. And the hospital goes, oh, he went down there with all the rest of the AIDS patients. And they're like, what? And then he's like, I got it from some chick in Europe. And then he just dies. He just dies. Got it from some chick in Europe. Yep. And also, I think there's such a-- well, it's also the area of like when people didn't know, like, oh, you get HIV. And there's a process that goes-- It's not just here. And it's not just-- Right, right. And it's just like, it's snow. You have AIDS, you're dead. Dead. And it's not-- I mean, like, I've been watching the Magic Johnson stories and documentaries about that time. And it's just, everyone thought he was gone. Yeah. They thought it was over for him. And he's still alive. And because of drugs and because of all-- there's so many different ways to keep people alive. And back then, it's like, oh, yeah. You have, he's gone. It's over. Yeah. And you really thought if you got that, you were absolutely-- And that plot came up in a lot of shows. There was actually a very well handled episode of Designing Women, where a friend of theirs, who's a gay guy in this episode, where it was thought was a little more realistic at the time and respectful, instead of some friggin' Euro chick. And he dies of AIDS by the end of the episode. And it's very well handled. He came on almost the same year as the episode of The Hogan Family. And it's interesting to sort of watch them back to back and compare the two. Well, it makes me think right now, just-- this reminded me because we were home in Nickelodeon before. Remember Linda L.R.B. show? Yeah, they were very-- What was it called again? So she had-- she used to host any of the kids' news events. But she had a morning news show. I can't remember what it was called. You can't remember the name of the show. But it was so-- It was great. --great for kids. And it didn't talk down to anyone. It felt-- I was talking to my brother about this on our podcast just about-- I love that show because it was like kids' news. Yeah. But this was our news show. But it wasn't silly like-- Great kids. No, it was a show and the kids were in the audience. And I remember-- I think they had Ryan White on. Yes, yep. And I just remember, like, that's incredible. And it felt important. And it felt like it was for us. And we weren't being spoken down. Yeah. Or we weren't watching something that was more adult. And we just have to be watching it. And they weirdly always paired that with kids' court, with Paul Provenza. Oh, I do remember because it was not-- Yeah, like serious news and then Paul Provenza. It's funny. I bumped into Paul Provenza a few times. I've never mentioned that to him, because I've never-- I didn't seriously watch the show. I would love to talk to him someday, because I-- About kids' court? About kids' court? Facts of life? He's not in exposure? He was in the last season of Facts of Life, as Blair's love interest. He was in a show prior to that on NBC. He was one of the people who was in a show, got canceled, they put him on another show. That same season, which is how he got in Facts of Life. He replaced Rob Morrow on Northern Exposure, after he got fired for wanting too much money. Rob Morrow was Northern Exposure. He left, because he walked, because he wanted more money. He was on SNL, because he was the star of Northern Exposure. Yes, yes, and he used to be Johnny Depp's roommate. And he got replaced with Paul Provenza. What is Rob Morrow now? From what I understand, he was very difficult to work with. And so once he left Northern Exposure, pretty much nobody would touch him. I don't know what he's done since then. He was a star. He was huge, but I think it really went to his head. And I remember there was always contract negotiations. Northern Exposure started late a couple times, because he wouldn't film. Was it that big of a show? It was huge. It was huge. That show was greenlit because of Twin Peaks. So Twin Peaks was huge for the one season, one second season came on, no one gave it shit anymore. They started greenlighting weird shows. That was their thing. So Northern Exposure got greenlit because of Twin Peaks, and then became such a longer-lasting hit in a really good show, Northern Exposure was. I love that show, but I never liked Rob Morrow, an unlikable person, just something off-putting. But it worked on the show because he was supposed to be an off-putting uncomfortable person. But yeah, Paul Provenzer replaced him. And Paul Provenzer had a great show on the original comedy channel called Comics Only, which is why I heard of so many great stand-ups. He would interview him and Fred. Fred, who was a writer for SNL, he wrote the movie Dirty Work. I can't think of his name. But yeah, he used to do this show, and that's why I first saw Bill Hicks and that's people like that. So at 8.30, you're still watching the TJIF with Family Matters, before it became The All-Arkel Show. Yeah, and in that TV guy, it's called New Show, right? Yes, this was the debut. This is just, it's a spin-off of Perfect Strangers. That's right. And this was when it was a show about a family and not about their wacky neighbor. This is runaway water consumption is the least of the family's worries after Rachel alienates everyone by writing a short story whose fictional characters sound all too familiar. A family event that's happened to all of us. Right, and Rachel is on Ray Caunt. Yeah, who was on Give Me A Break, Thelma Hopkins. It's always in Thelma Hopkins, 'cause she was in and out of that show. She was, I think that, I think once they sort of focused on Erkel and the younger kids, they sort of were less interested in the family dynamic. Well, the little Judy disappeared. She disappeared. And then they had a little-- They made a little film later. Right, and then they had a little Richie, they had the cute kid thing, they added another cute kid and it was weird because of death. It was film, it was Aunt Rachel's kid. But she was gone. Right, she was gone. It was really actually, that's another show, like just like, where's little Richie's father? That's true. Where did she go? At a very fluid reality. Yeah, how come this other kid was a little G or something? Yeah. What is he doing here? There was, someone needs to really do like a timeline of that show or like a family tree or something like that's just, what? I remember. Creating this weird science fiction in the clone of himself. Yeah, it was, I remember reading a very funny theory someone had about, say it by the bell, where their theory was the whole universe took place in a biosphere and that the max and everything was in this building and they never left it. And they had all this evidence for it. Someone's got to have something similar with-- Well then, why did they say the show was in Indiana and then obviously they moved to California. Exactly, yeah. I see, I think there was all those sorts of inconsistencies like it was some sort of-- And how did some kids disappear? Exactly. Exactly. Do you know what I loved in Boy Meets World, which was a T.J. F. Show, way later? There was the Minkus character-- Yes. --who reappears during graduation. Yes, that was a nice callback. I always loved when people did that. There was actually a really, did you ever see the movie Summer School with Mark Harmon? One of my favorite jokes is that in the beginning of the movie, this big black dude has to go to the bathroom and he leaves and you forget about him. And then at the end of the movie they have to take this test and the guy shows up and takes the test. And he's like, where were you? And he's like the bathroom. And he's like, for six weeks. And he's like, yeah. And then at the end of the movie they're going over the scores. And then he's like, you got an 88. And he's like, oh, is that the highest? And he's like, no, the guy who's in the bathroom got a 91. And it's like such a great callback. And it's just small to take-- It's just a small little thing and it's such a funny joke. I love that long game callbacks. So nine o'clock, you no doubt went with Perfect Strangers. Yes, I got it, yes. This is when they were working at the newspaper. As editor of the Chronicles newsletter, Balki gets some practical advice from Larry on digging deeper into the who, what, when, where, and why of "Office Gossip." I love that show. It was an incredible ensemble. The two of them had an incredible dynamic. It really brought back physical comedy. Yes. It was very Lucy in physical comedy. Yes, it was very much like-- It's funny, now I look at the Balki character. And there's that part of me that at the time obviously love the show. Love that was my favorite show. Don't, no doubt, as a kid that was-- Someone asked you then, "Pit Perfect Strangers." It's not a question. Maybe part of it was I had a brother and that dynamic. You felt like you had a similar dynamic? It was a different dynamic, but just at any time there was a close relationship between two characters, whether they were siblings or whether-- Oh, that was interesting to you. To me, I think part of me was connected because I had a brother and we weren't on adventures as kids in our imagination. It was really good. Yeah, because I had a sister and we were never close. It always, I think, appealed to me, the idea of duos and stuff, and I love the dynamic. So I love that show, but I've seen a thing about it now. It's like, what a crappy representation of a name of rent. Absolutely, and it made up Greek island. Made of Greek island. He believes in witchcraft. With a ridiculous accent, it doesn't understand anything after so many years. He's written like a nine-year-old. Right, right, right. It's basically like, it's almost like Tommy's character and big. Yeah, he's in an adult body if I don't understand. Larry is psychotic. Right, right. Like that guy was almost terrifying. On the third of psychotic. Dying at even having a horror decor. Marklyn Baker is one of the most terrifying people. He does a lot of Broadway. Yeah, yeah, I was reading some of that recently, actually, just about at Google, the perfect strangers reunion. And I get two in the morning, like, what are they having? That's the only time to do that. Right, because everyone's having a reunion show. Yeah, oh yeah, or like some kind of like, where are they now? Brunson Pinchot has a show now. What do you mean? He has a show where he bought this entire town in Pennsylvania and he's refurbishing it. Because I knew he was doing like that kind of stuff. I didn't know he was wow. Yeah, he goes to a lot of the big outdoor flea markets, like Brimfield and stuff and buys like old salvage stuff. And people see him like buying salvage doors and things. Yeah, he made so much money in perfect strings. He literally bought a town. How did he, that show? I mean, I don't see it on reruns. It was on reruns for a long time. So that wasn't that too. Yeah, and I think that if you were-- Happen reruns meant something because you didn't have the internet. You watched reruns. And I don't know a lot about this part of the business, but there was a time in the '80s, the mid '80s, when that's when you made bank on reruns. Because in the '70s, a lot of people got screwed over. Like the Brady bunch of people never made anything, Sherwood Schwartz made every dime. The same with Gilligan's Island and that sort of stuff. So in the '80s, they sort of renegotiated these contracts where you got big money for reruns, which is why they made a huge deal out of episode 100 because that you could go into syndication. And it was before all of the local stations were bought by giant corporations. So you could have a show on TBS nationally and on different affiliate syndications in every single market. And you got paid for every single one of those instead of just the one time because it's the CW affiliate or something. So you basically were set for life. If you were on a sitcom in the '80s that lasted for more than five seasons, you never had to work again. And that's not how it works now. No, just to go like that kind of dream scenario. And now I'm just a broad way for the rest of me to be there. Yeah, because I want to. Be the actor I was supposed to be. Yes, this is paid by Bill's. And at 9.30, my absolute favorite show. Is that your absolute favorite TJ F show? And maybe one of my favorite sitcoms, the best spin off of all time, just the 10 of us. What was it a spin off of? Going Paints. Oh, the coach. Yeah, Coach Lubecky was it? Coach Lubeck, yeah. Grand T. Lubeck. That's a really funny show. They move away, is that what happened? They moved, yep, he got fired from Dewey High. He coached the Dewey High Hooters. Why did he get fired? He got fired because, what was the reason he got fired for? You know, I don't remember when it was a two-parter. They did a backdoor pilot, he got fired, and he got this job at a Catholic school in California because a kid he used to coach was the head coach there and hired him as his assistant coach, who was played by the guy who was the president on 24 and does the all-state commercials. Oh, really? Wait, so he's, Coach Lubeck is an assistant coach? At the school in California, yeah. He's not the actual coach. No, because he was in New York, because he needed a job, he moves this whole family. So the whole show is him being an assistant coach? Yes. He can feed a family that big, being an assistant coach? Not really. Like, there are episodes where they get government assistance, they were constantly, they had no money. Yeah, and all the, one of the things-- They get government assistance. They do. That's fantastic. It's not fantastic. It does, it does. It actually was addressed, yeah. And one of the things that, why he went there was, because all these kids were able to go to this school for free. That was part, and they got the house. Amazing. The school put them up in the house. For being an assistant coach? Yeah, it was, it was, because basically this guy who-- Who recruits an assistant coach from New York? This guy who grew up, coach Lubeck was the guy who inspired him and changed his life. Right, right, right. So he was able to kind of pull some strings. That's a lot of strings. That's a lot of strings. Wait, so we gotta get this guy to be an assistant coach, what, to sport? He was teaching the show. I don't know what's, it was just all sports. It would be like sometimes it was basketball. He was just coach. Sometimes it was swimming. He was just coach. Made sense to me. I didn't know that's all sports. But that didn't have to be a head coach. No, just coach. It's just, we recruited an assistant coach from New York for all sports, and we're going to pay the cup of the tuitions for all his kids, and there were 10 of them. And it was an all boys Catholic school, but they made an exception to let his daughters into the school first time ever. Not a whole. They really bent over back in this guy. There's a lot of holes in it. I'm also going to go out and lay them and say, I own the world's largest collection of just a 10 of us memorabilia. Cast jackets. I have an autographed cast T-shirt by Coach Lubbock. So you've met him? I haven't. He mailed it to me. I-- When? Personalized maybe two years ago? Oh, this was easy. Yeah, oh, I could show it. It's great. I also have about 20 original continuity scripts from the show with the Polaroids, for the costumes. For some reason, they show I love-- I'm assuming that this might be wrong, that those things have no resale value. They probably have very little to no resale it, but they're one of a kind. Yeah, they're right. But yeah, I just was obsessed with the show. I thought it was really funny. It was also a show that made a lot of meta jokes. Like, it was on before Mr. Belvedere. Yeah. I remember there was an episode where Wendy comes home and coaches watching TV. He's like, oh, you just missed your favorite show? And she's like, what show is it? He's like, ah, it's that really funny one on after Mr. Belvedere? No, that's funny. Like, there was all kinds of-- And as a kid, I was like, my mind has just been blown. That's a myth, and even-- Yeah, there was a lot of that sort of thing. So this episode, too proud to accept charity, the coach may be forced to moonlight to bring home the bacon when Elizabeth brings home free surplus cheese. This is the very episode we were just discussing, where they get government assistance cheese. That's amazing. Great show. So finally, the TV got, as we know, is not just informative. It is opinionated, and it cheers, and it jeers. I will read you the cheers and jeers from this week, and I will see if you agree or disagree. I'm getting a cheers and jeers during that time period, until it is a big deal. This made you. A jeer. The TV guy cheered you, you had a career. Yeah. For jeer, you might as well kill yourself. Wow. Yeah, for an era. Absolutely. So we start with a cheers. OK. To the dance numbers on Fox's The Tracy Elman Show, choreographed by Paula Abdul. Wow. I didn't even know that was a thing. That's amazing. I don't know how you couldn't share that. That's amazing. So you have to agree with that. Yes. Jears to Sam Donaldson for calling the kettle black on ABC prime time live, Donaldson and Diane Sawyer interviewed vice president Dan Quill, raking him over the coals for some of his notorious slips of the tongue, including Quills fracturing of the phrase, a mind is a terrible thing to waste, into losing one's mind is a terrible thing. Scanned minutes later, Donaldson informed us during a piece on aviation disaster that if man had wanted to fly, he would have given himself wings. You said a mouthful, Sam. If man say it again, if man had wanted to fly, he would have given himself wings. He did. I think it was if men was meant to fly, God would have given him wings. I'm not familiar with that phrase. Oh, so they're saying that it's ironic that he butchered the phrase after. Right, that's a given quail crap about it. OK, if that's what they're saying, I guess that's true. I feel indifferent on this one. Yeah, I think if you said anything about Sam Donaldson and Dan Quill, I'd be like, I don't care. Next, we have a Jears to NBC Nightly News with Tom Brokaw for bad judgment. Near the end of one news, Cass Brokaw began a story about a mother black bear that had wandered into Albuquerque searching for her lost cub. Judging by Brokaw's breezy tone, we were expecting to see footage of a furry family reunion. That's why what came next was doubly shocking. The bear had climbed to the top of a 25-foot utility pole and state game officials stupidly tranquilized her. We watched the animal plummet to the power transformer and was hit by 7,200 volts, sending off a cascade of sparks and the bear suffered severe burns. Wait, it was live TV? Yes. I guess it's Nightly News. Yeah, Nightly News. I guess at the time, they wouldn't have carefully looked at the-- I don't-- I mean, here's the thing, OK, as somebody-- I don't want that bear to get hurt. So that's obviously a jeer. But at the same time, watching that live is incredible. It is, but is that a news story? I don't-- Bear gets electrocuted. Film, little heaven. Yeah, it doesn't seem like a news story to me. I mean, now it's a YouTube club, and it goes viral, like the music behind it. And people crying with that's the most-- People see the bear clip, so-- Do you see the dubstep remix? Right, the bear clip. And finally, cheers-- this one, before I ever read, I can tell you, I've never agreed with a cheer. People who give cheers are cheers to cheers? They should, cheers to cheers. Some friends and I when I lived in London went to cheers at London as a lark. And one of my friends was British. And he said cheers, as thank you, as the British do. And we decided to be funny that instead of thank you at a restaurant, you just said the name of the restaurant. We were like 22, it was easy. I gave you a courtesy, huh? Yes, yes. T.J. Fridays. So cheers to Alex Rocco, the provocative talent agent on CBS's "The Famous Teddy Z." The veteran character actor turned in one of the most furiously funny TV performances in recent years in the pilot of this promising sitcom. Wow. And that's a show I have never heard of. I got it, I could make you copy show. Yeah, it's very good. And it was only half a season, right? I only have about 13 episodes, so only re-aired ones on Comedy Central, actually. Wow. Great show. Well, thank you for doing the show. Oh, this was so much fun. I really enjoyed this and I would love to do it again. Absolutely, and also this should be a TV show. I would love to have this be a TV show. This should be a TV show. People can talk about it in 20 years. Well, I think it fits both people's need for nostalgia, also trivia. I think you obviously are very knowledgeable about it. And if you get the right, I guess the issue is getting rights to clips. Yes, but maybe in the YouTube world you can do that. Yeah, yeah. This was really great. Thank you so much. Have a seat. And there you have it. That was my episode with Harry Condobolo. I said it was a long one. I had considered splitting it into two parts, but I couldn't really find a natural break in the episode. And I think it was pretty interesting all the way through the little academic. I think if you may be able to get college credit for having listened to that episode, but it was pretty enjoyable, in my opinion. And that's really the opinion that matters because it's my show. But as always, please continue to email me at Ken@iconread.com. I'm sure I got things wrong. I don't do any research for the show. It's all just coming straight out of my head. So there's obviously mistakes that will happen. Ken@iconread.com. Go to our Facebook page and join up there. We have contest trivia. There's some discussions back and forth with some of the community over there, which is always great. Please continue to rate us and review us on iTunes. It's a huge help. It helps people find out about the show. And I'm continuing to get some great guests lined up for future episodes. So I think you'll be very pleased. So thanks again. And we'll see you next Wednesday on TV guidance counselor. 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