Welcome in to the cool grandpa podcast. This is the podcast where we talk to grandfathers, adult grandchildren, and experts in areas of importance to grandfathers. Whether you're a new grandfather, a seasoned pro, or somebody interested in learning about relationships, this is the place for you. So come on in, join us as we learn together, laugh together, and support each other on the cool grandpa podcast. Welcome in to the cool grandpa podcast. I'm excited to have you here. I'm your host Greg Payne, and as you can see behind me, if you're watching this on YouTube, I went ahead and put some fall colors up behind me on my screen. So I'm starting to get into the fall swing of things. I'm definitely not one of those pumpkin spice people. So no offense. I've got friends that are, but that's just not me, but I do love the fall. I love a smell of a nice campfire or some kind of a, you know, crackling sound that campfires and even fires within the house make. I just enjoy that and that smell of the smoke in the air just really reminds me that it's fall and it's time to start getting ready for the coming winter. One of the things I also enjoy doing, and it's probably sharing a little bit, but that's all right, is I love going kayaking in the fall. Now, the reason I enjoy going kayaking in the fall is most of the summer traffic is off the river, meaning a lot of the raft companies have shut down operations here. You don't find a lot of tubers that are out, and so you just really find small groups of private boaters or kayakers that are out enjoying the rivers, and it can really seem like we've got the whole world to ourselves when we're in these small groups, paddling down the rivers, talking about everything and nothing at the same time. So fall is definitely one of my favorite times of the year. This week, we have four women who are friends. They are mothers. They are grandmothers. They're daughters. They've got all sorts of information and background that I wanted to talk to them about in terms of what can we as grandfathers, as dads, as father-in-laws, do to support moms and help relieve some of the stress that's going on in their lives. I know this is going to be an interesting conversation. We bring up a number of different books and resources, so of course I'm going to have those into the show notes as well. So if you're out driving around, you can go to cool-grandpa.us and you can check out the show notes for this episode, and I'll have links to the books that we mentioned, as well as links to everybody's websites as well. So this is a fabulous conversation. I really enjoyed having it, and I know you're going to enjoy this as well. So without further ado, let's jump into this conversation. I'm excited that we've got our second cracker barrel or our roundtable discussion, and I've got a lot of great women here to hopefully give us a little bit of insights, help us guys out, because there's a bunch of stuff that we just don't ask questions about. Before we get into that topic, what I'd love to do is go around and have the panel introduce each other. Laurie, if you wouldn't mind kicking us off and giving us just a brief introduction of yourself. Thanks, Greg. I'm Laurie Nguyen. I live in Eastern North Carolina. I am a mother of two and a grandmother of five, and I really love being a grandmother. More than I love being a mother, because you can have all of fun without all of the daily grind of trying to raise decent human beings. I'm just the frosting on the cake. That's awesome. Dee Dee, would you please introduce yourself? Absolutely. I'm Dee Dee Moore. I run More Than Grand, which is a website for new grandparents to get the resources they need to learn how to be good partners to parents and forge a strong bond with their grandchildren. Thank you so much for that. Terry, can you please introduce yourself? Sure. I'm Terry Byrne. I'm the founder of the Long distance Grandparent, and I help grandparents create fun and meaningful relationships with their grandchildren. From a distance, I'm not a grandparent. I'm the mum of two, and when I had my children, I always say that I, in the process, birthed six long distance grandparents. I've also been an aging care researcher for a couple of decades, and so I combine my academic expertise and share research backed ideas, and just draw on some of my own personal experiences keeping my children connected to their grandparents. Oh, that's awesome. Thank you. Amanda, how about you introduce yourself? Sure thing. Hey, everybody. I'm Amanda Weister. I'm currently living in North Georgia right now with my family. I am a mum of two. Stay at home, mom. I homeschool my children, and my dad lives with us. He's lived with us on and off for the past 10 years. Give or take some here and some there, and he's probably with us to stay. And so it's really fun because I have a little bit of a different perspective, I think, from everyone else here, it sounds like because I've got a grandparents under my roof. Oh, that's awesome. And what's incredible, Amanda, is that's becoming more common again, having those three generation, multi generation households. So this will be a great perspective that you bring to the table. Now, here's the thing. This is great. I feel like I'm kind of getting secrets here for all the guys that are afraid to talk and ask these questions. All right. So here's the thing that I'd like to know is what do moms need from fathers and father-in-laws in terms of support, whether it's like in the house, or with the relationships, or with just kind of going through that experience. What I'd love to do is hear from you guys, and maybe Dee Dee will start with you as far as what's your experience with what do moms need, or what can we do as dads in father-in-laws to help support those important to us? Literally. It's so important for grandfathers to play an active, intentional role in their grandkids' lives. I think moms really want to have those other adults for their children who cherish them, and are there for them as cheerleaders, and fans. And grandpas are unnatural for that role. So I think more than anything, the grandfathers who really think about their role, and who really take the time to figure out what kind of grandpa they want to be, and how they can be involved. That's a real gift to parents. Oh, thank you for that. And Laurie, what are some of your insights? You know, it's just, I think it depends on the woman, right? And really, I keep going back to that the five love languages, right? Somebody may say, "I just need time away. I just need time as an adult woman to remember, you know, more than graham crackers and cartoons." But other people like, if he would just vacuum the house, you know, I would fall at his knees and fall in love with him all over again. So it just depends on the woman themselves. But I think really, one of the key things that I see is that women want to be cherished. And I have heard that a father, the best thing that he can do for his kids is to love their mother. Oh, that's awesome. Now, what maybe insights or thoughts do you have in terms of what that mom's father or father-in-law can do to help support them? I think just have faith that she knows what she's doing. We come to this earth with this nurturing inside of us, right? We literally, in a lot of cases, we birth those kids right out of our own bodies. We think we know what we're doing. And we also see how parenting styles change, right? Some of them will let them cry out. And others like don't let them cry. And just like give that mother a little bit of grace and have faith in her, that she knows what's best for her kids. Oh, that's well said. I appreciate that. Amanda, what are some of your thoughts as far as what moms and it could use from their fathers and father-in-laws? Yeah. So one of the things that I think is so beneficial that I have with my dad is he helps around the house, like Lori had said, vacuuming. He does dishes like no other. He is the king of dish doing at my house. And I appreciate that not every dad or grandfather is going to do the dishes all the time. Mine does. And he cooks and he cleans. And for me, as a mom who does a lot of dishes and a lot of cooking, that's super beneficial. And so like Lori said, every mom is going to be a little bit different in what she needs and what she wants. But a mom who's home all the time doing those daily chores all the time, or a mom who's out working and can't do those daily chores because she's not home, that would be a super beneficial thing. You know, if you're there babysitting those kids or taking them places or showing them something, have them help, have them participate in working around the home. My dad is also super handy. And so he does all kinds of projects around the house, incessant amounts of projects. And I always ask him, dad, just grab the kids, grab one kid, grab both kids, and have them participate with you because he knows so much more than I know about anything. And more than I can teach my kids in so many areas, because he has just so much different experience, right? And so I'm always asking him, Hey, dad, pitch in, you know, grab a kid and teach them something that you love instead of just going with what I want, right? Because I don't always know everything just because I'm teaching them doesn't mean I know everything, right? I'm not really very good at changing the oil in a car. But my dad is. So, you know, it's all these, these little things that are going to be different for every person. Oh, yeah, definitely. And I think that's an important part of this whole discussion is that everybody's relationships and the dynamics are going to be different. And Delory's point with about the five love languages, right, is figuring out the different communication styles, it's figuring out what everybody needs, and then being able to step up and address it in that particular fashion. And Carrie, what about you? What have been some of your experiences and what have you seen where fathers and father-in-laws have been helpful and with the grandkids? Well, I mean, I'm going to go with the dish doing. I'm going to second Amanda's motion. We have an uncle in our lives who is like a grandpa to my kids. And whenever he's coming to visit, and my husband's actually the one that does the dishes at our house. And so we both look at each other and say, "Oh, you know, you don't have to do the dishes." And I think that it's kind of a, it's a role that you can take, especially during in-person visits where you're helping out. It's, you know, everyone loves. Everyone loves when someone has dishpan hands and they're not yours. So, but a little, I mean, more seriously, I think that, you know, one of the things is for fathers and grandfathers, and you really just need to show up. Like, I see what happens sometimes is that, you know, grandfathers are kind of the best supporting actor. And while some grandmothers might want that, I think, ultimately, right now, and in the stage that we want to have grandmas and grandpas who are equal partners in grandparenting. And so your kids, in particular, want to see you engage with their children, not just kind of show up for the visit, but like be there, you know, with your own gift that you went out, perhaps, and purchased. It doesn't have to be a gift, but like your own thoughts about what you might like to do with the children, I would say, especially for long distance grandpas, sign the card. You know, how many cards get signed? And it's just like Nana and Papa, and it's always in Nana's writing. And we want to have your writing in the cards. And so there's a whole left side of that card. And, you know, tell Nana that you want some of that part, and that you're going to be writing in the card as well, because one day, your grandchildren are certainly going to want to see that. I think the other piece, and this is, I think perhaps for those who have, who are getting a little bit older, but I'm going to encourage you to think about this earlier, because we actually, we've lost already my dad and my father-in-law. So my husband and I both don't have the grandpas for our children anymore. But one of the things that falls on to women often is the caring role and caregiving. And so as a mom, what is actually really useful from my dad is having, and it had those conversations around, and I know it sounds like nobody wants to talk about this, and my dad and I didn't want to talk about it either, but end-of-life conversations earlier than you think you should. And so right now, I am approaching 50. A lot of my friends have parents who are, you know, for example, can't drive anymore, or that's coming up, or those conversations are coming up. And it's a tough one, and it's a tough one, especially for men to lose their license. And I'm just using that as an example. There's a host of other things that feels like a bit of an assault on our independence as we get older. And so having some of those conversations earlier than you think that you should, because if you start them when you're 60, then you'll probably get around to all the key points by the time you're 80, and will be really valuable, because your daughters and daughter-in-laws are very likely still to, you know, still now to be the ones who are going to be the main caregivers, and especially the ones who are taking on that emotional labor of the caring role. So those would be from, like, a mom's perspective, what I would like to see from grandpas. I love it because it starts that conversation, which is also something I wanted to get into a little bit in terms of, especially the father-in-laws. And I've come at this, I'm going to be a little selfish. I had two boys, and I've got two awesome daughter-in-laws. And we get along pretty well, so don't get me wrong there. But what can father-in-laws start to do to build those relationships? Because I feel like there's a wedding, there's a ceremony, there's something. Hey, the photographer's saying group pictures, we're all here, and then the kids, the couples, they all go their separate ways, and especially father-in-laws kind of follow grandmas or the mother-in-laws into the situation and carry it to your point, you know, we're kind of an also their type of role. But I think father-in-laws ought to be a little bit more upfront in having that relationship with the daughter-in-laws. And I'm going to throw that open to anybody. What are your thoughts on that, and how do we build those relationships? I all start. I totally agree. And it's so important, and this goes from mothers-in-law too, but especially fathers-in-law who do tend to hang back from that relationship. The first thing you have to do is establish your own relationship with your daughter-in-law instead of thinking of her as, you know, Steve's wife. Think of her as Rachelle, you know, she's the one that you need to know, not as an extension of your son, but as an individual person. And take the time to be interested in her. That's all any of us want is to have somebody pay attention to us and listen to us and, you know, take the time to have those conversations and spend time together. Oh, I love that. Anybody else have any thoughts on how we can build those relationships with daughter-in-laws? Yeah, Amanda. I'll add to that what Dee Dee just said. My father-in-law has done a reasonably good job at this. My mother-in-law passed away this year, and it's been very obvious that dad still does have a relationship with everybody in the family. And I think you kind of start to wonder because, yeah, grandma signs the cards, and grandma says, "Hey, it's so-and-so's birthday. We have to call them." And then grandpa's always in the background like, "Hey guys, I'm back here." Right? But now grandma's not here, and it's just grandpa. And it's definitely a different dynamic in our family because grandma is kind of that gatherer, nurturer, right? Bring the family together. And now grandpa is really stepping up in his role as grandpa and saying, "Hey, I want to come visit you guys. We haven't been out there in a while." Or, "Hey, I want to come do this." And it's been really, really nice for our family to have that flexibility that grandpa is willing to come to us and willing to participate with us and also that he wants to because, like you said, sometimes you think it's just grandma pulling everything, but I don't think that's always true. And especially in this case, you know, grandpa really stepped up. In terms of communicating with me as his daughter-in-law, he actually asked me for help with something that is kind of career specific to what I did before I had children. And he asked for my help and asked me, "Hey, Amanda, I know that you did this. Can you help me? And are you able to help me in it's more of a plan for the future kind of thing?" He asked me if I could help him. And that's really touching for a daughter-in-law to be like, "Oh, grandpa wants me, knows my experience, knows what I'm good at in my strengths, and he wants me to help him." And so that was really, really nice to have him reach out to me and ask for my opinion and my help. Oh, that's awesome. And do you all think that part of it goes, I mean, Amanda was talking about, it goes a long way to building that relationship. So it's not just over Thanksgiving dinner when everything's really crowded, but having kind of that one-on-one and then asking the daughter-in-law, "Hey, what do you think about this? What's your opinion about that?" Well, I mean, it's really just treating them like, I mean, it's treating them just like another person that you would be interested in and talk to. And I think, as Dee Dee mentioned, people really just want to feel seen and heard. And for Amanda being asked for help and seen as a person kind of outside of this role of daughter-in-law, really, I have skills and I have a history and I have a career. And I think that that's really key. And I think also being, I call it the GE, oh, the Grand Encouragement Officer. And I think sometimes grandpas will be like the Grand Financial Officer and they're looking at like the inheritance or like, you know, the retirement monies or like who's getting wet for education. But you can play such a key role in noticing, and this goes for grandma's too, but just noticing things about your daughter-in-law. Not just as a parent, but as a human, as a friend, you know, to shave a lot of friends, you can make comments that are obviously authentic, but you have to notice it first. Or you have to notice and be open to who is this person, and not just the mother of my grandchildren, but someone in her own right who has, you know, a whole life outside of it. So I think engaging with your daughter-in-law in conversations showing interest in what they're interested in is something that Grandpa should definitely be doing. Oh, I love that. And I think, too, to that point, if a grandpa might be scratching their head, you know, look around. What are those interests? Everybody's on LinkedIn. What's your daughter-in-law's profile? You know, where are some strengths and interests and things? And you might have to, I don't want to say manufacturer because it sounds bad, but when things align where it's like, hey, what do you think about this? Or can I get your input on that? Could also, Greg, you could also just use this podcast. I mean, if you're listening, well, and you're like, actually, I don't really know a lot about my daughter-in-law, then you can say, I was listening to this podcast, and I realized I just owned up to it. You know, I actually don't know some really key things about you, and I love you, and I would like to know these things. And I think coming from that sort of place, it's like, yeah, she's probably going to be feeling either she may not have noticed if they're young children, or like, I don't know. But if she has noticed, then go grab by, and come along with some of the questions, and just ask about the things that she's interested in. And I'd just like to know more about your career, about any of the things. I mean, there's a million questions that you can ask people, but I think it's the same. Just talk to it if you are listening, and you realize, I really don't know my daughter-in-law. There's a great book called The Essential Questions, which is really designed for people to interview their grandparents to learn about their lives. But it's a great book for anyone you want to get to know. It has some really good questions that you can ask of anyone that you'd like to know better. So I recommend that one to grandfathers who might, as Kerry said, be listening to this and realize they need to work on that. Oh, well, thanks. And I'll find the links, whether it's on Amazon or whatnot, and make sure that that gets put into the show notes so folks can easily find that, and if they want to order a copy that will make it super simple for them. One question I've got is that what is your opinion about grandfathers introducing a little mischief, a little risk-taking with the grandkids? Where I'm coming from is that sometimes I think everything is so protected and people are so buttoned up in kids, especially, that sometimes grandfathers can be useful to add a little mischief. And what I mean by that, it would be something like encouraging somebody to climb a tree that's reasonable. I'm not talking about taking eight-year-olds base jumping off of the Empire State Building or anything like that. What are your opinions on? I guess what is it? Safe and constructive mischief? The great phrase, Greg. You've got to be sensitive to parents' tolerance for that, because some parents are going to say, "Go for it. I love that you're taking him out in the woods and teaching him these things." And other parents are going to say, "Please, stop putting him in danger. I'm not comfortable with the things you're doing." So that really comes down to the relationship with parents and what their tolerance is for that. Any other thoughts on grandpa's getting in a little mischief, a little fun with the grandkids? Yeah, Amanda. I'll go ahead and say, so my dad is very mischievous, and he was a skydiver and a motorcycle racer and all the things you can imagine of mischievous. And I absolutely love it that he will take the kids to do things that I'm not going to do. And just what I was saying before, he's going to change the oil with the kids in the car, or he's going to take them to go do some sort of slightly dangerous activity that I'm not going to take them to do. I think it's great, but I agree with Dee Dee. It's very much a parenting style. I'm also a very hands-off parent. I'm free-range is what I call my kids. They're outside in the woods all the time, and I'm like, "Oh, man, it's time to go. I wonder where the kids are." Kind of parent. And not all parents are like that. And so there's definitely boundaries and respect that have to happen, but I definitely think it's a fun thing for grandparents' grandfather specifically to introduce children to things that their family may not do. And by that, they're small, little, immediate family. My husband's an accountant. He's not going to be taking my kids to do wild activities that my dad might be willing to do. And so it's kind of fun to introduce a different person and a different perspective to living in life and danger, because most of the time, I think a lot of kids are not having any danger anyway. And it's definitely a part of growing up is to have a little bit of unknown and a little bit of fear and a little bit of mischief. I love that. Yeah, it's interesting because I've noticed just the kids in our neighborhood and around. I don't see a lot of kids climbing trees much anymore or doing some of those things where I feel like moms typically would close their eyes or yell at kids to get out of the tree or whatever. But when I was growing up, it wasn't uncommon that you'd show up at school and kids had busted fingers and maybe a busted forearm. And I'm not suggesting that grandfathers go do things that could result in that, especially not talking to moms. But I do like the idea of a little bit of adventure, a little bit of calculated risk taking to build the confidence because I look at some of those things as confidence builders, right? Hey, guess what? I climbed this huge tree in Grandpa, or it can be like, yeah, it was six feet off the ground. To the kid, that was like climbing a sequoia. It's huge. And it gives them a little boost of confidence. You could have the opposite where my husband is like, would let them climb like any amount, like anything right now. I think he has like zero risk, zero risk. And my father was quite opposite. And we would kind of make jokes that he wanted to like wrap the kids in bubble wrap because he'd be behind them like this all the time. And his hands up waiting for them to fall, whether it's the stairs. And I remember my aunt commenting once about going to the park with my husband and that she really needed to have nerves of steel because he just let them go places that of course she wasn't comfortable with and didn't know their abilities at the time. But I suppose it can go both ways. I think it's really positive. And of course, checking in with the parents, if we have parents that are last taller at a risk, it's just because that has been socialized into them through various sources, social media, media, etc. And I think that if you suggest something that's really adventurous and the parents aren't on board, you know, be willing to pivot as well and not take it as something that is like against you or your ideas, just, you know, it's their comfort level. And so I'd hate for you to suggest that, you know, you're gonna go climb trees and then that lead to something, lead to something, you know, like a negative experience. But yeah, certainly always check in with the parents because your lovely idea for their four year old might not be something that they're really into. Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. I think this summer was one of the first ones where we had our six year old grandson for the summer. And we decided to take him for a whitewater rafting trip. And the trip we had was on a river that was, it's, it's kind of subtitled, you know, mom approved. And so it was kind of a gentle river, but it has some rapids and stuff, but it checked with mom first. And then mom was was okay with it, especially when we explained, you know, hey, we got life jackets on. It's, you know, this, it's, you know, here's the link, you can even check out the river and all that. So it worked out well. But I think too, it can get disastrous when grandfathers just take the lead and go do something that, you know, results in a bad outcome. So yeah, appreciate everybody's advice on this. The next thing I want to kind of move over to is the thoughts that you all have in terms of fathers and father-in-laws and where we can help or not help when it comes with discipline with the kids. Because I know that's a big hot topic in grandparenting space. Do you, what do you do? How do you do it? Those sorts of things. And from like a mom's perspective, what do you all think about that? Yeah, Amanda. I will comment partly because I have children in the home right now. So I feel like it's very relevant. Our family uses a parenting method that we really like that determines how we discipline. It's very structured. It's very expected. So the children understand the expectation of discipline. My dad participates in our family meeting every week where we go over the schedule. We talk about any sort of problems that we've had in the house and any that we call them topics. Are there any topics for discussion? And he then is aware of any problems that the kids may be having or any issues, kind of behavioral type issues that we're having and discipline that we're having to give. And we have no problem with him disciplining our children as long as he disciplines them under the system that we use. And I, you know, obviously everyone doesn't use the same system that I use. But if my dad is going to give them a chore, that is, that is the system we use, right? So he can do the same chore every time he doesn't even have to be creative. He can say, Oh, this is what you did wrong. Your consequence is this, please go clean the bathroom, please go clean the toilet and then report back. And the system works really well in our family. And it's very easy to implement. So from our perspective, it's no problem if he is going to discipline children as long as he's disciplining them in the way that is expected. Because if he starts to kind of go his own way and do whatever he wants to do and discipline them in a different way, children are going to be surprised, parents are going to be surprised, and nobody's going to know what to do, right? Everyone's going to be confused, because that's just not how we do it in our family. So if they want to discipline, that's fine. If they want to wait, that's fine too. For for us to come home or us to initiate the discipline in our in our parenting system that we use, it's called Parenting a House United. And it's a really, really great philosophy. It's a it's a the woman that created it wrote a book about it also that's that's quite fabulous. But it makes parenting and discipline very simple. And it does kind of revolve around immediacy. So if there is a problem, you immediately deal with it. So I can see that there could be issues of parents not dealing with not dealing with it immediately. And then the parents kind of having to go backwards and give the consequence, which kind of doesn't work, but could still work potentially if you had to. If you had a grandparent that just wanted to be hands off in terms of discipline, you could probably make that work. Sure. And, Carrie, I'm going to ask you with the long distance grandparents that we have, when we go on site or the kids come to visit, it gets to be a lot different from the grandparent that lives in town or might even live with us. Yeah. And I mean, it is really, I think it is really different for long distance grandparents, because you are so a couple scenarios. One, you are getting that intensive grandparenting experience where you are living with them. So you are there for the PJs, the morning moods, the, you know, nighttime tantrums, the after school, unloading, we call it like an unloading of their emotional backpack where they have been so good at school all day, and then they come home and need to unload in a safe place. And so you're witnessing a lot of different things that if you were local and just kind of popping by for dinner that you might not see and or the grandchild could, you know, potentially keep their behavior together long enough while you're there for that dinner. So I think that a couple of things to keep in mind would be, you know, that when there are other people in your home, like as a parent, when we have other people visiting, this is not a good representation of what our life looks like on a day-to-day basis. We are letting them stay up a little bit later. They're excited. Sometimes there's other cousins around. So I think you have to keep that in mind that what you're seeing in these in these short but intense times is not really the day-to-day potentially even approach that your children are taking in their parenting. It couldn't look very different when it's, you know, Monday to Friday, school, routine, soccer practice, all the things. I mean, in our house, our house, it really is. And so I think it's so important just to withhold that judgment. And, you know, because there is really nothing that feels harder as a parent, you know, than to have kind of a comment made, you know, like something like, oh, you know, you got to nip that in the bud. And it's like you read 12 books and followed 25 Instagram influencers like you are, you are nipping and you are doing, you know, you're doing what you're supposed to do as a parent from your perspective or following like whatever parenting philosophy that you want. So I think parents not and especially for you grab buzz like not making the comments around the parent's choice of however they're going to parent things like food as well. Like my goodness, the number of comments that we hear about food and like finish your plate and people are very invested in your child's dinner for some reason when you are sitting down as a family together and you don't need to be because most parents are on it. And so it just, you know, if the kids like not eating their vegetables for that particular meal, it's all good. Like everything, everything's going to be okay. And if there's no need to comment on it. And now I completely forget what the original question was. I said you handed over to Laurie because like, you know, they're seeing what's going to say something. Oh, yeah, Lori. I just wanted to give my perspective. We lived near our granddaughter who's four years old and I do take care of her on a regular basis. But if there are things where she misbehaving or not listening, I never laid my hands on that kid. But I got to tell you, I did let my hands on my own kids, but I don't do nothing because she's being raised a different way. And I definitely respect that. I'm not a big in to tie mouths or anything like that. I mean, I have a household to run. I have things that I'm doing. And I just make sure that she's engaged too. So I'm trying to respect the way that they're that my son and his wife are raising her. And to Carrie's point about the whole dinner, my my son and Stanley, they eat at our house a lot. And my granddaughter, I think she's else because she just lives on sugar. And, you know, I sometimes ask about it. I'm the mother loggling. Well, she only had grandkids and egg whites today. How's that working out? But she says, hey, the pediatrician says that she's still growing. She's fine. And I'm like, okay, that wasn't the way it was when my kids are growing up. They, you know, you get what you get and you don't throw a fit. In fact, we were just talking about that tonight as I was quickly hard boiling some eggs for hers. I was talking to my my father-in-law who's actually visiting. Yeah, we just kind of keep our mouths closed during dinner time. So I appreciate Carrie's perspective that, yeah, when people are visiting or when other people are around, it's not usually the way it is that dinner time is a little more unusual. I appreciate that perspective, Carrie. Dee Dee, with the work that you do with new parents and new grandparents, I know discipline ends up being a big part of kind of that communication and also kind of a minefield for a lot of relationships. It absolutely can be. Too many grandparents have trouble feeding the role of authority, I think. And it can be really hard for them to watch their grandkids getting away with something that they would never let their kids get away with. It feels sometimes to grandparents like a message that they did things wrong if parents are doing things differently. And that's something that parents are not saying that is not at all what they're saying. They're just saying, hey, we're doing something different. And this is what we believe is the right way to raise our child and please be our partner in it. Don't try to undo what we're doing. So it's a lesson that grandparents would be wise to learn really early on. Just, you know, step back, enjoy the good parts, ignore the things that make you crazy, and your grandkids are going to grow up just fine, even if they don't grow up just the same way your kids did. Yeah, I was going to say, and I think being that support as well, I've had situations where my children are seeing this behaving. And it's helpful sometimes, actually, if grandparents just leave the premises. And that's happening. Because no one needs an audience when you're trying to deal with already a really challenging circumstance. And so being there and kind of staring, and I know it's uncomfortable. It's always uncomfortable to see any two humans no matter how old they are in conflict. And so I think also then remembering that, you know, this is your daughter, your daughter in law, your son, your son in law, and like they need a little bit of a hug probably after two, because they have dealt with a very difficult circumstance. And so even if they're keeping it together in the moment, it's really hard. And it's tough with small, you know, small kids. And I mean, I say that, but it's tough with teenagers, but all parents are dealing with it. And so just being there and not forgetting your role as the dad to your daughter, right? They still need you, like I still need you, your daughter's dealing, like I still need you to be my dad who's who's given me a hug after all this has gone sideways. That's the true carry. And I think one thing that grandparents can do in one of those situations and I know I've, you know, lived through this myself is, is, you know, the whole meltdowns happening, my daughter in law is dealing with it. And I take myself to another room partly because I can't stand the screaming. And I'll come back to her and say, I'm, I am so impressed with how you handle that because I could not have been that calm as a mom. And you are doing an amazing job. Giving parents that that little pat on the back that hug, as Carrie said, is so helpful because you're still a parent, you know, you may be a grandparent, but you're still a parent. And our kids never grow out of wanting our love and approval. They just don't. I think we also never grow out of not wanting to be judged. And so if you, you know, sometimes I think it's interesting when grandparents are, you know, kind of feel like, Oh my goodness, they thought I was judging them where they thought it's like, when they were teenagers, they didn't want to be judged. And then when they were young adults making decisions, they didn't want to be judged, right? Like, it's, it's kind of the same. They're still your child. They don't want to be judged. And like DDC, and they want your support. And they want to know, and they actually want your approval. And you don't have to agree or approve to provide that kind of encouragement and approval, essentially. I agree with that because it's, it's huge because those are such emotional situations. And especially when you have in-laws around that aren't always around. And you're seeing that, you know, it's a ton of pressure on that because I think we were talking about, you know, how many Instagrams do you follow about, you know, my kids perfect. And, you know, they get the proper portion of a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. And they get A's and all this stuff. And meanwhile, you got flour all over the kitchen and you got one kid that's poking the other kid in the ear with a fork and all this kind of craziness going on. Yeah, you would not want to have heard 20 minutes ago in my household before coming on to the head of the therapist. It was a little bit like that. One thing I want to pivot over a little bit is to talk about legacy a little bit with fathers and grandfathers. And from a mom's perspective, how should we be building a legacy with those kids? And it's not necessarily financial, but those relationships. And how would you see us building a meaningful relationship with the grandkids? You know, one thing that just occurs to me is that most moms have a relationship with their dad. Where there are things about him that you really cherish, right? I think that knowing that your children will also be able to know those things and have that same understanding of the kind of man that their grandfather is. I think that would be a very important thing for grandparents, grandfathers, to be able to share with their grandkids. Yeah, I think taking, you know, when we talk about legacy and when I'm talking about legacy with that, I grab parents and some of my membership programs, you know, I talk about your legacies right now. It is all the moments that you're sharing right now. Get in the videos, get in the photos, you know, take the videos, take the photos, all of those kinds of things. But I think that, you know, beyond that earlier in this conversation, I spoke about having those conversations with your, with your own daughter about some of the things that happen as you lose independence as an example or feeling like you're losing independence. I think that for, I think it's important, and this is probably top of mind because of my own father recently passing, that you have some kind of like linking object, it's called linking objects in the grief worlds. My dad left for my oldest, a ring of his that was really important and was very consequential in his grieving process. And you know, you can do things like that and set things like that aside, you know, anytime. And so maybe you've shared a special moment with your grandson or your granddaughter. And so it had, it's reflective in an object that you have in your home, you know, so that's one example. So let's put in that aside, talking it in a drawer, because we really don't know how long we have, and I don't mean to be the morbid person in the conversation, but you know, this is true. We really don't know how long we have. And so just in case, you know, have something in your top drawer, that is for your grandchildren, I think also letter writing. And maybe you're not comfortable letter writing, but I work at the Grabbahoo writes a letter to his grandchildren on their birthdays. And so it's kind of a milestone letter and just reflects upon the things that he's noticed about them, about a couple of things about what he was like at that age, which then draws, you know, from the past into the future. And so I think those are two really concrete things that you can do, having those kind of legacy letters, milestone things that you write to them, and then some of the linking objects. I'll contribute, Greg, if that's okay. Yeah, Harry, those were fabulous ideas and fabulous things that I think are very important that parents, grandparents, grandfathers specifically sharing with their grandchildren. And I was thinking more specifically for legacy, like individual experiences with each child. So Greg, when you were speaking of your grandson going whitewater rafting, like the first time, that's a, an experience that he's probably going to remember. Now he's sick, so maybe not, but maybe you need to repeat that a few more times, right? And then it becomes a legacy. Oh, this is what I do with grandpa. And my, my children have benefited from that. My children have gone whitewater rafting with Greg and Karen. And it has been so beneficial for them. They love it. They absolutely love it because it's not something that we do as a family. So even though Greg is not their grandfather, he's still playing that role. And I think sometimes you may not have a grandfather to play that role, but you may have a gentleman at church or a guy, a neighbor, a friend down the street, somebody that can play that role in their lives and share experiences with them that they can continue to remember. And, you know, there's just so many examples of ways to do that. But it is all very, very individual, right? It's very specific to what that grandfather does and loves. And then he's able to share those things with his children. And I don't know if you want a short tangent, Greg. Sure. But you know, and everyone else probably doesn't on this call, my dad has gone to Burning Man for 11, 12 years. It's been a huge part of his life. He was a mayor of a camp. It's a huge thing that he participated in for years and years and years. And this year, he was able to bring our whole family there. And now my kids have this very special memory with grandpa. And like, it's wild and crazy. And there's some things that they're like, Oh, and then other things that grandpa's like, Oh, but it's an experience that they had with grandpa that they're never going to forget. And that's where when you think when you say legacy, I think that's what it is, is the grandfathers coming to each individual child and giving them an experience to remember that man with a man to that, you know, he was sharing something really important to him, right? So, you know, going back to what what I was saying, it's, it's sharing those parts of you with your grandchildren that they might not know. Correct. And you have to make that effort, right? Right. They're not going to know. And just because I know that about him, or you know that about, you know, whatever about your father, if he doesn't share that with them, then they're never going to get to know it. I share something that my father-in-law is doing. One of his legacies is he's a great storyteller. He's a professional horseman. And he has a lot of great stories that way. And so, I helped him this past December create a YouTube channel. And he doesn't have a lot of subscribers. It's mostly with grandkids. It has 43 subscribers, but he is going through and sharing these stories that we've all heard around the dinner table, right? For years, I've been in this family now for 35 years. But these are some of the stories that my kids have never heard before, all specific horse training stories, or it's some sort of, you know, exciting thing that happened to him. And we cherish those because we're not always going to have him. He's going to be 82 this week week. And this is, thanks YouTube for carrying some of our family memories for us. Oh, that's awesome. And Lori, what's the name of the channel or the program? It's called The Horse and Eye. Okay, The Horse and Eye. So now maybe have 20, just twice as many subscribers as possible. Oh, that's awesome. Folks, this has been a great conversation. And I've really appreciated all the information that you have provided. Is there anything else around what moms need from fathers, father-in-laws, in terms of that relationship, or even us as grandfathers? That I haven't asked or brought up that you would like to share before we go. Wow, I asked all the good questions. Or you just got all the good answers. Or I got all the good answers exactly, exactly. Folks, I want to run around as we close this out and give everybody a chance to let folks know where they can find you if they wanted to try to connect with you, or the best way to follow your programs if you've got programs. Lori, we'll start with you and we'll kind of work our way around. Well, I didn't start off by what I do professionally because I really was in grandma mode here all day long, actually, and write it to the podcast. But I'm a professional wardrobe consultant. I've been in the business for over 20 years. I started my business in Boston and I had clients all over the nation. And my website is called Fashion with Flair. And I'm changing lives one closet at a time. Awesome. And yeah, she got me out of cargo shorts as formal wear, so a bit of a miracle worker there. Yeah, we should tell all the grandpas that if you're looking for a great gift, not as a beautiful gift for any woman. I've had it before and it's pretty life-changing, especially after having children because bodies change just a tiny bit. And so it's really useful to have that kind of consultation. So there's a plug for Lori. Thank you. Thank you, Jerry. Dee Dee, how about you? Where can folks get connected with you in more than grand? They can go to my website morethangrand.com and there are just all sorts of resources for new grandparents and ways to stay in touch with your grandchildren. There are a couple of articles on my blog about getting to know your daughter-in-law. So that might be a good thing to look for. Oh, that's awesome. And then, Carrie, as we wrap things up, you want to talk about the long distance grandparent? Sure. I mean, people can go to my website. It's that long distance grandparent.com. I have a couple of, I have a membership program called the Long distance grandparent society. We have grandmas and grandpas who are all working together to stay connected to their grandchildren. I've also just released something called the LDG because Long distance grandparent is a mouthful to say every single time. So we called the LDG Ideas Club. It's really a digital subscription box. And so for any grandpas that really want to step up and start being the one to send mail to kind of lead the way on some of these video chats, that's what I give you every single month. I give you mail to send that helps you get to know your grandchildren, your grandchildren get to know you. And idea is just fun games, conversation starters, all kinds of things. And it's all research-backed. That's where I started from. But I have a blog, tons of ideas. You can sign up for my email newsletter. And yes, people do email. Get emails all the time from grandparents, long distance grandparents, grandpas as well. I'm looking for help because I think the grandparents today really do want to be intentional in their role. And I really want to be part of supporting the four grandpas and grandmas. Folks, we're going to put links to everybody's web pages and everything into the show notes. So if you're out walking the dog on the treadmill, whatnot, you can just go to the cool grandpa podcast and look for this episode and everything's going to be right there for you and make it super easy. So thank you everybody for being a part of this second cracker barrel and panel discussion. I've learned a lot and I really appreciate everybody's insight and willingness to help us out. Help grandpas learn a little bit more about how to be even cooler. So thank you so much. I enjoyed this conversation. It was fun getting everybody together. And for some folks, they met each other for the first time on this call. For some of us, we've known each other for years at this point. I really was touched and it really made a lot of sense to me. And I, you know, I get it. This is kind of a common sense, no duffing. But what struck me was really the idea of for father-in-laws, especially, to really get to know our daughter-in-laws and our son-in-laws as individuals and to build those relationships separate from knowing them as my son's wife or my daughter's husband or however the relationships are working. And I think to do that, we have to be intentional as fathers and father-in-laws to go spend some quality time with them. Take them out for a meal just one-on-one. Get to know who their favorite baseball team is or who their favorite basketball player is. What musical instrument do they play in high school? What did they enjoy about, you know, whatever it is, their holiday traditions? I know one of the things I've enjoyed learning about is my daughter-in-laws and what their families would do for Thanksgiving and Christmas and New Year's and these different holidays. So that's really been a connection point. And I hope that if you haven't taken the time to really get to know your son-in-laws and your daughter-in-laws, that you take this opportunity and this prompting to go out and schedule some time. Maybe it's even phone calls or emails. Maybe you get to a point where you can share some memes back and forth or if you're like in the south and into college football, you do a little trash talking about your college football teams. That's always a good way to build that rapport, build that relationship so that you can be a trusted individual with them and that they can feel comfortable coming to you asking for your help and your guidance because it doesn't happen overnight. We went through and we had a number of books, a number of resources that were mentioned and I'll put those links into the show notes. So again, it'll be easy to find. You can just go to cool-grandpa.us and be sure to like and subscribe if you're watching this on YouTube or if you're listening to this on a podcast, be sure to subscribe to the cool grandpa podcast because there's a ton of information in the catalog at this point as well as future conversations that are coming out that will help you whether you're a grandfather or whether you're just somebody that really wants to build relationships within your family and your friends. So hey cool kids, until next time, remember to stay cool. Thank you for listening to the cool grandpa podcast. If you've enjoyed this episode, please do me a favor and share it with a friend. That's the best way you can help us to expand our community as well as get the news out about how valuable grandpas are in the lives of those kids. If you'd like to leave me a comment or shoot me a potential topic for this podcast, please go to www.cool-grandpa.us. Look for the comments tab, fill it out, hit submit, it's as easy as that. Until next time, remember to stay cool.
